Helmet speaker components

[stolzy]

So I've got myself an Amplirider amplifier which does its job of amplifying very well.

Problem is that the helmet speakers on my Starcom installation distort the sound before it gets anywhere near the volume I want (I ride with earplugs).

I'd like to install new helmet transducers which will deal with the extra power without clipping.

Where can I buy decent quality headphone transducers which will handle upwards of 500mW?

 

[stevekdavis]

I'd recommend some custom monitors instead. They are pricey but you get a good fit and sound isolation. There are a few vendors to choose from. I used Ultimate Ear and got a fitting at the NEC bike show.

I figured £200 (also got some custom plugs) to protect my ears was worth it.

My 2p.

Steve

 

[its all poo]

normal large hifi headphones and take them apart but try and check size of speaker before you bust them up ! and some earplugs with the filters in

 

[Andy80F]

As a trial without the expense of full custom monitors try some in-ear-monitor (IEM) fitted with Comply tips. The tips are similar to foam earplugs but fit onto many IEMs and provide good isolation with excellent sound which does not need to be played too loud. I did the speaker and earplug thing for a few years and in fact at normal touring speeds of 70+ the sound from the speakers gets drowned out. I also have a portable (Caffeine)headphone amp and a Boostaroo and agree that in the helmet they just overwhelm the speakers (Autocoms) and I also worried about the sheer volume I was having to pump out to compensate for the road nose.

Comply

Andy

 

[stolzy]

I figured £200 (also got some custom plugs) to protect my ears was worth it.

Steve

Hmm, seems a lot when ear plugs will do the same job for pence

normal large hifi headphones and take them apart but try and check size of speaker before you bust them up ! and some earplugs with the filters in

I tried this, in fact before I dismantled the headphones I tried them in the output from the amplifier - seems the distortion is coming from the amp, not the headphones.

I used some hi-fi headphones that will go painfully, impossibly loud without distortion, but they distort at relativly modest levels with the bike amp.

Seeems I need a word with the producer of the amp.

 

[judge]

John I'm not impartial as I work for a custom ear plugger and would happily sell them to you and everyone but...

You have a helmet speaker you cannot hear due to you using an earplug that is too efficient, what SNR rating does that plug have because that is the performance you are taking away from the helmet speaker.

To compensate you are using an amplifier to put more noise through that speaker such that it is distorting the sound - that should be telling you something about the noise levels you are exposing your ears to.

What do these amplifiers put out as I'd genuinely like to know

Perhaps you could change your generic ear plugs for something less efficient? If its a 30dB plug then try a 24dB plug, just ensure you keep it over 20dB to ensure you are not reducing the attenuation you need for motorbike use aside from your music needs.

There, some sage advice without trying to sell you a custom solution that could be had for a darn sight less than £200 but I fear somewhat more than your 'pennies' budget

 

[stolzy]

John I'm not impartial as I work for a custom ear plugger and would happily sell them to you and everyone but...

You have a helmet speaker you cannot hear due to you using an earplug that is too efficient, what SNR rating does that plug have because that is the performance you are taking away from the helmet speaker.

To compensate you are using an amplifier to put more noise through that speaker such that it is distorting the sound - that should be telling you something about the noise levels you are exposing your ears to.

What do these amplifiers put out as I'd genuinely like to know

Perhaps you could change your generic ear plugs for something less efficient? If its a 30dB plug then try a 24dB plug, just ensure you keep it over 20dB to ensure you are not reducing the attenuation you need for motorbike use aside from your music needs.

There, some sage advice without trying to sell you a custom solution that could be had for a darn sight less than £200 but I fear somewhat more than your 'pennies' budget

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, and I'm ready to bow to superior knowledge, but . . .
My intention was to improve the signal to noise ratio by increasing the signal (amplifying the output of the source). I'm not sure I understand the concept of an SNR for an ear plug, surely the signal and the noise get reduced the same amount?

As for what the efficiency of the ear plugs are, I have no idea, I just buy them off the shelf in a local pharmacy and they make it go quiet in my helmet

 

[judge]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, and I'm ready to bow to superior knowledge, but . . .

Let's not be too quick to jump to a conclusion that I might offer superior knowledge and concern ourselves that we have a shared understanding.

My intention was to improve the signal to noise ratio by increasing the signal (amplifying the output of the source). I'm not sure I understand the concept of an SNR for an ear plug, surely the signal and the noise get reduced the same amount?

Your current earplugs are blocking out noise, quite efficiently it would seem, certainly too efficiently for your helmet speakers from your Starcom. Noise is just that noise and your passive ear plug cannot differentiate what you want to hear (sound from your helmet speaker) from what you want to hear a lot less of (ambient noise from biking).

This amplifier does one job amplifies (increases) the sound (noise) from the source (iPod) to the helmet speaker and does so too efficiently for the speaker driver but overcomes the attenuating performance of your ear plugs. So you can now hear it sufficiently to know it is distorting whereas previously you just couldn't hear it sufficiently.

As for what the efficiency of the ear plugs are, I have no idea, I just buy them off the shelf in a local pharmacy and they make it go quiet in my helmet

Everything sold as a hearing protector by law must conform to a European standard EN-352.2 and be tested for its levels of protection at a range of frequencies that are grouped in to low, medium and high. The attenuating properties at these frequencies then get averaged to provide its SNR rating.

The packaging of your hearing protector will provide its SNR rating and what I am suggesting is you could change this for one of a lower SNR that will allow the speaker to perform at the speeds you need it to whilst providing an acceptable level of hearing protection for the given environment.

Alternatively buy something that does both jobs without compromising either your listening or your hearing.

 

[stolzy]

Your current earplugs are blocking out noise, quite efficiently it would seem, certainly too efficiently for your helmet speakers from your Starcom. Noise is just that noise and your passive ear plug cannot differentiate what you want to hear (sound from your helmet speaker) from what you want to hear a lot less of (ambient noise from biking).

This amplifier does one job amplifies (increases) the sound (noise) from the source (iPod) to the helmet speaker and does so too efficiently for the speaker driver but overcomes the attenuating performance of your ear plugs. So you can now hear it sufficiently to know it is distorting whereas previously you just couldn't hear it sufficiently.

erything sold as a hearing protector by law must conform to a European standard EN-352.2 and be tested for its levels of protection at a range of frequencies that are grouped in to low, medium and high. The attenuating properties at these frequencies then get averaged to provide its SNR rating.

Ok I see where the disparity in our understanding comes from. i was using the term noise to refer to the extraneous stuff that i don't want to hear, whilst the signal would be Grateful Dead/Radio 4 from my ipod.
I was attempting to reduce [noise+signal] with ear plugs and then increase the signal by amplifying the ipod.

IIUC Your use of SNR refers the dB reduction in sound of the ear plug

The more i investigate the more the amp seems to be at fault, not the speaker - if I plug my hi-fi headphones (which on my domestic amp will go so loud they could make your ears bleed without distortion) into the bike amp I get distortion at relatively modest levels.

Your point regarding the choice of earplug is well taken.

 

[Bryn]

Just my views on the Amplirider....

I've got an autocom set up and found that with foam plugs the volume from the 660 on music is not enough , even with a boostaroo...

Up to around 60-70 it was fine, any more and it just fades into the background wind noise.... so I got an amplirider and with that at around half volume on the remote control I've now got great sound up to around 100mph with I think improved bass, and no distortion that I've noticed....

So it could be down to your speaker set up John

 

[judge]

Helmet speaker placement is absolutely crucial for them to be optimal, anything less than a perfect position will seriously hamper performance.

Autocom & Starcom claims on performance on speakers are based on no hearing protection being used , 180MPH performance is impressive, use it with no hearing protection and you won't have to worry about what you can/cannot hear for long

 

[Dave Ett]

What impedance are your headphones? If they are not matched to the amplifier then you will get distortion to some degree.

 

[sanqhar]

Remember the No1 problem with volume is the positioning of the speaker within the helmet. Make sure the speaker is exactly opposite the ear canal.

tom

 

[stolzy]

Forgive me for resurrecting this, but I got some good advice and nee more

Firstly the confusion between judge and myself was my interretation of SNR - Judge meant single number rating which is the sound reducing quality of ear plugs.

I was referring to signal-to-noise ratio - since both SNR and SNR are measured in decibels, I'm guessing this is not the first time this confusion has occurred.

Anyway, in my quest for audio perfection I have removed the crappy Starcom earpieces and replaced them with the drivers from a pair of these Koss headphones which are reasonable well-reputed cans.

Problem is they don't go as loud as the others, the distortion is gone (there is an odd buzzing sound at very high volume), but they need to be louder to stand up to motorway speeds with earplugs.

I've got some Alpine earplugs as an experiment, but I'm not really getting on with them.

Any suggestions?