Get The Sandwiches Ready - GSA Rear Wheel Collapse

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Mr Bean said:
I thought I'd just check the caliper bolts on mine and they had a good smear of copaslip on the threads...

Cleaned internal and external threads with brake cleaner and loctite before torqued back up.
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From your comments it looks like you’ve done the right thing and removed the copaslip. Who ever applied the copaslip shouldn’t be working on any vehicle. Never apply copaslip to calliper bolts.


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Mr Bean said:
From memory you don't need to remove the caliper to fit new pads.
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Why would you fit new pads without cleaning the caliper, lubricating the pins etc? :eek

The brakes need a good wire-brushing and clean regularly - if you feel the need to fit new bolts then do so. I'm unaware as to whether my bike (1150) has a recommendation for new bolts each time - but I do know that all I do is clean the threads, apply loctite and torque them back on...
 
JohnnyBoxer said:
Dave who?

I thought it was a chap called Paul and he's still with us
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There was people saying when it was first posted the bike was ridden by Dave Jeffries and done just to take the piss out the power rangers riding the course. Whoever it was he got the most out the old girl, imagine how fast he would be on the mighty R1200GS LC. :beerjug:
 
Deleted account 181015001 said:
Looks like he stopped to help sweep up his mate and bike to me, I think the ride might have been ended prematurely. :beerjug:
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Mike O said:
Why would you fit new pads without cleaning the caliper, lubricating the pins etc? :eek
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You can do a reasonable job of cleaning the sliding surfaces of the caliper with a toothbrush and brake cleaner. There is a large enough clearance between the pad and pin - the pin is never going to cause the pad to bind.
 
Karlos said:
From your comments it looks like you’ve done the right thing and removed the copaslip. Who ever applied the copaslip shouldn’t be working on any vehicle.
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The bike came with a full BMW service history - not that a dealer necessarily applied it.

For peace of mind I've ordered new screws from Motorworks - only £1.70 each...
 
Mr Bean said:
The bike came with a full BMW service history - not that a dealer necessarily applied it.

For peace of mind I've ordered new screws from Motorworks - only £1.70 each...
Click to expand...

But we still do not know if it was the screws that became loose...........or something more sinister final drive lock up
 
Mr Bean said:
You can do a reasonable job of cleaning the sliding surfaces of the caliper with a toothbrush and brake cleaner. There is a large enough clearance between the pad and pin - the pin is never going to cause the pad to bind.
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no you cant do it properly without removing the caliper,but you know that really or you shouldnt be working on brakes,so how do you seperate the caliper and lube the sliders coverered by the rubber boots with it all bolted up
 
autogs said:
no you cant do it properly without removing the caliper,but you know that really or you shouldnt be working on brakes,so how do you seperate the caliper and lube the sliders coverered by the rubber boots with it all bolted up
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My bad, I had moved on to the fronts at this point - hence the comment about large clearance with the pin. After I had finished on the rear I took the fronts out (wanted to make sure no copaslip on those pins), pads out, cleaned them up also where the pad slides against the caliper with a toothbrush. Reapplied a small amount of copaslip to the sides of the pad and backing, then reassembled.
 
autogs said:
no you cant do it properly without removing the caliper,but you know that really or you shouldnt be working on brakes,so how do you seperate the caliper and lube the sliders coverered by the rubber boots with it all bolted up
Click to expand...

BMW workshop instructions on the RSD do not require the caliper to be removed and sliders greased when changing the pads, are you saying BMW techs are also doing it wrong and the factory engineers who design and write the official RSD workshop instructions shouldn't be working on brakes?
 
Deleted account 181015001 said:
BMW workshop instructions on the RSD do not require the tech caliper to be removed and sliders greased when changing the pads, are you saying BMW are doing it wrong?
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I wouldn't say it wrong ... they are restricted to time schedule and if you paying £130 p/h you don't won't a bloke with toothbrush cleaning dust if is not absolutely needed.
BMW thinking if it fails with in 3 years we give you a new one ;)
but if you spend some time it could probably last 20 years
On the other hand if it last that long they not making any money on parts ...


Sent using my nokia 3210PRO ...shock absorber rebuilder...
 
Deleted account 181015001 said:
BMW workshop instructions on the RSD do not require the caliper to be removed and sliders greased when changing the pads, are you saying BMW techs are also doing it wrong and the factory engineers who design and write the official RSD workshop instructions shouldn't be working on brakes?
Click to expand...

When I clean/service the brakes, I clean and 'exercise' the caliper - extending the pistons to clean the ridge of brake dust and crap built up on them. I wire-brush the caliper (and pads if I'm refitting) and use brake cleaner to clean all the dust and road crap off that has built up since the last service. I remove the anti-chatter clip from the caliper body and clean it and behind it, clean the pin and then replace/clean the pads, putting a smear of copperslip on the back of each, as well as on the pin. I also use a rat-tail file on the hole in the pads the pin fits through, to make sure they can move freely on the pin. I inspect the condition of the pins and rubber bellows on the caliper mount and clean and lubricate as necessary, before refitting with cleaned and re-loctited bolts.

You (and BMW techs) are free to service your brakes as you see fit, but I like to do a thorough job - it's my bike and I want it to last and be reliable... :thumb2
 
Engineer said:
I am surprised the calliper wasn’t torn from the brake hose if it went into the wheel.
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It was likely a braided hose - therefore strong enough to withstand the pull until the damage had been done - which would have been very quickly (likely not much more than a complete revolution of the wheel once the caliper was fully in contact with the spokes).

There is also the effect of a 'watershed' moment, where sufficient spokes are broken that the rest will inevitably collapse.

Looking at the video, I'd think the initial feeling the rider clearly had was something very strange happening to the rear end of his bike (would be not unlike a puncture or a loose wheel) - this was probably the caliper free of its bolts and banging against the spokes - once part of it entered the spokes and jammed against the swing arm, the collapse would have been instant.
 
There is a lot of assumptions on here regarding the cause. It’ll be interesting to find out exactly what it was. Most people seem to be pointing towards the calliper coming loose.

I’m not so sure, make me wonder if it was a broken spoke or two.

The rim did collapse, and the calliper has been torn off the mounting, however which came first?

If you look you can see the rear calliper bolt is still there, therefore if the front calliper bolt was missing the rotation of the disc would drag the calliper down agains the disc and not up into the wheel.

I haven’t measured the clearance on mine, but I think the calliper would have to move some distance before contacting the spokes which would need the bolts to be completely unthreaded and I presume this would be noticeable as the travel in the rear brake pedal would change due to the pistons being pushed back.

It’s all speculation until the exact cause is identified.


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Seen quite a few posts on advrider about rear calipers coming off and destroying spokes/wheels so it's not exactly an original theory, but they don't generally just fall off without reason.
 
Ooops, turnms out it won't play in IE11.

Thank the lord he survived, that was truly horrendous just to watch.

I think this needs a proper investigation - maybe another recall.
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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