Stainless bolts, possible dumb question

Timbo1965

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Well two actually. I'm swapping my Adventure spoked wheels to GS alloys.
1: I have Stainless steel disk bolts, but have been told not to use them as I'll never get them back out. Is this right ?
2: I've also bought Pro-Bolt Stainless wheel bolts to mount the rear wheel. Are they OK or should I get some BMW originals ?

Help, I want to get on with this.
 
I've used stainless bolts in aluminium quite a few times without problems, but I did always use copper slip on the threads. Personally, I would only use stainless for engine covers and the like which are low torque applications; for disc and wheel bolts I would stick to carbon steel, which is what I think the BMW bolts will be made of.

AFAIK the rear wheel bolts are different for speaks and cast alloy wheels, but I guess you know about this?
 
Oooo, a good old stainless fasteners question, a subject that has more answers than there are useless items in a touratwat catalogue.

Galvanic corrosion is yer problem mate...which happens, in varying degrees, whenever two dissimilar metals come into contact with each other. Engine Bolts and screws for example benefit from a smear of copper slip or similar......slows down the dreaded gavanic thingamajig. Trouble is, most manufactures specify a locking compound on disc bolts.....but that's OK, because that too will slow down the corrosion process.
But, and here's my problem with using stainless for disc bolts.....the grades of stainless steel that's commonly used for fasteners is pretty soft.....and getting those fuckers out after who knows how many years will invariably lead to chewed up sockets and a lot of hassle getting them out. (But there soft he said, just drill them out....trouble is s/s work hardens, no problem if your drilling at a slowish speed with lots of coolant but the average Black and Decker will have the drill bit glowing red before you've even scratched the offending stuck item.)

So, ask yourself, 'when will I need to get these bolts out?' If the answers, 'never....ill have sold the bike by the time the ash tray need emptying' then you'll be fine. If you may think you'll need new discs after a few winters neglect then you may want to think again.

Personally? I'm not against using stainless for most aplications on a motorcycle from a 'strength' point of view.....I used to sell s/s fasteners for the Morini Riders Club......triple clamp bolts, wheel nuts, fork pitch bolts, allsorts, and have never heard of one failing. But there's a few instances that would make me slightly dubious. Anything that will need to be removed after many years in place, brake caliper bolts and wheel bolts/studs for a single sided swing arm are a few of them.
 
Stick to original spec bolts for wheels, discs, etc, stainless will not take the same stress`s as the OE bolts. Fine for casings, Panels etc.

Al.
 
Steel screw/bolt going into Alloy should have a smear of Aluslip, NOT Copaslip
 
I used to sell 1200GS stainless kits that had brake disc mounting bolts, but these were only for pre2007 bikes as the later discs came with the bolts and bobbins already pressed into place.

As well as 1200 kits i also sold hundreds of kits for the 1150 models which included including brake disc mounting bolts, also have them on my own bike, never had any problems and they won't seize and are easily removable as long as they are inserted correctly using a suitable anti-seize.

Stainless wheel bolts are a completely different kettle of fish, i wouldn't recommend them or have them on my own bike.
 
For your own safety, never fit a stainless fastener in a high tensile application especially one that can involve shear forces such as wheel bolts. Stick to the OEM high tensile grade wheel bolts.
 
Stainless bolt sets for the LC

Does anyone know of a stainless bolt set for the casings etc. On the GS LC?

The usual ebay ones all seem to be pre 2013

(Sorry for the thread hijack)
 
The galvanic numbers for stainless is 0.5V and aluminium 0.95V. Aluslip will simply aggravate the problem as it improves the conductivity between the same pair of dissimilar metals.

Copper between aluminium and stainless messes up the battery effect or considerably slows it down.

Zinc is further up the sale from aluminium so will corrode first. All fine as it's a sacrificial layer. However when the micro thin zinc layer has gone (as it always does into aluminium) the steel will rust. It wont be galvanic as the values are near enough the same as aluminium, but rusted steel bolts will shear off and cause problems if left long enough.

My personal experience with stainless into aluminium is - do it dry (even with threadlock) and it will seize especially if the threads are open at the back (GSA side case clamps are a great example). Use a high solids content copper grease (Rocol or similar) and all is ok. Alloy wheels on a Japanese bike had 50% of the disc bolts shear off. They were all zinc plated high carbon with threads open at the back. Stainless with copper paste were all fine after 2 winters with no signs of corrosion.

I've never had a properly protected stainless bolt fail into aluminium, but dry they will seize every time. Make sure the paste goes all the way from top to bottom. Don't just cover the threaded bit.

Stainless yields at about the same level as a normal 8.8 bolt but it's tough so takes a heck of a lot more to shear it off. High tensile steels are much stronger but the parent aluminium hub has minimal tensile strength so the high tensile bolts are overkill. Then add the rate that zinc gets eroded away and pretty soon you can have a rusty bolt holding the disc. High carbon steels rust PDQ so need protection.

From http://www.corrosion-doctors.org/Definitions/galvanic-series.htm

Metallurgy Index (Volt)
Gold, solid and plated & Gold-platinum alloy (0.00)
Rhodium plated on silver-plated copper (0.05)
Silver, solid or plated; monel metal & High nickel-copper alloys (0.15)
Nickel, solid or plated, titanium and alloys & Monel (0.30)
Copper, solid or plated; low brasses or bronzes; silver solder & German silvery high copper-nickel alloys; nickel-chromium alloys (0.35)
Brass and bronzes (0.40)
High brasses and bronzes (0.45)
18% chromium type corrosion-resistant steels (0.50)
Chromium plated; tin plated; 12% chromium type corrosion-resistant steels (0.60)
Tin-plate; tin-lead solder (0.65)
Lead, solid or plated; high lead alloys (0.70)
Aluminum, wrought alloys of the 2000 Series (0.75)
Iron, wrought, gray or malleable, plain carbon and low alloy steels (0.85)
Aluminum, wrought alloys other than 2000 Series aluminum, cast alloys of the silicon type (0.90)
Aluminum, cast alloys other than silicon type, cadmium, plated and chromate (0.95)
Hot-dip-zinc plate; galvanized steel (1.20)
Zinc, wrought; zinc-base die-casting alloys; zinc plated (1.25)
Magnesium & magnesium-base alloys, cast or wrought (1.75)
Beryllium (1.85)
 
I've seen titanium brake disc bolts for sale, do they give any probs?

I replaced the disk mounting bolts on my R1 for titanium (which is highly resistant to corrosion and good under shear and tensile forces).
 
Titanium is even more noble that stainless into aluminium, it has at least the same corrosion issues as stainless. A Nickel paste also exists that's close to copper on the galvanic scale.
 


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