Is this normal !

I'm not sure sales figures can be taken as a measure of the product's quality. A lot of folk were probably mesmerised by early magazine reviews and rushed out to buy a bike hailed as a fantastic piece of equipment.
Click to expand...

I am sure you are right, and some of us waited and talked to owners and went into buying a WC with our eyes wide open. Of the three bikes I might have chosen, none were perfectly fault free, KTM 1190 has issues, as does the Ducati MS1200 if you read the forums. Both have owners who live with the bad bits to enjoy the good bits just as I am doing with the WC.

Which is better of the twin cam or WC probably depends on what roads you like riding, at higher speeds the WC is a real hoot, quick, drama free, very controlled and involving. On back roads the TC maybe has the edge. The ESA suspension is brilliant, as is the engine.

I would be angry if I had a crappy gearbox, but I don't. It is not a great gearbox, but it does what it is meant to, changes gear. BMW should sort out the issues some owners have, but it would be a mistake to dismiss the WC as the worst bike BMW have made. Time will tell if it is the best bike I have owned, but for now it is a contender.
 
Lets get it right you could stick a bmw badge on a dog turd and half the current gs/gsa owners in the uk would buy it.....especially if it was the newest model of dog turd and mcn gave it a good review
 
johnfoxllb said:
Reading the posts of a few unhappy people on the Internet is a jolly good way of avoiding a serious waste of money.

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1004037&highlight=Problems
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I notice that you are avoiding the questions.

Reading a few posts on Internet forums is about as reliable as reading the Daily Mail - it might prompt an intelligent person to actually find out the facts with proper research, while the others just believe what they read because it reinforces their own predjudices.
 
Neil W said:
Lets get it right you could stick a bmw badge on a dog turd and half the current gs/gsa owners in the uk would buy it.....especially if it was the newest model of dog turd and mcn gave it a good review
Click to expand...

Maybe, but what about the other half of us who have had bikes of all brands, sizes and types before owning a BMW. How do they fool us?
 
johnfoxllb said:
I'm not sure sales figures can be taken as a measure of the product's quality. A lot of folk were probably mesmerised by early magazine reviews and rushed out to buy a bike hailed as a fantastic piece of equipment. I rushed out and test rode one, I was completely underwhelmed by the gearbox and the quality of the switchgear. I got back on my TC and resolved that the WC was not as well sorted as its predecessor.

I can understand the anger and rage in those that have purchased an underdeveloped, unreliable product and are now left to champion it's cause. Those that still have £15k of hard earned cash in their bank account I suspect will be extremely wary of putting it down on one of these things.

There's no doubt that when a WC is running, it runs very well, exhibiting fine power and handling characteristics. It's a different matter when it's sat in dealership stripped back to the frame awaiting an engine or gearbox (or both).
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So, you took one of the early models out, decided it was underdeveloped, and unreliable, all after a short test ride, and have become an expert on the bike?:rolleyes:

For somebody that spends so much time trolling this section, you really do spout a load of nonsense.
 
The Nutty GSER said:
So, you took one of the early models out, decided it was underdeveloped, and unreliable, all after a short test ride, and have become an expert on the bike?:rolleyes:

For somebody that spends so much time trolling this section, you really do spout a load of nonsense.
Click to expand...

I didn't make any reliability claims after a test ride.

The reliability and quality claims have come from the members of this and other forums.

The bike is poorly built and unreliable. It is not "unstoppable" and it is not round the world capable. It's an out of warranty time bomb
 
johnfoxllb said:
I didn't make any reliability claims after a test ride.

The reliability and quality claims have come from the members of this and other forums.

The bike is poorly built and unreliable. It is not "unstoppable" and it is not round the world capable. It's an out of warranty time bomb
Click to expand...

I'm not sure why I, and others, keep rising to your bait, but you clearly haven't got a clue what you're talking about.
 
johnfoxllb said:
I didn't make any reliability claims after a test ride.

The reliability and quality claims have come from the members of this and other forums.

The bike is poorly built and unreliable. It is not "unstoppable" and it is not round the world capable. It's an out of warranty time bomb
Click to expand...

I like mine! Done 12,000 miles with no problems, gear box is slick, engine is a peach and it's one of the best handling bikes I've owned in nearly 30 years of riding on the road and the track.

Thanks for your advice though and I'll bear it in mind!

...and to Dave (aka Ding Dong), hope you get your bike sorted fella. It's shit when things aren't right, no matter what make or model you own.
 
There are two types of faults here.

Object faults such as the cam chain breaking or the switchgear failing.

Subjective faults such as my clutch seems to drag, it's noisy selecting 1st from neutral or my suspension seems stiff.

Owners that are happy with their bikes will tend to dismiss the subjective complaints from others as just whinging.

To turn a subjective fault into an objective fault you need the measure it.

For instance if you think your clutch drags more than it should then measure the force required to turn the wheel in first gear with the clutch pulled in like I did in a previous post and compare the results with another bike.
 
johnfoxllb said:
......... I got back on my TC and resolved that the WC was not as well sorted as its predecessor. .......
Click to expand...

It's amusing to see comments such as these. I seem to remember similar things being said about the R1200GS when it was first launched, which were repeated when the 2008 model came out, and again when the TC arrived. It's the WC turn now. At least it's taken the flack of the previous model. :rolleyes:

Bob
 
GS_or_bust said:
T

For instance if you think your clutch drags more than it should then measure the force required to turn the wheel in first gear with the clutch pulled in like I did in a previous post and compare the results with another bike.
Click to expand...

The smallest amount of drag will cause a clunk, there's not enough on my bike to cause it to travel when its off the centre stand ie on its own weight, but it shows all the elements of drag, starting in gear with the clutch lever in you feel it drag forward slightly, rotating of the wheel on the centre stand with the clutch in etc etc, oil should act as coolant and in this case it aint working so when it gets hot i think it is making the plates stick very slightly, not disengaging fully, i dont think BMW have a fix, the drag is marginal, within tolerance I'm sure thats what they would state, the gearbox is perfect its the clutch pack causing it to clunk, every bike is different tho.

Its a great bike, I'm loathed to part with it, i just wish the gearbox was better i really do, because its this that truly spoils riding the bike.
 
Dave, whilst my gearbox and clutch was pretty good, it was a pig in town some days, and like you say, showed all the symptoms of hot oil and sticking clutch plates. For the most part, my bike was a toy and I'm pretty rural, so most of my riding was hooning A and B roads. For that, I could live with the gear box 'cos it never got that hot.
I remember one day in the Alps though, with her indoors and all the luggage, where we were climbing on a particularly hair pinny road. Not sure why (heat again I guess) but every third to second to the occasional first for a hairpin was like a church door bolt during a funeral :) feck me it was bad.
And yet most days it would be absolutely fine.
All very strange ....
If I was looking for a commuting bike in to and around London, the wc would not even make my top 20!
 
"If I was looking for a commuting bike in to and around London, the wc would not even make my top 20!"

Yes, you might get the clocks nicked !
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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