Honda Crosstourer

Agothaclypse

Agothaclypse

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So, Ive been thinking about a new bike. Its not that Im unhappy with my trusty 2001, 1150GS, single spark, Non servo ABS machine, but it is incredibly heavy & the spares prices are exhorbitant & the fuel ecconmy not up to that of many modern bikes. I may still keep it though & do a full on restoration, as I think its a classic model. But I do have an itch for a new steed & have been floundering until now.
Was first thinking F800GS, good fuel econnomy, lighter & with good off-road ability. However, chain drive, poor build quality from BMW recently & still got the problem of expensive spares. Then thought Triumph Tiger 800, beuatiful looks, brithish marque & off-road capability. But V-poor fuel consumption, chain drive & reliability issues. Thought about the new watercooled 1250 GS or the new Tenere adventure but dissmised them for one or another reason.
By chance came accross an ad for Hondas new crosstourer.
Bit ugly, but ticks many other boxes of my needs. Watercooled, maint free shaft drive, big enough to tour but not too heavy to pick up. Spoked wheels & longish supension travel to give the kind of minimal off-road ability I need (basicly, roughish public roads). Hondas uber reliability & fuel consumption around the 80 mpg mark. I also like the dual clutch option & the traction control as standard.
Wondering what you folks think.

Link to site here:-
http://www.hondamc2012.com/bikes/concept-v4x-2/


Spyder.
 
I'm not sure where your figure of 80 mpg comes from but if you replace that with 40 - 45 mpg, I suspect you'll be closer to the mark.
 
The forthcoming TC700 (i think that's what its called) twin is the one supposed to achieve 75+MPG not the Crossdresser lump.
This also weighs arouind 260Kg.Also,compare service costs and intervals.Hondas used to be every 4K miles;dont know if they've improved that.
As for the 1150,there are plenty of 2nd hand spares around,reasonably priced service items and the fuel consumption should be around 50MPG.
 
Schtum said:
I'm not sure where your figure of 80 mpg comes from but if you replace that with 40 - 45 mpg, I suspect you'll be closer to the mark.
Click to expand...

Ooops, I stand corrected. I had read the stated fel ecconomy as 16.3 miles per litre, when in fact it is 16.3 kilometres per litre. As you quite rightly state, this gives a consumption figure of about 45mpg.
Still like though, but not as convinced now.
Thanks for pointing out my error.

Kind regards
Paul
 
Also remember to take account of depreciation. You need to buy a lot of parts/fuel to equal the depreciation of a new bike over the first 4-5 years.
 
What makes you think Honda spares are any cheaper than BMW ones?

Having owned various bikes in the past, I think my 1150 is the cheapest bike that I've had to maintain, I do all my own servicing etc... it's dead easy :thumb2
 
I too think the Honda may be a decent replacement for my 1200GS.

Servicing over time works out quite similar, it depends on how many miles per year you do, 8k per year would show the Honda cheaper, bang on 6k per year on a GS avoiding the split schedules is about the same (as the Honda is 8k or every year)

Seeing as the Honda is a V4 you would expect higher costs and I don't mind paying the price for this, an air cooled twin with such easy access really should be much cheaper to service than the Honda with its complex layout, 24 valves (using shims) coolant to change etc.

I rode the VFR 1200 and the engine is really pretty good, assuming they have provided extra midrange and not just chopped 40BHP off the top I would imagine it to be a stonking motor for a road biased adventure bike.

I have no worries about reliability with the Honda and it does not fill me with dread like any new BMW, not wanting to go over the many common faults that the 1200's have (and still do suffer from) but basically I am nervous about my BMW with 15k on it, whereas I could happily buy a Honda (or the Tenere) and ride 10k per year for years on end with no worries of exploding drive train systems etc.

So far the competition have ruled themselves out, and I can see Honda doing the same, building a "technically" excellent bike that misses out by not providing some of the simple joys of the BMW.

The Yamaha is very nice, but the massive power restrictions at low rpm's in lower gears puts me off, the £400 heated grips which look no better than other afterthought (I mean aftermarket) items is a joke, the OEM luggage is tiny (Smaller than the smallest GS offerings) and the veey slow handling is annoying after the GS' precision steering - so to sort the power and handling will set me back £1500 on day one.

I have looked at the Honda specs and already noticed the tank is only 21L, I expect at French motorway speeds (85 MPH) it will probably beat the GS which IMO is awful at these speeds (40MPG) but once in the mountains / on back roads etc (where these bikes are best) I can't see the V4 being as frugal as the GS (where it is brilliant at returning 50+ MPG) so overall the average tank range will at best match the GS, and obviously is nowhere near the Adventure in this regard.

The 29L panniers are even smaller than the Tenere, and at a combined 58L about 20% smaller than Vario's, and a fraction of the Adventures capacity.

The geometery looks as sluggish as the Yamaha, and one of the things I love about the standard GS is the light and agile handling - which brings me to weight, the Honda is another behemoth - although so is the Yamaha and that manages to feel a lot lighter. I certainly want a test ride to see how the Honda compares.

I also doubt the Honda will beat the GS in the little details, such as integrated heated grip / computer buttons on the bars and space to mount Sat-Nav units, power outlets etc.

I have almost given up on finding a bike as good as the GS and if it were not for shite reliability and expensive servicing I would not even bother to ride the Honda, but I don't trust BMW to bring out a new model that is reliable, and even upgrading to a twin-cam involves known reliability issues / expensive servicing / essential need to pay for extended warranty every year etc. so I will have to choose another bike and it will either be this Honda or the Yamaha Tenere.

The Honda will need to be good out of the crate, the pricing is attractive (about standard GS money) but the Yamaha's are available used for very good money (leaving plenty of spare wonga to get the ECU reflashed, luggage fitted and a fully adjustable shock bunged on)
 
Rasher said:
an air cooled twin with such easy access really should be much cheaper to service than the Honda with its complex layout, 24 valves (using shims) coolant to change etc.
Click to expand...

Continuing the trend for poor arithmetic in this thread - your V4 seems to have acquired an extra 8 valves from somewhere. :blast
 
Don't forget the new Triumph 1200 Explorer ... Lots of BMW "extras" as standard and shaft drive.
 
Schtum said:
Continuing the trend for poor arithmetic in this thread - your V4 seems to have acquired an extra 8 valves from somewhere. :blast
Click to expand...

:blast What a twat

I did however count just a single sided swingarm on the Honda as well, I know they have done this with chain drive bikes before but is this a first with shaft (I know the VFR has the same arrangement)

Still unsure if the whole concept is any good as BMW have been unable to get them to last much longer than a chain after 8 years of trying.
 
Rasher said:
The Yamaha is very nice, but the massive power restrictions at low rpm's in lower gears puts me off, the £400 heated grips which look no better than other afterthought (I mean aftermarket) items is a joke, the OEM luggage is tiny (Smaller than the smallest GS offerings) and the veey slow handling is annoying after the GS' precision steering - so to sort the power and handling will set me back £1500 on day one.
Click to expand...

For some reason my Super Tenere came with the rear suspension wound down very low and steering was very sluggish as a result. Same on the two demo bikes I tried.

A minute's twiddling with the adjuster wound it up again and the steering is far more agile as a result.
 
Schtum said:
Continuing the trend for poor arithmetic in this thread.... :blast
Click to expand...

And for the next trick...

Rasher said:
Still unsure if the whole concept is any good as BMW have been unable to get them to last much longer than a chain after 8 years of trying.
Click to expand...

When did the first monolever airheads see the light of showrooms? 1980? There seems to be an arithmetical malfunction:D
 
Not just the maths that is lacking

Yup , my 1992 paralever K1 didnt miss a beat in 8 years use and my 2002 1150GS paralever set up only needed £70s worth of maintenance (excluding regular oil changes ) in 6 years and 50k miles too!

:thumb
 
I did not realise the single siders went back so far.

So is it just the 1200's that have had major problems?

Not wanting to start another FD thread, but I thought the single sided arrangement was commonly suspected of being a big layer in the 1200 FD failures, and Yamaha avoided a single sider as they believe the twin sided arm arrangement to be more durable.

Lets hope Honda have copied one of the more reliable designs!
 
Rasher said:
I did not realise the single siders went back so far.

So is it just the 1200's that have had major problems?

Not wanting to start another FD thread, but I thought the single sided arrangement was commonly suspected of being a big layer in the 1200 FD failures, and Yamaha avoided a single sider as they believe the twin sided arm arrangement to be more durable.

Lets hope Honda have copied one of the more reliable designs!
Click to expand...


honda had single sided swing arms on the RC30 in 1987 and on the VFR750 in 1990, so they are not new to it.
 
Rasher said:
I did not realise the single siders went back so far.

So is it just the 1200's that have had major problems?

Not wanting to start another FD thread, but I thought the single sided arrangement was commonly suspected of being a big layer in the 1200 FD failures, and Yamaha avoided a single sider as they believe the twin sided arm arrangement to be more durable.

Lets hope Honda have copied one of the more reliable designs!
Click to expand...

You don't know much, but spout like you do

Honda aren't new to it, nor are Ducati & BMW have been using single sided swingarms since 1980

Maybe you should quit the sweeping generalisations until you know what you are talking about
 
Rasher said:
I too think the Honda may be a decent replacement for my 1200GS.

Servicing over time works out quite similar, it depends on how many miles per year you do, 8k per year would show the Honda cheaper, bang on 6k per year on a GS avoiding the split schedules is about the same (as the Honda is 8k or every year)

Seeing as the Honda is a V4 you would expect higher costs and I don't mind paying the price for this, an air cooled twin with such easy access really should be much cheaper to service than the Honda with its complex layout, 24 valves (using shims) coolant to change etc.

I rode the VFR 1200 and the engine is really pretty good, assuming they have provided extra midrange and not just chopped 40BHP off the top I would imagine it to be a stonking motor for a road biased adventure bike.

I have no worries about reliability with the Honda and it does not fill me with dread like any new BMW, not wanting to go over the many common faults that the 1200's have (and still do suffer from) but basically I am nervous about my BMW with 15k on it, whereas I could happily buy a Honda (or the Tenere) and ride 10k per year for years on end with no worries of exploding drive train systems etc.

So far the competition have ruled themselves out, and I can see Honda doing the same, building a "technically" excellent bike that misses out by not providing some of the simple joys of the BMW.

The Yamaha is very nice, but the massive power restrictions at low rpm's in lower gears puts me off, the £400 heated grips which look no better than other afterthought (I mean aftermarket) items is a joke, the OEM luggage is tiny (Smaller than the smallest GS offerings) and the veey slow handling is annoying after the GS' precision steering - so to sort the power and handling will set me back £1500 on day one.

I have looked at the Honda specs and already noticed the tank is only 21L, I expect at French motorway speeds (85 MPH) it will probably beat the GS which IMO is awful at these speeds (40MPG) but once in the mountains / on back roads etc (where these bikes are best) I can't see the V4 being as frugal as the GS (where it is brilliant at returning 50+ MPG) so overall the average tank range will at best match the GS, and obviously is nowhere near the Adventure in this regard.

The 29L panniers are even smaller than the Tenere, and at a combined 58L about 20% smaller than Vario's, and a fraction of the Adventures capacity.

The geometery looks as sluggish as the Yamaha, and one of the things I love about the standard GS is the light and agile handling - which brings me to weight, the Honda is another behemoth - although so is the Yamaha and that manages to feel a lot lighter. I certainly want a test ride to see how the Honda compares.

I also doubt the Honda will beat the GS in the little details, such as integrated heated grip / computer buttons on the bars and space to mount Sat-Nav units, power outlets etc.

I have almost given up on finding a bike as good as the GS and if it were not for shite reliability and expensive servicing I would not even bother to ride the Honda, but I don't trust BMW to bring out a new model that is reliable, and even upgrading to a twin-cam involves known reliability issues / expensive servicing / essential need to pay for extended warranty every year etc. so I will have to choose another bike and it will either be this Honda or the Yamaha Tenere.

The Honda will need to be good out of the crate, the pricing is attractive (about standard GS money) but the Yamaha's are available used for very good money (leaving plenty of spare wonga to get the ECU reflashed, luggage fitted and a fully adjustable shock bunged on)
Click to expand...

Yawn. :Motomartin
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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