Nav 111 / Autocom

[Gaz_57]

Hi,

Does anyone know if there is a supplier who can provide a cable that works like the one Autocom provide for the 2820 - only for the Nav 3? As far as i can see - there is no mic input on a nav 111, unlike the 2820? (one that allows you to just pair the phone with the nav 111 on bluetooth and make and take calls / listen to the GPS / music through the autocom headset).

Many thanks

Gaz

 

[Wanderer]

Gaz

This is the reply I received from Autocom when I enquired whether they could help ...

My mail ...

"Dear Sir/Madam

I would be grateful if you could offer any advice on the following.

I ride a BMW R1150RT fitted with a BMW Navigator III Sat Nav which is
connected to an Autocom Super Pro AVi unit which connects to my Autocom
speakers and microphone in my helmet. My Autocom unit is also connected
to a Kenwood TK3201 (bar mounted PTT switch) for bike to bike
communications.

Is there anyway to use the Autocom unit for making/receiving telephone
calls via the Nav III connected to a bluetooth phone?

Many thanks in advance for any assistance you can offer."

This was Autocom's reply ...

"The answer is no im afraid. Basically BMW have made a bit of a mistake
with their mounting bracket. The nav III is the same as the Garmin 2820
that does allow you to answer and listen to your phone. The differnce is
the 2820 has an input and an output socket. BMW have mistakenly
disconnected the output that allows you to speak throught the phone.
Therefore you can listen to your call but not reply.

Regards"

So, it looks like a lead isn't the solution (otherwise Autocom would probably be making one).

I was speaking with Jim and Ste at Southport Superbikes the other day, they are currently experimenting with using a Tom Tom bluetooth ear piece. This has a 'jack output' which can be connected to the Autocom unit and the ear piece can be connected to the phone. That way, rather than the chain being from phone to sat nav to autocom to helmet, it becomes (I think) a two way chain, first from phone to sat nav (so that you can control the phone) and secondly from phone to Tom Tom blue tooth ear piece to Autocom to helmet (which enables you to hear and speak).

I'd recommend giving Jim a call at SSB and see how they're progressing.

Regards, Will

 

[Wapping]

Now, here’s an odd thing.

I have a Nav III, running through an Autocom. I also have a Sony Bluetooth mobile phone. The Sony phone mates with the Nav III, no problem.

Prior to downloading the Bluetooth update from Garmin, I could listen to my mobile ‘phone but the other party (listening to my voice) only received a garbled message, rather as if my voice was running through a scrambler.

I had assumed that the scrambled voice OUT was due to some sort of failure of the Bluetooth linking (ie, that it mated correctly on ‘voice IN’ but not on ‘voice OUT’. Quite how my scrambled voice was even being heard by the other party, if there is – as Autocom say – no voice OUT channel at all, I cannot quite fathom.

I had hoped that downloading the Bluetooth update from Garmin would cure the scrambling effect. Well, in a sense, it has. The listener on the other end of the line now cannot hear my voice at all now! Whether hearing nothing is better than hearing my scrambled dulcet tones I am not sure . All rather strange.

However, that’s the least of my problems. Quite separately, my NavIII’s voice instruction through the Autocom has simply faded away. The lovely lady’s voice got quieter and quieter, until (like the Cheshire cat) she vanished entirely.

I have checked all the connections and that the Nav III hasn’t switched itself to mute mode for some odd reason. I suspect (but not exactly sure why) that it’s a power problem to the Autocom somewhere. At some point, I am going to miss out the Autocom by wiring the Nav III directly into my helmet speakers to see if that helps.

 

[beemerboy9]

Hi chaps,
I have not yet seen a Nav III up close but I have downloaded a pdf of the owners manual with the pics.
On that side of the unit where the extra BMW buttons nestle close to the Nav III, on the 2820 there is a 3.5mm stereo line out for the MP3 player and a 2.5mm microphone INPUT. Presumably this is what BMW have "disconnected" on their unit.
It is my understanding that in order for the Nav III unit to answer/place call it must either be paired to a recognised bluetooth headset or helmet, whereas on a 2820, it could also have a microphone plugged into that 2.5mm input. Indeed the 2820 is supplied with a small microphone that can be placed near the sun-visor in a car. It is this extra input that Autocom use for their cable. The output sound (of the callers voice) is picked up from the cable supplied with the Garmin motorcycle mounting kit, which is mono.
I await news of SSB's solution with interest.

 

[Gaz_57]

Gaz

"The answer is no im afraid. Basically BMW have made a bit of a mistake
with their mounting bracket. The nav III is the same as the Garmin 2820
that does allow you to answer and listen to your phone. The differnce is
the 2820 has an input and an output socket. BMW have mistakenly
disconnected the output that allows you to speak throught the phone.
Therefore you can listen to your call but not reply.

Many thanks Will ... I pondered long and hard before buying the 1200 GS and the BMW Nav 111 .... in both cases because i was simply afraid of running into problems with BMW ... I have already had my fair share of problems with both within the first 3 months and BMW's attitude is clearly "we have your money now piss off" ....

The GPS thing is really dissappointing becasue it is a nonsence to disable a mic input that already existed on the base unit ie the 2820 (thank you BMW). Thanks for the the info - i will persue that line of enquiry and i also wonder now if it would be feasible to open the unit locate the disconnected mic input wires and fit a new 2.5mm jack socket. That would solve it - and Autocom would be well able to do it. BMW would of course immediately walk away from the warranty, but then i had to threaten legal action to get them to stand over a warranty issue already, so it doesn't seem to be worth the trouble seeking further assistance from them after initial purchase anyway.

Cheers


Gaz

 

[Ste@SSB]

I have had some good results with a combination of Nav III - Tomtom bluetooth headset (just the dongle not the headphones and mic) - Autocom ... doesn't seem to work with every phone ... but if someone wants to take a picture of the inside back panel of a 2820 then I might be able to sort a permanent hard wired solution...

There is no audio in on a Nav III other than through bluetooth by the way...

 

[Ste@SSB]

The GPS thing is really dissappointing becasue it is a nonsence to disable a mic input that already existed on the base unit ie the 2820 (thank you BMW). Thanks for the the info - i will persue that line of enquiry and i also wonder now if it would be feasible to open the unit locate the disconnected mic input wires and fit a new 2.5mm jack socket. That would solve it - and Autocom would be well able to do it. BMW would of course immediately walk away from the warranty, but then i had to threaten legal action to get them to stand over a warranty issue already, so it doesn't seem to be worth the trouble seeking further assistance from them after initial purchase anyway.

Cheers


Gaz

Bmw have the solution to the problem in the pipeline ... its a bluetooth hub that integrates with your Nav - phone - Bt helmet ... problem is ... its very very late ... I first heard about it when the Bt helmet came out ... it will also make use of the higher quality Bt connection that the BMW helmet supports so you can get very good quality stereo audio either from the bikes radio or from an iPod or whatever ... the Nav, hub and helmet are meant to be an all encompassing solution ... I also heard tales of being able to plug a transmitter into it? ... who know ... not me...

 

[Gaz_57]

Bmw have the solution to the problem in the pipeline ... its a bluetooth hub that integrates with your Nav - phone - Bt helmet ... problem is ...


Many thanks Ste, although it doesn't surprise me that those lovely people at BMW, having removed the simple €1.50 mic jack from the original 2820 that would solve the problem, then come up with a solution that involves their valued customers (victims) buying their bluetooth helmet for about €1,000.00 and their hub (€? - god only knows!). I would rather walk to Tibet than be forced to accept any solution that involves writing them another cheque!

Hopefully, some of the boffins around here like yourself canfigure out an alternative like the one you suggested.

Cheers

Gaz

 

[beemerboy9]

Bmw have the solution to the problem in the pipeline ... its a bluetooth hub that integrates with your Nav - phone - Bt helmet ... problem is ...


I would rather walk to Tibet than be forced to accept any solution that involves writing them another cheque!

Hopefully, some of the boffins around here like yourself canfigure out an alternative like the one you suggested.

Cheers

Gaz

I am sure that you are correct in thinking that the Bluetooth hub and network are going to cost a large chunk on money.
I cannot understand BMW ignoring the huge wired intercom market (Autocom, Starcom, Baehr, Intaride) especially since they supposedly sub-contract a K1200LT intercom in the USA to J&M.
For me the NavIII/2820 was always going to a massive advance over my NavI and worth the money.
I would be a little upset if I'd laid out lots of money upgrading from a NavII to a NavIII.

 

[Ste@SSB]

To be honest ... I feel that BMW maybe jumped on the wrong unit to be the Nav III ... Garmin made the units with the hard wired outputs on the left hand side of the unit ... that would be the bit covered up by the BMW bracket with the extra buttons ... oops ... I don't think it would have been rocket science to put them on the other side of the unit but I suppose the idea is that you buy the Bt helmet and hub to go with it ... so hats of to them for trying to nail your hat on ... but a big poke in the eye for not delivering the goods...

A Tomtom headset is about £50 or so ... anyone who wants to try it with a Nav III and Autocom is quite welcome to call round ... I have it wired up on the counter ready to go ... or not go...

 

[beemerboy9]

Steve, full marks for perseverance!

 

[Ste@SSB]

I am the terminator of the Nav III world...

 

[steveuk]

new nav 111 under warranty

just had my nav 11 replaced no questions asked (18 months after purchase) with a nav111....experiencing all the problems listed above - autocom said there is currently no solution except to buy a bluetooth helmet.....


they also pointed out (for best results) i should use a 4 core phone lead (not 3 core) for my Sony Ericsson K750i...... plugged into aux 2 on the autocom (kit300) ......and the sat nav should route through port A on my (red and black splitter box) and then into aux 1 on the autocom...(i use my phone for music - not an MP3 player)

does anybody have a bluetooth helmet? any comments? good? bad?

thanks

 

[beemerboy9]

Issue 19/2006 of the German magazine Motorrad contains a generally unenthusiastic review of the Bluetooth marketplace at the time of publication. There are no really comprehensive (pillion comms+music+phone+satnav), satisfactory, value for money solutions at the current time so their advice is to hold off as long as possible. Also there are bound to be new offerings at the InterMot in Cologne in October.
Their other advice - try everything in the shop very, very carefully before parting with your money. They rated helmets (in order) Nolan N102 N-com, Dainese Airstream Bluetooth, BMW System 5 and the Momo Jet was completely hopeless.

My personal advice - you have been given a Nav III gift horse, it's a great device - just forget the Bluetooth bit and enjoy your Autocom for the time being.

 

[steveuk]

My personal advice - you have been given a Nav III gift horse, it's a great device - just forget the Bluetooth bit and enjoy your Autocom for the time being.

i agree ! it is better than the "nav11" even without the bluetooth enabled. . .