Extending the route of a past trip to include Stelvio and Dolomites.

redsmartie

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I did a trip a couple of years ago that roughly followed the following route (I have the exact routes available via my tracklogs listed at the bottom of the post)

  • Geneva
  • Bramans
  • Monaco (a long diversion because we wanted to visit)
  • La Norma
  • Martigny (via the St Bernard Passes)
  • Andermatt (and all the passes in the general area)
  • Lauterbrunnen
  • Geneva


I'd lake to do next years trip and try and take in Combe Laval, Stelvio Pass and Dolomites. I thought that this may be possible as I won't be doing Monaco again and that gives me an additional two days in my pocket to play with. Actually it could be three as we stayed two nights in Andermatt and did some short loops on what was a rest day.

So, a) how feasible would it be for anyone who has been that way, and b) given that it may be possible what would the best route be?

I have been doing some planning on the map and it seems that I could head south of Geneva to Combe Laval. I would then hook up on my old route from Bramans onwards to Andermatt and then take the Stelvio onwards to the Dolomites and some form of route back to Geneva. It is this latter part from Andermatt that is the grey area for me.

Any advice from experience would be greatly appreciated.

I mentioned that my trackless were available.. they are here

Geneva to Bramans https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128668?mode=share
Bramans to Menton https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128667?mode=share
Menton to La Norma via Monaco https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128666?mode=share
La Norma to Martigny https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128672?mode=share
Martigny to Andermatt https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128670?mode=share
Around Andermatt https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128673?mode=share
Andermatt to Lauterbrunnen https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128671?mode=share
Lauterbrunnen to Geneva https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/track/128669?mode=share
 
If you mean from Andermatt to the Dolomites there are lots of good options along the way, here's a couple of ideas.

1. Oberalp - Julier or Albula - Bernina - Gavia - Stelvio. It is then a bit crap across to Merano and through Bolzano before you start getting into the Dolomites.

You could also take the San Bernadino, Splugen and Maloja to get you to the Bernina.

Or;

2. Oberalp - Julier or Albula or Fluella - Offen Pass - Stelvio - Gavia - Tonale. You still have to get past Bolzano, but overall I think this is the better route.


You could also take the San Bernadino, Splugen and Maloja to get you to the Offen.


Plus a load of other slight variations, if taking the San Bernadino you could also run over the Oberalp and drop back down the Lukmanier to get to the Start of the San Bernadino, you also do not have to then take the Splugen, you could head from there to the Julier.

Having done both and ridden all of the listed passes I would probably skip the Stelvio myself and do something like;

Oberalp - Lukmanier - San Bernadino - Splugen - Maloja; Then Stop in Livigno before continuing

d'Eira - Foscagno - Gavia - Tonale. Then through Bolzano to pickup the Dolomite passes.
 
Thanks for that.

Any reason why you would skip the Stelvio? One of the party has done it before, another would really like to do it. I can take it or leave it given the quality of ride through the other passes. Have I just answered my own question?

Is there a preferred route through the Dolomites.. all I know of them at this stage is the pictures I've seen of the scenery.
 
If you are going close to the Stelvio, it you haven’t done it, if one of your party would like to do it.... then do it. You can always moan afterwards.... or tell everyone that you are at least glad you did.

As to a route thro’ the Dolomites, a map is your best friend.
 
As to a route thro’ the Dolomites, a map is your best friend.

You'll have to excuse my ignorance at this stage because I'm not entirely sure that 'the dolomites' are :) Something about Italy and mountains???
 
You'll have to excuse my ignorance at this stage because I'm not entirely sure that 'the dolomites' are :) Something about Italy and mountains???



You've decided to go somewhere but you don't know what it is or where it is? But you are making plans for it? It’s like bods a couple of hundred years ago, looking for the Northwest Passage or, earlier, Marco Polo setting of for the mysteries of the fabled Orient. You are walking in the footsteps of giants.

You've possibly heard of Google? If not, it's a new invention which, if its inventors are lucky, may well catch-on and make them a couple of bob. Until then:

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=What+and+where+are+the+Dolomites?

Now you can buy a suitable map.
 
Paper and pen, draw a route

Don't bother with the Dolomites..... they're shit, even if you can find them

As for the Stelvio - that's for the unimaginative
 
Calm down Wapping :)

I love planning and I google the shit out of everything :thumb

This is just first pass to get a bit of intel

This is what I've laid out as a crude guide.

I'm planning not only for myself and those travelling from the UK with me but 5 of my friends from the US of A will be meeting me in Geneva and I want to make sure they see as much as possible. I have good knowledge from my previous trips but the Dolomites was a grey area for me. Now that I have focused on the area of the Dolomites that seems popular I can then focus my searches.

p.s. paper maps are for old people :rob :yelrotflm

https://www.myrouteapp.com/en/social/route/1232041?mode=share
 
I’d get the bods from the UK to help you. A problem shared and all that.

PS Hermann’s book (bible, even) on motorcycling thro’ the Alps will be your best friend.
 
I’d get the bods from the UK to help you. A problem shared and all that.

Ha, they are useless! Besides, not only am I a control freak I've also proved myself to be a most excellent tour guide. I provide them with a fully researched itinerary with route highlight, history, places of interest and full accommodation details.
 
Great, you’ll be able to participate in the ‘How do you plan your tours?’ thread.
 
The "Bible" is always a good shout - "Motorcycle Journey's through the Alps and Beyond"

The Stelvio is a must for everyone - at least once, if for no other reason to have your own opinion on it. If you and any of your buddies have not ridden it, then make the effort to assess it for yourself whilst you are nearby.

It is kind of "in the way" as you ride East - West in the Alps, as stated earlier for the purpose of going from the Swiss / Italian Alps to the Dolomites I thin the Tonale route is slightly better, regardless of which you take I also think the Gavia is well worth working into the route.

As for the Dolomites, they can be a bit busy on a few of the busiest passes, but they have more passes than any other region, all closely packed together, so it is possible to ride 10,15 or even 20 in a single day.
 
The "Bible" is always a good shout - "Motorcycle Journey's through the Alps and Beyond"

I'd agree. I had a copy that I gave to one of my US friends the last time out was out in TN/NC doing the Tail of the Dragon with them.

I'm using the 'core' route through Switzerland that I used last time. We would start the trip through France and Italy from Geneva before heading over the Bernards to Martigny and across to Andermatt.

In the discussions we had had and to add something different the Combe Laval, Stelvio and Dolomites had been thrown in the pot. Obviously the Combe Laval and the Dolomites (via Stelvio) form the most easterly and westerly points of the route.

I have past routes to draw upon and can see the milage and riding time on each. They are usually over 7 or 8 days. Milage can be deceiving as the covered distance in any particular day would depend on the speed of the road. Therefore I looked at riding time within each route. My initial route came in at 45 hours with previous ridden routes being 35 hours. These previous routes while having the odd short day did include some big runs in the saddle. So I'm currently looking at where I can shave sections off. I'm currently of the belief that Combe Laval and Stelvio/Dolomites would be a bit of an ask. I'm of the firm believer that a route is best enjoyed when you slow it down rather than having to get your head down between point A and B.

Not withstanding all that I have a grey area on the return route should we do the Stelvio of planning an unknown area of Italy. My current draft brings us back around the edge of Lake Garda and Lake Como before heading north back to Switzerland and back through Andermatt on the way to either Lauterbrunnen or Grindelwald. I'm not sure if the route around the lakes would be recommended or if there are better options.
 
Lakes (well the big ones tourists visit) = Traffic, and normally lots of it, I try and avoid them as much as possible.
 
Routes around lakes are very often slow going, there being (on one side at least) no obvious route of escape.
 
I've dropped the lakes.. and I've managed to get the total run to 38 hours (about 1200 miles)

  • Geneva
  • La Clusaz
  • Grenoble (via fast route)
  • Combe Laval (D76)
  • La Norma (ski resort)
  • Bramans
  • Col de I'Iseran
  • Val-d'Isere
  • Petit St. Bernard Pass
  • Grand St. Bernard Pass
  • Martigny
  • Furka Pass
  • Andermatt
  • Oberlap Pass
  • Julia Pass
  • St Moritz
  • Ofen Pass
  • Umbrail Pass
  • Stelvio Pass East (turn around and back again)
  • Stelvio Pass West
  • Albua Pass
  • San Bernadino Pass
  • Ariolo
  • The Tremola!!!!
  • Andermatt
  • Gotthard Pass
  • Susten Pass
  • Interlaken
  • Grindelwald
  • Geneva


How's that for a slice of fried gold?
 
Looks good to me, except Stelvio East, if I was on your trip I would sit at the top in the cool air, eating my Wurst and choosing my T-Shirt while you wrestle down and up them bumpy tight hairpins - and those who are with you can all have that same choice.
 
Looks good to me, except Stelvio East, if I was on your trip I would sit at the top in the cool air, eating my Wurst and choosing my T-Shirt while you wrestle down and up them bumpy tight hairpins - and those who are with you can all have that same choice.

I agree but, then again, I take it we've both done the east Stelvio?
 
I agree but, then again, I take it we've both done the east Stelvio?

Yes, and only because I was heading out towards Austria and it was the most direct route, as I have said before the best bit (for us) is the views from the top and ticking it off the list / having our own opinion on it.

For a horrible gnarly ride I prefer the Splugen, although the Mrs hates it so I can only go there on lads trips in future.
 


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