Trail Riding In Spain

[PDiddy]

I was going trail riding in Spain next month on my trusty KTM, but sadly that has now been sold to help fund my new LC GS, which I will be taking instead. I had replaced the standard cooling fluid in the KTM with Engine Ice, and despite those that may shout that it's just a snake oil product I did find it aided the engines cooling on the few times I took it to Morocco. Given the benefits I believe that I gained from using Engine Ice in my KTM, should I consider changing the standard BMW fluid for a more technologically advanced cooling liquid -

 

[Greg Masters]

How on earth does it improve cooling?



Cooling for a given airflow is a factor of the surface area being cooled (ie the radiator fins) times the difference in temperature between the radiator fin surface and the air.

A 50/50 mix of antifreeze and water at 1.8 bar radiator pressure has a boiling point of about 250F. If your magic coolant has a higher boiling point you will get more cooling IF (and only if) the engine is running at a higher temperature. But then you'd be running the engine at a temperature that is outside its design parameter.

SNAKE OIL.

 

[AberdeenAngus]

Oh ffs. A "what coolant" question.

You've found a product that you think works.
So use it.

I think it's all mouse milk, but each to their own.

 

[PDiddy]

Oh ffs. A "what coolant" question.

You've found a product that you think works.
So use it.

I think it's all mouse milk, but each to their own.

It's gotta be better than what oil -

 

[AberdeenAngus]

It's gotta be better than what oil -

Very true

 

[jimbo]

How on earth does it improve cooling?



Cooling for a given airflow is a factor of the surface area being cooled (ie the radiator fins) times the difference in temperature between the radiator fin surface and the air.

A 50/50 mix of antifreeze and water at 1.8 bar radiator pressure has a boiling point of about 250F. If your magic coolant has a higher boiling point you will get more cooling IF (and only if) the engine is running at a higher temperature. But then you'd be running the engine at a temperature that is outside its design parameter.

SNAKE OIL.

There is also the issue of the thermal conductance between the cooling fluid and the surfaces it interacts with - the fluid needs to conduct heat from the engine and then allow the cooler radiator to conduct heat from it. If these 'water wetters' have any effect I would expect it to be a mild one, but in theory they could help the engine block run at a slightly cooler temperature (ie closer to that of the coolant) then standard, by requiring a lower temperature differential to achieve the same heat transfer. As you say, if the radiator cannot disperse sufficient heat, then the engine will get hotter!

If OP likes it then fine, Personally I don't see why fix something that isn't broken. GSs are sold in spain I believe and its not that hot there - I would expect that standard setup is more than adequate.

 

[Greg Masters]

There is also the issue of the thermal conductance between the cooling fluid and the surfaces it interacts with - the fluid needs to conduct heat from the engine and then allow the cooler radiator to conduct heat from it. If these 'water wetters' have any effect I would expect it to be a mild one, but in theory they could help the engine block run at a slightly cooler temperature (ie closer to that of the coolant) then standard, by requiring a lower temperature differential to achieve the same heat transfer. As you say, if the radiator cannot disperse sufficient heat, then the engine will get hotter!

If OP likes it then fine, Personally I don't see why fix something that isn't broken. GSs are sold in spain I believe and its not that hot there - I would expect that standard setup is more than adequate.

Getting heat into the coolant isn't generally the probem. The system pinch-point is the radiator/air interface. No amount of snake oil is going to improve that unless the operating temperature is upped.

Yes, the OP should use this stuff if it makes him feel <strike> poorer</strike> better.

 

[Yellow Peril]

I was going trail riding in Spain next month on my trusty KTM, but sadly that has now been sold to help fund my new LC GS, which I will be taking instead. I had replaced the standard cooling fluid in the KTM with Engine Ice, and despite those that may shout that it's just a snake oil product I did find it aided the engines cooling on the few times I took it to Morocco. Given the benefits I believe that I gained from using Engine Ice in my KTM, should I consider changing the standard BMW fluid for a more technologically advanced cooling liquid -

You people really know nothing about your new bikes do you? The LC has a mix of glycol/water therefore your snake oil will probably make the cooling effect less. The % of glycol has been calculated to give the correct cooling in the majority of situations far in excess of your trip. Glycol is commonly used in thermal solar panels as a "water wetter" to improve effect by upto 30% over water so I really don't think you'll have any problems with the standard fluid. Unless you hole the rad then you have a problem as standard water possibly will not be able to cool the engine enough for any extended period, so personally I'll keep my oil/air cooling for the time being.

 

[PDiddy]

You people really know nothing about your new bikes do you? The LC has a mix of glycol/water therefore your snake oil will probably make the cooling effect less. The % of glycol has been calculated to give the correct cooling in the majority of situations far in excess of your trip. Glycol is commonly used in thermal solar panels as a "water wetter" to improve effect by upto 30% over water so I really don't think you'll have any problems with the standard fluid. Unless you hole the rad then you have a problem as standard water possibly will not be able to cool the engine enough for any extended period, so personally I'll keep my oil/air cooling for the time being.

but Engine Ice is selling me the dream of well maintained coolness while I venture to hot and steamy exotic destinations -

 

[Yellow Peril]

but Engine Ice is selling me the dream of well maintained coolness while I venture to hot and steamy exotic destinations -

Well if you like wasting money , better to pop along to the RR factory out at Sinfin and get some really exotic cooling fluids.

 

[Timolgra]

but Engine Ice is selling me the dream of well maintained coolness while I venture to hot and steamy exotic destinations -

Bollox, you'd do better to fit a fan over ride switch

 

[boatman]

Is this a wind up
If i had spent out on a new dual purpose bike i would be well peed off if it did not do a bit of trails straight out the box

 

[stick]

I was going trail riding in Spain next month on my trusty KTM, but sadly that has now been sold to help fund my new LC GS, which I will be taking instead. I had replaced the standard cooling fluid in the KTM with Engine Ice, and despite those that may shout that it's just a snake oil product I did find it aided the engines cooling on the few times I took it to Morocco. Given the benefits I believe that I gained from using Engine Ice in my KTM, should I consider changing the standard BMW fluid for a more technologically advanced cooling liquid -

Agree as used similar in my enduro bikes as they used to get hot hot , used the ( can remember the name ) coolant "snake oil" and never overheated again .. Deep mud , lots of revs ( not an 1150 ) and a c--t stuck up a bank

 

[PDiddy]

Bollox, you'd do better to fit a fan over ride switch

What a cracking idea Tim, but rather than using a completely separate switch could I not use the heated grip controller, one dot for one fan and two dots for ... well you get the idea -

 

[Timolgra]

What a cracking idea Tim, but rather than using a completely separate switch could I not use the heated grip controller, one dot for one fan and two dots for ... well you get the idea -

Great, Aloe Vera's good for the burns on your hands

 

[PDiddy]

Great, Aloe Vera's good for the burns on your hands

I'm pretty safe as the heated grips on the LC are shite -