Final drive question

[Baz]

Just back from a jaunt down to Corwall with a mate. At the end of a long (70 Miles) fast dual carriageway blast, he asked me to have a look at his final drive. When rocking it, there was noticeable play in his whereas there was nothing on mine.

However after a lunchbreak the play had gone. Anyone else noticed this & should he be worried or is the play just from the bearings warming up??

His has done @ 14K, mines on 11.5K, both 55 plates.

Baz

 

[Deleted account 210609001]

I'm no expert, an donly checked from time to time, but I've never noticed any movement in mine, hot or cold.

 

[Chris Terry]

Get it checked, but sounds ominous.
Ignore and hope for the best.
Maybe you could just ride in cold weather

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

There should be no discernable play, sorry

Andres

 

[PeterF]

There should be no discernable play, sorry

Andres

Interestingly, BMW say otherwise, see other threads on the subject, (unless you mean discernible when riding).

I have a 55 GS1200 with play in the real wheel as described above. I have taken it down to those friendly folk at Bahnstormer who say that 1mm play at the the rim (i.e. practically nothing at the bearing) when cold, is deemed to be within tolerance. Sometime later I thought "hold the phone I have an expensive motorcyle with a wobbly back wheel" so I took to Bahnstormer again and had the same discussion. Not completely convinced I have to say. If I took my 1955 Ariel Red Hunter to the MOT man in the same condition he would suck on his teeth and say "sorry that is dangerous".

I check the back wheel regularly (more that would normally be necessary and at 8k the play remains the same so I am not over concerned. If, however, it deteriorates during my long awaited bike holiday next month, I shall be tempted to vote with my feet. There again what would I buy ? There nothing quite like a GS

 

[Deleted account 210609001]

Interestingly, BMW say otherwise, see other threads on the subject, (unless you mean discernible when riding).

I have a 55 GS1200 with play in the real wheel as described above. I have taken it down to those friendly folk at Bahnstormer who say that 1mm play at the the rim (i.e. practically nothing at the bearing) when cold, is deemed to be within tolerance. Sometime later I thought "hold the phone I have an expensive motorcyle with a wobbly back wheel" so I took to Bahnstormer again and had the same discussion. Not completely convinced I have to say. If I took my 1955 Ariel Red Hunter to the MOT man in the same condition he would suck on his teeth and say "sorry that is dangerous".

I check the back wheel regularly (more that would normally be necessary and at 8k the play remains the same so I am not over concerned. If, however, it deteriorates during my long awaited bike holiday next month, I shall be tempted to vote with my feet. There again what would I buy ? There nothing quite like a GS

I'm surprised at this. My 1150 GS had a failed bearing detected at its first service. There was absolutely no discernible movement in terms of distance (well possible measureable under laboratory conditions with a micrometer, a laser, some bits of space shuttle and a super-computer) but the was a click when waggling the wheel. Dealer told me it needed to be changed.

They told me it was not an urgent thing which required a "Vehicle Off Road" priority, and I told them it would be an MOT failure on an older bike so would result in VOR. Still took them a couple of weeks to get it seen to. Dealers closed now (L&C, Tunbridge Wells). I'd be surprised if the different design differences between 1150 and 1200 accoutn for any differences in accepting loose bearings.

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

Interestingly, BMW say otherwise, see other threads on the subject, (unless you mean discernible when riding).

Yup, you are correct when you say this but I would dispute it as being acceptable.

My final drive, when new on my 05 bike, had no discernable play (when cold).

After 28000 miles there was a some play (but within MBWs tolerance) and soon after it developed the dreaded oil weep.

The final drive was changed under warranty (ironically not for the above reason but for poor paint finish) and my new final drive is back to no play what so ever.

I'm no engineer, and others may say different, but I would not expect to be able to feel any side to side paly - if I did it would be due to a worn bearing

Andres

 

[PeterF]

Yup, you are correct when you say this but I would dispute it as being acceptable.

My final drive, when new on my 05 bike, had no discernable play (when cold).

After 28000 miles there was a some play (but within MBWs tolerance) and soon after it developed the dreaded oil weep.

The final drive was changed under warranty (ironically not for the above reason but for poor paint finish) and my new final drive is back to no play what so ever.

I'm no engineer, and others may say different, but I would not expect to be able to feel any side to side paly - if I did it would be due to a worn bearing


Andres

I'm no engineer either, but I wonder if the play is in the splines that are present somewhere close by, hence it is susceptible to more play when warm. The fact that some are OK and some aren't perhaps points to a marginal situation where the design is a little close to the limit. If you contrast the BM set-up to the equivalent area on the Honda VFR single side swinging arm, for example, you will note that the BM seems fairly minimalist by comparison and it has to accommodate an internal drive system as well. I spend too much time thinking about this.......

 

[Engineer]

BMW say 1mm max play at the rim. Found this document of some American site.


QUOTE:

It appears the problem with the 1200 GS bikes is the splined flange mounting system of the rear wheel .
I enclose some literature about the BMW fix for this problem .

© 2004, BMW of North America, LLC
BMWMotorrad
USA
Service Information Bulletin
Subject: Bearing play at the rear wheel drive
Model:
Details:
Aftersales
Solution:
Dealer Operation/
General Manager
Sales-
Motorcycles
Sales -
Used Motorcycles
Business Manager
(F&I)
Service Parts & Accessories Administration
Date: February 2005
Bulletin #33 001 05 (011)
Source: 33 74/2004
BMW Motorrad USA Service and Technical
Contact: Respective Aftersales Business Consultant
R 1200 GS
1: In the rear drive of the R 1200 GS the ring gear is supported by two types of bearings:
one floating bearing and one fixed bearing without preload. Inherent in this design
is a small amount of bearing play at the rear wheel. With all components manufactured
and assembled to stated tolerances it is possible that play in these bearings can be felt
and measured at the rear wheel. This type of bearing play has no effect on motorcycle
handling or on the durability of the bearings.
2: There is a possibility of play developing between the splined wheel flange (P/N 33 17
7 668 659) and the axle tube of some motorcycles manufactured prior to 08/2004, US
VIN# ZL 76187.
1: In the event of a customer complaint, an inspection and measurement of rear wheel
bearing play is to be performed as described below. With cold components the total
play (back and forth travel) allowable at the wheel rim edge is 1mm(maximum). Refer to
the R 1200 GS Repair Manual CD for measuring procedures as well as temperature definition
of "cold components". Replace the entire rear-wheel drive assembly if the play
exceeds specifications.
2: If the complaint is "bearing play at the rear wheel" you must first check that the
splined flange is secure before performing the measurement noted in point #1. When
rocking the rear wheel back and forth, you must first make sure there is no movement
between the wheel flange, the rear wheel and the axle tube.
If play is noticeable between these components you must replace the entire rear wheel
drive assembly (complete with flange). Replacing the splined wheel flange only will not
solve the situation, because in all probability the splines on the axle tube will have suffered
some degree of wear as well. If you are in doubt, you are requested to contact your
respective Aftersales Business Consultant.
Warranty: Covered under the terms of the New Motorcycle Limited Warranty.
Important Note: Screw 1 is a drain
plug for repair-related oil changes; it is
not for checking the oil level. When filling
the rear drive assembly with oil,
pour in the defined quantity (0.25 l for
initial fill, or 0.23 l for oil changes)
through the bore for the ABS sensor.
We highly recommend using BMW
Super Synthetic Gear oil. 75W 90, P/N
07 51 0 394 082

UN-QUOTE:

Does this help??

 

[Phil Clarke]

Mine had a fair amount of play when hot and almost none when cold (repeated waggling when cold did eventually show up some play). Dealer gave me a new final drive under warranty. Get them to sort it Asap and if they reckon its fine get them to give the bike a good test ride to ensure the oil is up to temperature.

 

[NLS]

some more data for the infamous "BMW final drive" rhapsody

they changed to a different type of ball bearing (with fewer but bigger balls) a few months ago (I think late 06), most people know that...

the new info I got, is that they changed the ball bearing AGAIN this (late) June (probably my own mid-June 07 did NOT get it) to a "closed type" one, that one can easily check by removing the black plastic seal around the famous R1200 hole

 

[Baz]

THanks Chaps
I'll email it on.

Being paranoid, I checked mine again today after decent run. There did seem to be a bit of play whe hot which disappeared once after an hour or so.

Baz