Riding in France (for Dummies)

Mike Werner

Cloggie amongst Frogs
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I've had several emails in the past asking about any hints for riding motorbike in France. Since the holidays are arriving (or are there), I decided to put a few pointers on paper (ehhh, I mean screen):

In one sentence, you can sum up the biker situation in France: "Bikers are RESPECTED in France". and "French love mavericks, and bikers are mavericks !!" (ok, that's 2 sentences)

The Law

We all know that the French see the law as a "guideline" only. They'll do whatever they want to do...... WRONG !! That has changed over the last 6 months !! There's a new Sheriff in town, and he's the new Minister of Security. The number 1 Presidential Election issue was road security, so he's got "carte blache". And he's out with all guns blazing !!

My Daily Blog on the new Sheriff

Starting this month (June 2003), if you're caught speeding 30 kms over the speedlimit, you'll loose your license for three years. Apparently, this now also applies for EC members. Speeding fines are never really taken from abroad, but apparently, the license suspension is international.

If you're caught doing 50 kms over the limit, you will go to jail for 6 months. In other words, going over the limit and getting stopped by the cops, means you'll end up in jail. No appeal !! And its automatic !!

Filtering

When riding on autoroutes (=motorways) you can (and you are expected to) pass cars in between the left lane and the next to that one. Obviously this applies when there's a traffic jam, but if the cars are driving around the same speed and there's a gaggle of them, often you can split the lane (ie lane filter).

Legally, filtering is tolerated !! That means you can do it at your own risk. If you have an accident, you're at fault !! But you will not be fined for doing it.

Caution, when there is slowed down traffic, and you are on the left lane, if a car moves to the left and puts out his left indicator, he's telling you go ahead and pass. And I MEAN he is TELLING you, it's not really an invitation. If you hang on his tail for a while and do not pass, you're going to see the car's rear window up real close !! Either pass in between or hang back. (Cars in France have gotten smart, they realise that the bikes take up value real estate on the road, and would rather see you in between cars).

Last week I saw an English Ducati group on the A13 motorway (Le Havre-Paris) at rush hour. The traffic was very dense and speeds were around 50 kph. They were lane splitting at 60 kph. There were about 30 french bikers stuck behind them. Several times the french bikers passed the british when they had a spot, and while they passed either put out one finger, cut them in, or twice slapped the Ducati rider on the back of his helmet..... It's not nice, but these guys (and gals) ride that route every day, and don't want to be held back. If you can't keep the pace, don't split the lane, but hang back....

Thank You's

When passing a car who has gone out of his way to let you through, stick out your left foot (or right one if it's the car on your right). Stick it out in a gentle way, keep it straight for a second or two. That means "Thank you but I can't let go with my hands to wave at you". Obviously waving with your hand is fine as well.

Danger Areas

There are a couple of very dangerous areas for foreign bikers. The main one is worlds largest DEATH TRAP; the Paris Peripherique. This is the ring road that goes around Paris. It's often 5-6 lanes deep (and sometimes 2), with a maximum speed of 70 kph.... theoretical !! The BP (=Boulevard Peripherique) is always full, no matter what time of the day, but during rush hour, it's a madhouse.

As on all multilanes, you'll find most of the bikers passing on the left-most and next to the last lane. Cars do try to get out of your way (remember to thank them), but often the road is very narrow.

The biggest danger on the BP are not the cars, nor the trucks, or taxis, but the other bikers !! Keep checking your six (ie rear mirror). Scooter Delivery and sportbikes are known to ride in triple digit speeds (there's even an un-official race around the BP. Current record is held by a Haya averaging 190 kph in rush hour with a maximum speed done at 280 kph). If you start your move to split a lane with a car, check to see if there's not one of the kamikaze squads moving in. They'll have no problem whatsoever to nudge out of the way, specially if you have a foreign license plate !! Believe me, I've seen it happen so often I lost count !!

If you see bikers coming behind you, move to the left (or right depending on the holes in the traffic) and stick out your right foot (or left one if you're going to the right). This means "I've seen you, pass on my right".

And remember, this is not a motorway !!! It is a Boulevard, meaning it's a road like any in the city. So if you decide to not partake in the madness, and take the right lane (the slow lane), you will have to give PRIORITY to the incoming traffic that is merging in to the BP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Saterday night after 23:00 the BP is GTI heaven. The young kids from the burbs going ot the nightclubs, drunk, and very fast. It's a place to avoid at that time.

The other danger spots are the large roundabouts, specially Porte Maillot and Etoile (but equally applies to large roundabouts in big cities). Often they have no lanes, and are a free-for-all. Etoile has as added challenge that the road is bricked, no tarmac. The simple rule is that priority has to be given to the right ! So try to ignore what's happening on your left, and concentrate on your right. However, being on a foreign registered bike, you are a target !! So try to keep one eye on your left :rolleyes:

Not so long ago, Etoile was the only place in France when you had an accident, you received half of the blame, not matter what happened. Now, the normal rules apply, so if you're hit from the left, it's their fault. Speeds are not high, but it's an ugly scene. best is to avoid it. If you have to go via Etoile, there is a 2 lane ring road around Etoile which turns counter clockwise. It start about 100 meters before the roundabout starts itself. There is also a tunnel from the Champs Elysee to the Avenue Grande Armee, avoiding Etoile.

Parking

Parking is more or less permitted on sidewalks as long as you leave plenty of space for pedestrians. If there's plenty of space on the sidewalk and you park your bike in a car space, you'll probably not like what's going to happen to the bike. Remember the French nudge cars when the park !!

The Champs Elysee is forbidden for bikes to park on !! It was the first such road that the law forbids bikes to park on the sidewalk. There are many bike parking areas in the side roads. More and more main roads in Paris (and other cities) now have bike parking areas. If you see those, it'll mean that you need to park there and not on the sidewalk.

Almost all public parking garages are free to motorbikes !!! Usually there are no signs, but when you enter the garage and see the barrier is a three-quarter length, it means you can pass through it with your bike. Or there is a special lane for bikes, marked with a motorbike symbol!

When you do park in a free garage, don't use up the car space. Either there's a special designated area of motorbikes, or there are lost spaces where you can park where a car can not park.

Greeting Other Bikers

Bikers are very solidaire in France. On the country roads you are expected to wave and return a wave. In the main big cities, this is not the case, apart from when stopping next to another bike at a traffic light. You give each other a nod.

You do not wave opposing bikers on a motorway, but when you pass another biker, stick out you foot. If you're being passed, you can stick out a foot or hand.

Most bikers will stop if they see you're stopped and appear to have technical problems. This also applies to foreign bikers. If you are in trouble with a car driver, you'll find other bikers coming to the rescue (I've had that four times already... one car driver go roughed up very badly by other bikers who came to my rescue).

Bike Cops

The Gendarme Mobile (Bike Cops) are bikers first, cops second !! They are in most cases friendly, they wave at you (or nod) and mostly leave you alone even if you breaking the law. Unless you're doing something really stupid or dangerous, you might get them saying that you're naughty and to cut it out...

Biking Areas

There are several areas that are fantastic to ride bikes in. Normandy (coast line), Alsace, Champage area, Pyrenees, Alpes, Midi and the Cote d'Azure.

So go out and enjoy yourselves..... hope this helps.
 
Mike Werner said:
Starting this month (June 2003), if you're caught speeding 30 kms over the speedlimit, you'll loose your license for three years. Apparently, this now also applies for EC members. Speeding fines are never really taken from abroad, but apparently, the license suspension is international.

If you're caught doing 50 kms over the limit, you will go to jail for 6 months. In other words, going over the limit and getting stopped by the cops, means you'll end up in jail. No appeal !! And its automatic !!

That's just curtailed my plans to tour in France later in the year......

Mike:(
 
Mike

A most useful paper, thanks!

If I may just clarify one point you make. Slightly horrified as I am that Madame Guillotine may make an appearance if you are caught just a couple of klics over the speed limit, the French authorities have no jurisdiction over UK issued licences. Whilst they can fine you, ban you from riding/driving in France or even imprison you, they cannot endorse or remove your UK licence ....yet!*

;)

Greg


You posting prompted me to check with the DVLA which I did by phone about 5 minutes ago. A couple of years ago, the DVLA did tell me that cross-border endorsements are all part of the EU Grand Plan - watch this space!
 
Greg Masters said:
Mike

A most useful paper, thanks!

If I may just clarify one point you make. Slightly horrified as I am that Madame Guillotine may make an appearance if you are caught just a couple of klics over the speed limit, the French authorities have no jurisdiction over UK issued licences. Whilst they can fine you, ban you from riding/driving in France or even imprison you, they cannot endorse or remove your UK licence ....yet!*

;)

Greg


You posting prompted me to check with the DVLA which I did by phone about 5 minutes ago. A couple of years ago, the DVLA did tell me that cross-border endorsements are all part of the EU Grand Plan - watch this space!

That's what I thought as well, but apparently in the greater scheme of things for the greater good of the european community :D things have changed, or are about to. I read in a biker mag that it's wise to watch out when riding abroad now, since the rules will/or have changed. When I was in Germany, they warned me about it. That they can now get your home country to enfore whatever rule you broke in the other EC country.

I have not been able to verify the accuracy of this, but better safe than sorry at this stage. The french have decided to make france in to another switzerland, where they will be very strict on the rules of the road. I've been riding for 3à years now, never a speeding ticket. Now, in the space of 6 months I have 2 points left on my license (out of 12)......
 
Thanks for the effort.... but without wanting to sound too lemon-mouthed.... isn't it common sense?

"Ride fast and sensibly but don't take the piss".... I thank you.
 
Invicta Moto said:
Thanks for the effort.... but without wanting to sound too lemon-mouthed.... isn't it common sense?

"Ride fast and sensibly but don't take the piss".... I thank you.

You'd be surprised.... I ride every day in France, and everytime I see a foreign plate, I'm watching out. It's obviously not only the Brits, but the British and the Irish have one disadvantage, and that's you also need to pay attention to the fact that you're riding on the other side of the road....

The warning is realy, after I saw what happen to the Duc group, that you have to be aware that French riders can be merciless with foreigners if you obstruct their passage. I'm a fast and aggressive rider in Paris, and my GS is set up for that. But I even get in trouble with the crotchrockets and squids on busy streets. I just came back 10 minutes ago from Paris. In the rain, I nearly got pushed over by a scooter-delivery service who wanted to take Porte Dauphin (like Etoile) faster than I was going.

And it's not only Paris. Try Rouen or even worse Nantes. You're better off on the B-roads... not that I want to scare people off, but just be warned...
 
Invicta Moto said:
Thanks for the effort.... but without wanting to sound too lemon-mouthed.... isn't it common sense?

"Ride fast and sensibly but don't take the piss".... I thank you.

Whereas that's exactly what you used to be able to do in France, hasn't Mike just pointed out a sea change in attitude by the French authorities - or have I missed the point of his post......

Mike:confused:
 
Mike W

Makes a lot of good points
Ive been over to france 4 times this year and have seen a rise in POLICE presence every time especially around dusk

It would seem they are having a real crack down this year

In full agreement re Nantes a real nightmare to get through
Also watch out if you use the toll Motorways!!! My mate got nicked on the A10 timed between two points over a 25 mile stretch

Ride fast but ride with your eyes open

Mike
 
Great advice, thanks. I've been to France at least once a year for the last 20 years and it's a great place to be a biker, but there's always something more to learn.

French bikers are incredibly friendly, several times I have been severely short of petrol and been escorted (after asking for help) by a rider to the nearest service station.

But... a lot of them ride like complete lunatics and seem a bit disappointed when you don't join the party.
 
HeatedGrips said:
But... a lot of them ride like complete lunatics and seem a bit disappointed when you don't join the party.

I completely agree.

A couple of years ago a very friendly squid in T shirt and shorts was very disappointed when my friend and I (RS & GS) wouldn't wheelie away from every set of lights in Rouen!

(we were just tired :rolleyes: )

Good advice from Mike, off to France next week so will take (even more) care.

Iain
 
Thanks Mike W.

I'm off to France on Saturday and the above info has probably saved me from a ban/prison term.

Last time I rode in France was about eight years ago and the approach to speeding was very relaxed. On an autoroute we slowed to 80mph alongside a pair of bike cops, looked at them for approval/disapproval and when they waved us on wound it back up to 100mph - merci beaucoup.

Mike, are the scenic D roads as hotly patrolled? Obviously speeding in towns is a no no but once we get into the countryside where / what should we be looking out for?

Cheers

Adam :beerjug:
 
I hate to say it guys, but it really doesn't sound any different to the UK scene (except perhaps the Jail bit).

Heading back from Snootys wedding ride out with two other GS riders, we were just about shoved off a roundabout by a couple of crutch rockets, and we weren't hanging about either. How far did they get ? About three cars further than us at the next set of lights

Ride the A40 from Abergavenny - Llandovery on a Sunday or the A470 anywhere from Cardiff up. By far the biggest dangers are the prats on their plastic fantastics, all thinking they are Foggy or Rossi. Overtaking on blind corners and over double white lines is considered justifiable by the speed with which they pass their victims.

Sorry Mike, but the scenes you descibe in France are every bit as bad in the UK.

The comments on the changes in the enforcement of the speeding laws are very interesting, and I am sure are welcomed by all, but I would urge would be travellers not to be put off tales of the antics of biking lunatics. We have enough of them over here anyway, but the vast majority of French and indeed other european bikers and in fact, car drivers, are IMHO far better than their British counterparts. They are far more courteous and less liable to totally unprovoked road rage.
 
Horror

As a new biker who was thinking of travelling abroad, after reading that article it sounds as if it would be safer to stay at home..no sense of adventure....lol
 
As a new biker who was thinking of travelling abroad, after reading that article it

Mike,
Go for it !

There is no more danger riding abroad than riding in the UK.

In fact I have never had so much as an anxious moment abroad, which is more that I can say for the Uk. And that includes hammering around the said Periphique on a Goldwing at rush hour in a thunderstorm, whilst trying to keep up with a certain prat who goes by the name of Nick Sanders.

Yes you can filter with a Goldwing, just watch the wing mirrors !!!
 
Re: Horror

Mick_rw said:
As a new biker who was thinking of travelling abroad, after reading that article it sounds as if it would be safer to stay at home..no sense of adventure....lol

What.. and let the b'stards win?

In Kent we have police too, amazingly you might see one every so often. If you act the w*nker in the villages at peak times, then expect the porta-radar to nab you; yet the odds are still heavily in your favour.

Ride like a knob in most of the out of town areas and have a nice day. Keep it sensible and you can ride forever and keep a Zero point licence.... I like cruising at 70-80 on A-roads, weather and traffic permitting, and (touching wood) have yet to have my licence pulled....

Common Sense is all it takes whether it's in UK, Frogland or anywhere else.....

All the same, the original work was a masterclass for us.
Paul
 
adamski49 said:
Thanks Mike W.

I'm off to France on Saturday and the above info has probably saved me from a ban/prison term.

Last time I rode in France was about eight years ago and the approach to speeding was very relaxed. On an autoroute we slowed to 80mph alongside a pair of bike cops, looked at them for approval/disapproval and when they waved us on wound it back up to 100mph - merci beaucoup.

Mike, are the scenic D roads as hotly patrolled? Obviously speeding in towns is a no no but once we get into the countryside where / what should we be looking out for?

Cheers

Adam :beerjug:

Well, I've just come back from 450 kms today. 200 on the motorway Paris-Rouen and then to the shop to have my Ricky Bars fitted (will post separate one later on) and then on D-roads back. Here's what I saw:

Paris - 2 laser radars at Etoile and Dauphin.
A14/13 to Rouen. Two patrol cars and at one Toll (peage) they had about 15 cops pulling over cars (I must have missed the radar).
Rouen to shop no problem
Shop to Home. One old radar unit and 4 separate bike patrols (not a problem).

In principle, there are far less radars on the D-roads (N in France) since they are fighting high speeds which are normal on motorways.

BTW radar detectors are strictly forbidden !!
 
Re: Horror

Mick_rw said:
As a new biker who was thinking of travelling abroad, after reading that article it sounds as if it would be safer to stay at home..no sense of adventure....lol

Remember, I said that I didn't want to scare riders off, just that you take care. If you've never ridden in france, than you will not make the mistake of doing 120 mph on the motorway, because you used to be able to.

Speeds are still higher than in the UK, it's still a lot of fun (just a little bit less).

Go for it.....
 
Dennis said:

Sorry Mike, but the scenes you descibe in France are every bit as bad in the UK.

The comments on the changes in the enforcement of the speeding laws are very interesting, and I am sure are welcomed by all, but I would urge would be travellers not to be put off tales of the antics of biking lunatics. We have enough of them over here anyway, but the vast majority of French and indeed other european bikers and in fact, car drivers, are IMHO far better than their British counterparts. They are far more courteous and less liable to totally unprovoked road rage.

Denis. That's more or less what I'm saying. The only thing is that speed has changed, since the law has changed.

France is indeed still a biker paradise!! Cars go out of their way to let you through, and other bikers look after you (apart from a few squids).
 
Riding In France

Happy to agree with all those who give riding in France the big thumbs up. Non M Way routes are usually very good with little traffic and as long as you are not behaving like a lunatic you will find the locals incredibly welcoming. I cannot remember too many English B&B equivalents that have moved their cars out of the garage so I could put my bike away! Most non M Way roads also have relatively little traffic which increases the enjoyment factor . Go for it and enjoy it cos it is sooo much better than most of what we have here

mike
 
Well Mike, it's good to hear that the French police at least seem to be taking an even handed approach to the speed enforcement. Over here it appears to be only the bike that get pulled, every other bugger gets away with it. Even the boy racers in their GTxyz's don't attract as much attention as a Nun on a Vespa !!!:hapybnce:
 


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