Remus & Y - so who's blown up an engine then?

retroman · Jun 30, 2005

All this controversy about running lean on a y-piece and Remus - there was a sweeping statement in RiDE this month from a grease monkey saying as much - just wondering if anyone had experienced engine damage as a result.

I'm up to 30k with no probs but I'm going back to OE for the next 6K because I'm fed up of the racket from my rear, so to speak.

:confused:

Steptoe · Jun 30, 2005

only ever heard of one supposedly causing any damage -

burnt/dropped a valve - he posts on here about it all the time

notadrop · Jun 30, 2005

52K and all is well! [plus K&N filter]

dave1100 · Jul 1, 2005

Mmm, yes I read that in RiDE and thought the same thing... and at £400 for the power cammander and more dyno time not a quick fix if the bike is running lean. I get the odd backfire but other than that runs like a dream on the Y and Remus, I guess a look at the plugs would disclose all. Will search this forum for more answers...

Geeza · Jul 26, 2005

retroman said:
All this controversy about running lean on a y-piece and Remus - there was a sweeping statement in RiDE this month from a grease monkey saying as much - just wondering if anyone had experienced engine damage as a result.

I'm up to 30k with no probs but I'm going back to OE for the next 6K because I'm fed up of the racket from my rear, so to speak.

I know the last owner of that very bike. A remus y-piece and end can were fitted when the bike was new, and then changed back to the OE exhaust when traded in for a 1200GS. Just goes to show what bike testers know.

cookie · Jul 26, 2005

Steptoe said:
only ever heard of one supposedly causing any damage -

burnt/dropped a valve - he posts on here about it all the time

stool? i thought it was a holed piston.

didn't fergus or one of his mates hole a piston ages ago too? don't remember if he had non standard exhaust.

StooL · Jul 26, 2005

Yep, it was me who holed a piston. Sorry if I bore you Steptoe, I’m sure you’d tell us if you had experienced a similar problem. I just thought it best to make people aware of the potential problems, after all that’s one of the main functions of this forum…isn’t it?

Quick run down for those that haven’t read the tale before. Fitted a y-piece and remus revolution and all was running really well. No discernible problems and the plugs looked Ok. 2000 miles after I modified the bike, (year 2000 1150GS) it holed the right piston. It also scored the cylinder and I had to spend over £200 fixing her up with second hand parts. I put the bike back together and after two dyno runs (problem with the first one) found that the bike was running dangerously lean in top gear roll-ons from about 60mph +. This just happened to coincide with how I use the bike on my daily commute up and down a twisty A road. I now have the bike back to standard and have covered 15,000 untroubled miles since the incident.

For all the doubters, yes I re-fitted the lambda, re-set the motronic etc and I’m 100% confident that everything was fitted correctly. I’m not a mechanical muppet and I can ride a bike. One other wee bit of info is the fact that my bike did not have a Cat Code Plug.

I may be the only unfortunate guy on this forum. Perhaps my bike just runs a tad leaner than everyone elses and the y-piece and can tipped her over the edge. The point I am trying to make in this post and my others is simply get your bike dyno’d. It’ll only cost £20 or £30 and may save you a fortune. I’ve also yet to read about someone who has had their bike (with a y-piece and no chip or techlusion) dyno’d and been told that it isn’t running lean!

:beerjug:

Steptoe · Jul 26, 2005

StooL said:
Yep, it was me who holed a piston. Sorry if I bore you Steptoe, I’m sure you’d tell us if you had experienced a similar problem. I just thought it best to make people aware of the potential problems, after all that’s one of the main functions of this forum…isn’t it?

I Don't get bored by your unfortunate experiance -

Just look at it in perspective - how many bikes using Y pieces and cans haven't had any trouble whatsoever .

StooL · Jul 26, 2005

Agreed, it is a fair point and the very reason that I fitted a y-piece and can without any additional mods.

However, I'm pretty confident that most, if not all of the 1150 GS's that have y-pieces and no chip, techlusion or power commander are running lean somewhere in the rev range. Many seem to be fortunate in that this lean running is not severe enough to cause discernible damage for many miles, but given my experience, I don't feel its worth the risk and certainly isn't doing the longevity of the bike any favours.

Captain Beaky · Jul 27, 2005

I put a Y-piece and K&N on mine - but kept the standard back box.

With yellow cat code plug, the plugs came out really overheated.

Took out cat code plug - better.

Put on Olive cat code plug (From R1150RT) reckoned that the RT has bigger inlets, so might need more fuel. Seems to run very nicely now - plugs looking good, and amazing power.

Backfires like hell on the overrun though - And gives a nice 4-6" flame out the tailpipe when it does.

The Boys in Balderstone's BMW in Peterborough reckon it runs rich with Y-Piece on, and reccomended a techlusion, but for half the money, I can fit a prototype Engine management, and tune to my heart's content (and play with the timing too!) so I'll play with CCP settings and stuff for a while yet...

Patch · Jul 27, 2005

Replacing the standard collector and silencer tomorrow because the Remus Ypiece is full of cracks at the welding.

Piece of shit.

cookie · Jul 27, 2005

Captain Beaky said:
The Boys in Balderstone's BMW in Peterborough reckon it runs rich with Y-Piece on,

a novel theory

Captain Beaky said:
and reccomended a techlusion

which can only add fuel :confused:

dealers

are you sure they said rich?

flooky · Jul 29, 2005

I rang 4 b.m.w. dealers, i rang remus, and i rang 2 dyno operators. all said bolt it on and leave it alone....with the lambda it will be ok..so

ed if i know..????

Taipan · Jul 29, 2005

My bike had a y piece and remus on. The plugs looked like they were burning lean to me? I wimped out and bought a techlusion just in case. I'll get it set up on the dyno soon to be double sure.

I have spent a fair bit of time messing (up

) bikes fuelling with dynojet kits etc etc. I've always gone to dyno testers to check my work and get it adjusted if needed. The one thing I've always been told by both engine builders/tuners is that if you alter the way the fuel goes in or out (inlet or exhaust) you need to recalibrate the fuelling.

gowenwilliams · Jul 29, 2005

My 2 cents worth.

"if you alter the way the fuel goes in or out (inlet or exhaust) you need to recalibrate the fuelling" True - but only really an issue if you are running carbs.

Any modern engine management system is capable of automatically adjusting the fuelling itself - it does this by monitoring the amount of oxygen in the exhaust system (Lambda Sensor). If the exhaust has too much/little oxygen, the system will correct this by adding more/less fuel.

This system is what enables the bike to run correctly at different altitudes. At 5000ft there is a lack of air - but not a problem for a GS, it corrects its fuelling accordingly. In the same way, it should cope happly with a different exhaust system.

Most problems in these situations are problems with/damage to the lambda sensor (it is quite a sensitive bit of kit) which then mis-reads and leads to problems.

So as for putting on a new exhaust - Put it on and leave it alone - the bike will know!!

(it is always worth getting it dyno'd occasionally (I tend to do it on each major service) - just to check that all is ok with the fuel system - this applies if you have changed the system or are still on the original system)

Deleted account 231205001 · Jul 29, 2005

This is my spark plug from a few days ago. Y/K&N/Remus/steptoe CCP mod and BEFORE I fitted a techlusion. Looks lean to me. I will post a pic after a few more miles.

Le singe · Jul 29, 2005

gowenwilliams- the bike can only alter the fuelling until it reaches the limits of it's range of adjustment, it's fallacy to state that any modification can be catered for by the injection brain.
For instance,the Motronic may be able to adjust plus or minus 5°
of the designers decided 'norm',you change something that requires 6° and you've passed the limit and need to intoduce other adjustments.
Taipan has said what has been said so many times before: GET IT ON THE DYNO!
It's so cheap compared to the potential for damage and worry,what's the point of modifying anything to do with the engine if you're not enabling it to achieve what you've fitted it to do?

Deleted account 231205001 · Jul 29, 2005

I went out a took a pic 5 mins ago. Since the last photo, I have added the techlusion r259. CAT code yellow plug IN and the 259 on standard factory settings. This is the photo. It looks a nice light brown colour on the core, compared with pure white before. ( about 40 miles since fitting the 259 ). I'm assuming this means the 259 works and has made the bike run less lean ??????????

gowenwilliams · Jul 29, 2005

To Le Singe,

Certainly, I agree totally. If the modification takes the adjustment out of range, you will need some re-calibration.
But you certainly shouldn't get to this point by fitting a road legal Remus system. I have run numerous legal, illegal (on a Dyno/race track) , and hand made systems on various engines and have not seen the fuelling alter to such an extent that exceeds the variation due to altitude. Maybe certain systems do take the ECU outside of its designed operating range, but then I've been lucky so far in that case. I've certainly never changed a system and had to bring the fuel map back from a dangerous area. Sometimes a quick remap for road use to get back to stoichiometric, or for racing, a change to Lambda 0.88.
Have you had a different experience?

(Just read my original post and it does read like I meant ANY change - this was not what I meant, sorry. I was refering to the Remus change specifically)

Taipan · Jul 29, 2005

Heres what my plugs looked like. yes they are from my 03 bike and not a Suffolk Colt.

Remus & Y - so who's blown up an engine then?

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