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Thread: Ardennes, Vosges, Black Forest, Stelvio, Italian Lakes

  1. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasher View Post
    I think both the Susten and and Grimsel are better starting from the Northern end of the Grimsell, and Furka is OK either way.

    Fluella is great but probably hard to work in.

    You could spend several days in the Ardennes, Black Forest, Vosges, Andermatt and Stelvio areas and turn this into a 3 week trip.
    Or maybe even a month trip

    The more I read stuff about passes the more I'd like to visit. I have to plan the itinerary properly and bring the list down to maximum 5 or 6. Will have to do my homework

    What about the Black Forest? How many places (days) do you think it is worth visiting? I know the area is very vast and I wanted to spend no more than 1 night (2 days) over there. Is it possible?

  2. #34
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    Anything is possible.

    The Black Forest is a similar size to Wales and crisscrossed with nice roads, but you can take in some of the best roads in a single day, and 2-3 days would get you covering a large chunk of the area with time ot stop off and poke around here and there, or stretch it beyond a week with more visiting of towns and other attractions.

    I would say don't hang around there too long on the way to the Alps if you do not have a lot of time to spare as the Black Forest, nice though it is, does not compare to the Alps with regard to roads and scenery.

    The B500 is the most famous road, it stretches pretty much the length of the region but when people talk about riding the B500 they mean the 25-30 mile section running from Baden Baden in a southerly direction so maybe try and squeeze that in, not far from the bottom of that is Triberg which is a pretty little town with a million clock shops and some waterfalls you can poke around (you have to pay to get in) I would suggest just stopping for Coffee or Lunch.

    If you stop over for 2 nights you could put together a looping ride covering a fair proportion of the region - just look for twisty roads on the map, but with your rather short trip time I would advise just taking in what you can on your ride to the Alps

  3. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasher View Post
    Anything is possible.

    The Black Forest is a similar size to Wales and crisscrossed with nice roads, but you can take in some of the best roads in a single day, and 2-3 days would get you covering a large chunk of the area with time ot stop off and poke around here and there, or stretch it beyond a week with more visiting of towns and other attractions.

    I would say don't hang around there too long on the way to the Alps if you do not have a lot of time to spare as the Black Forest, nice though it is, does not compare to the Alps with regard to roads and scenery.

    The B500 is the most famous road, it stretches pretty much the length of the region but when people talk about riding the B500 they mean the 25-30 mile section running from Baden Baden in a southerly direction so maybe try and squeeze that in, not far from the bottom of that is Triberg which is a pretty little town with a million clock shops and some waterfalls you can poke around (you have to pay to get in) I would suggest just stopping for Coffee or Lunch.

    If you stop over for 2 nights you could put together a looping ride covering a fair proportion of the region - just look for twisty roads on the map, but with your rather short trip time I would advise just taking in what you can on your ride to the Alps
    Thanks for the advice Rasher!

    I can extend the trip to 8 days if needed. My only concern is that the later I get to the Alps the more chances the weather is not good. I'm planning to leave London on the 31st of August so by the time I get there it will already be the September.

  4. #36
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    Early September is a great time, I have been sat on a pile of Snow at the top of the Stelvio during the first week in August, the Alps are never entirely predictable.

    Early October you might be pushing your luck, but I think your going at a great time as the heat is unlikely to be stupidly hot, just take into account the sun will be going down a bit earlier than mid summer so by late afternoon it will be in your eyes.

    If I had an extra day to spare I would stop for 2 nights somewhere in the Alps, if you say roughly where you already plan to stop in the Alps I am sure many folk here can offer some good routes, plenty of options if stopping off near the Stelvio that could include the Stelvio and a few much better passes.

    If you want a good value Black Forest stop off Pension Williams is good, just off the B500 about 25 miles south of Baden (in a quiet little village) if you prefer a town I would suggest Triberg.

  5. #37
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    A quick look at a map, if you are not insistent on Lake Garda you could stop around St Moritz for two nights and loop over the Stelvio, Fluella and Albula, or instead of stopping for two nights on one place just wiggle around a bit more and make it an 8 day journey if you don't mind moving on each day - which judging by the original plan of 6 stops in a 7 day trip you obviously do not.

  6. #38
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    Hey Rasher, many thanks for your advice. I was thinking to stop in Baden Baden but Pension Williams seems to be a good alternative. I'll definitely take it into account.

    With regard to the weather, I hope it is going to be fine. I've never had bad surprises when travelling at the beginning of September. Fingers crossed and rain gears always in the panniers

    Regarding the itinerary, I've been trying to sort it out. This is how far I've gone:
    https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?m...5958251969&z=6
    I hope the link above works

    I could add a couple of days/nights to the trip and I'm just trying to figure out at what point and where to stop. Any suggestion?



    Cheers
    Last edited by Wapping; 06-06-17 at 17:17. Reason: Cut out bit about findinding tyres in London W8 - Richard

  7. #39
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    I have copied your tyre request into the SE section.

    http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthr...don-where-from

  8. #40
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    Get a copy of the book "Motorcycle Journeys through the Alps and Beyond" this has about 70 trips in the Alps, have a look at the trips in the areas you will be passing through and see if any catch your eye and would be worth stopping over for

    The passes covered in the book routes number in excess of 300 - www.cyclingcols.com shows about 1,000 Alpine passes....

    ...so asking people if there are any roads to ride or where to stop for an extra day could result in hundreds of suggestions. All of the routes in the book would take you about a months solid riding, even narrowing it down to routes in the book that you will be going near would probably amount you needing an extra couple of weeks.

    Just pick a spot or two for an extra days riding around, you cannot go too far wrong as there are not really any bad roads in the Alps, just some are better than others - but they are all vastly superior to the roads of the UK.

  9. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wapping View Post
    I have copied your tyre request into the SE section.

    http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthr...don-where-from
    Thanks Wapping!

  10. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasher View Post
    Get a copy of the book "Motorcycle Journeys through the Alps and Beyond" this has about 70 trips in the Alps, have a look at the trips in the areas you will be passing through and see if any catch your eye and would be worth stopping over for

    The passes covered in the book routes number in excess of 300 - www.cyclingcols.com shows about 1,000 Alpine passes....

    ...so asking people if there are any roads to ride or where to stop for an extra day could result in hundreds of suggestions. All of the routes in the book would take you about a months solid riding, even narrowing it down to routes in the book that you will be going near would probably amount you needing an extra couple of weeks.

    Just pick a spot or two for an extra days riding around, you cannot go too far wrong as there are not really any bad roads in the Alps, just some are better than others - but they are all vastly superior to the roads of the UK.
    Good stuff. Thanks for the advice on the book and for the link

  11. #43
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    Morning All,

    I seem to have come to a conclusion in terms of the itinerary for my trip to Italy. I wanted to share it with you and see whether I got the whole thing right, especially when it comes to the Alps Passes.

    The third day we'll be leaving Kloten (north of Zurich, where I'll pay a friend a visit) in direction of the Susten Pass, which we'll take from Wassen. Once done the Susten we'll do the Grimsel and the Furka Pass, in this order. We'll be spending the night of the fourth day in Chur and the day after we'll do the Timmelsjoch and sleep at the bottom of the Stelvio Pass. From there, the morning after we'll do the Stelvio and head south to the Lake of Como through the Splugen Pass.

    What do you guys think?

  12. #44
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    Last day requires a choice of Julier pass or Albula pass... Personally I'd favour the Julier but see what other people think.

    (Actually, I'd get ambitious with the mileage and do both, along with the Fluellapass - but that would be an extremely long day)

  13. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon W View Post
    Last day requires a choice of Julier pass or Albula pass... Personally I'd favour the Julier but see what other people think.

    (Actually, I'd get ambitious with the mileage and do both, along with the Fluellapass - but that would be an extremely long day)
    Hey Simon,

    Thanks for your comment.

    We are aiming to get to Lake of Como no later than mid afternoon. Is not the Stelvio plus the Splugen enough? In this very thread I was advised to do the Splugen Pass from north to south, which is what I'll be doing. Someone suggested the Fluella Pass being really good but hard to access. Is that true? And nobody ever mentioned the choice about the Albula or Julier. What is it?

    This is the route I was thinking to do
    Stelvio to Como thru Splugen

    Do you suggest to do either the Albulla or Julier instead?

    Fluella is way too long, unfortunately.

  14. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gab View Post
    The third day we'll be leaving Kloten (north of Zurich, where I'll pay a friend a visit) in direction of the Susten Pass, which we'll take from Wassen. Once done the Susten we'll do the Grimsel and the Furka Pass, in this order.
    If you mean you will go over the Susten pass you will not be able to do Grimsel then Furka in that order without going back over the Susten the other way again.

    Julier Vs Albula is a tough choice, the Julier is faster and more flowing with better "sporting" bends and more traffic, the Albula is more scenic and rugged with less traffic, I am sure you know your own preferences - I like both for their respective good points.

    The Fluella is sort of half way between the two being more rugged than the Julier and less bumpy than the Albula - many rate it as one of the best passes in the Alps, this year we rode all of them and I think I enjoyed both the Albula and Fluella more this time.

    Whatever route you take will be excellent.

  15. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasher View Post
    If you mean you will go over the Susten pass you will not be able to do Grimsel then Furka in that order without going back over the Susten the other way again.

    Julier Vs Albula is a tough choice, the Julier is faster and more flowing with better "sporting" bends and more traffic, the Albula is more scenic and rugged with less traffic, I am sure you know your own preferences - I like both for their respective good points.

    The Fluella is sort of half way between the two being more rugged than the Julier and less bumpy than the Albula - many rate it as one of the best passes in the Alps, this year we rode all of them and I think I enjoyed both the Albula and Fluella more this time.

    Whatever route you take will be excellent.
    Hi Rasher,

    Why not? Please see below:
    Kloten > Wassen > Susten > Grimsel > Furka > Chur
    Following the route above it doesn't seem I have to go back to do Susten, Grimsel and Furka in this order...

    Regarding Julier vs Albula, I'll be doing that route on Monday 4 September so I'm not expecting to find a lot of traffic (?!?). In terms of type of route, since we are two up plus luggage I'd probably give my preference to the views rather than "sporting" bends.

    Is the Fluella really that good and definitely better than Julier and Albula? If that's the case I might just sacrifice a bit of time in Como and go for that instead.

  16. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gab View Post
    Hi Rasher,

    Why not? Please see below:
    Kloten > Wassen > Susten > Grimsel > Furka > Chur
    Following the route above it doesn't seem I have to go back to do Susten, Grimsel and Furka in this order...

    Regarding Julier vs Albula, I'll be doing that route on Monday 4 September so I'm not expecting to find a lot of traffic (?!?). In terms of type of route, since we are two up plus luggage I'd probably give my preference to the views rather than "sporting" bends.

    Is the Fluella really that good and definitely better than Julier and Albula? If that's the case I might just sacrifice a bit of time in Como and go for that instead.

    Did the Julier last week at appx 11 am it was 4.5 deg C on the top. We didnt do the Stelvio as it was 0 and snowing. Just done the Neufen today 34 at bottom 16 deg C at top. Weatherpro or similar app is your guide. Dont use BBC weather app in Switzerland its way off, not sure where it sources its data but its between 8 and 10 deg C out

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