il Bastardo - Ducati Monster big traillie

The Other PaulG

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Well, this has been a long time brewing, but project il Bastardo is now officially under way.

How did we get here?

After a lifetime of owning lots of different bikes, I felt that I'd only be truly happy if I designed one just for me - to suit all my own preferences and to be a one-off.

I was not really sure what shape that would take until I saw what some guys in the States did a few years ago - they basically took a Ducati Monster and converted it into a big trail bike. It's an odd starting point for a traillie - granted - but to me the finished product just looked beautiful. After a long string of heavyweight adventure bikes, I like the idea of a lean, nimble middleweight bike.

Plus, I have an affection for my old Cagiva Elefant - basically Ducati's Paris Dakar vision in the 90s - and I think that in some way the il Bastardo conversion might be a purer version of what the Elefant may have become, had Ducati not gone down the Multistrada route.

Last year my planets aligned and I knew it was time to take this idea a bit more seriously.

More to follow, but here's where we're aiming:
 

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Now that looks nice Paul :thumb

Good luck with it ...

:beerjug:
 
I'm looking forward to seeing how this develops as the Yank bike is lovely (IIRC Kaister posted up some info on it a year or two ago..............then again that may have been on FB?).

Hope it all comes together Paul :)

Andres
 
More to follow, but here's where we're aiming:

Aha - that's a Terra Mostro built by Blaine Dehmlow's outfit in the San Francisco Bay Area. He very kindly offered to loan me one for a few days in 2008 when I was looking for a rental. He seemed like a really nice guy and was interested in using off-road motorcycling as a tool for personal development. I don't think they're in business any longer.
 
basically took a Ducati Monster and converted it into a big trail bike.

And created a new genre of bike the Monster Traillie...oh wait it only has 600cc not a 3 litre v6.:blast .

Great idea for a project like it!

That motor should make it a hoot a ride rather than the common single and be leaps and bounds better than an old transalp of similar vintage.
 
I don't think they're in business any longer.

That's right, they offered these for a short period but then they disappeared. I have seen Blaine's posts on advrider since, he has been really helpful to people trying similar projects, seems like a great guy.

So... the idea is to take this as a starting point, but to approach the engineering slightly differently. When I get a second I'll post some pics of the progress so far.
 
Are you using the 600 Monster or the full fat version ?

That's a good question, and one that was the subject of a lot of thought.

On one hand I don't want to build a bike then immediately wish it had more oomph.

On the other, part of the attraction of this bike is its light weight and easy off-road handling. Plus, I'm into somewhat unknown territory in terms of the chassis so let's get it right with a modest engine rather than something that might overwhelm the chassis.

Ultimately, I found a 620ie Monster in good nick (thanks CT) and felt that this was maybe a good balance.

In the meantime, to make sure the engine and gearbox were sound, I put quite a few miles onto the standard donor bike and I'm so pleased with the decision. All these years of biking, how come I never tried a Monster?

Yes it's only a 620 so it's ultimately got a power limit, but the way it delivers its power is utterly engaging and addictive. Seriously - this thing just makes me grin every time I take it out. Its power band is very broad - it's happy to pull from very low revs, then delivers a lovely smooth rush, accentuated by the gorgeous sounding carbon termignonis... when the angels (or whatever) come to take me, I expect it to sound a bit like this!

If it sounds good accelerating, it's even better on the overrun with a loud bwaaaaaah sound. I was 50 last year, ffs, I'm supposed to be over this kind of thing! :rob

Anyway.. for me it's a really great delivery, and if it doesn't have as much go as an 1100 Monster, it certainly has enough for me... and the first shot at this chassis. And my licence.

One of the biggest hurdles to the project has been my growing affection for the donor bike... my only solace is knowing that it'll be even better in a traillie chassis.
 
That's a good question, and one that was the subject of a lot of thought.

On one hand I don't want to build a bike then immediately wish it had more oomph.

On the other, part of the attraction of this bike is its light weight and easy off-road handling. Plus, I'm into somewhat unknown territory in terms of the chassis so let's get it right with a modest engine rather than something that might overwhelm the chassis.

Ultimately, I found a 620ie Monster in good nick (thanks CT) and felt that this was maybe a good balance.

In the meantime, to make sure the engine and gearbox were sound, I put quite a few miles onto the standard donor bike and I'm so pleased with the decision. All these years of biking, how come I never tried a Monster?

Yes it's only a 620 so it's ultimately got a power limit, but the way it delivers its power is utterly engaging and addictive. Seriously - this thing just makes me grin every time I take it out. Its power band is very broad - it's happy to pull from very low revs, then delivers a lovely smooth rush, accentuated by the gorgeous sounding carbon termignonis... when the angels (or whatever) come to take me, I expect it to sound a bit like this!

If it sounds good accelerating, it's even better on the overrun with a loud bwaaaaaah sound. I was 50 last year, ffs, I'm supposed to be over this kind of thing! :rob

Anyway.. for me it's a really great delivery, and if it doesn't have as much go as an 1100 Monster, it certainly has enough for me... and the first shot at this chassis. And my licence.

One of the biggest hurdles to the project has been my growing affection for the donor bike... my only solace is knowing that it'll be even better in a traillie chassis.

I have only had a 10 minute beat on a monster and it was the 600 and they are such fun so i think you will be fine with the one you have. it will be enough to make you laugh like a sick hyena
 
The chassis

So we have a Monster chassis.

On the upside, it has that beautiful trellis design.

On the downside(s), it has a headstock that's designed for a road bike rather than the quite different stresses of an off-roader - accentuated even more by fitting long forks - and it has a swinging arm that pivots directly off the relatively narrow alloy crank case. Again, not ideal. It's not what KTM do, is it?

That's pretty much the point where my understanding - and certainly expertise - reach a ceiling, so here's where we call in the first of the experts.

My friend Gavin Robertson has a long history of doing unusual things with Ducati engines and off-road chassis. :eek:

Whatever satanic concoction of cutting-edge Ducati motor and Elefant chassis you can think of, Gavin's probably done it. His specials live side by side in his garage with genuine ex-Paris Dakar bikes. So Gavin's hugely experienced in this field, and it was only when he took an interest, that the whole idea suddenly became credible.

Gavin did two things. Firstly he appraised the kind of reinforcement the chassis would need (as well as geometry alterations), then he brought in his tried and tested frame builder, James Rogers of Essex Wheels and Engineering. James has spent many years designing and building winning frames for bikes - mainly grass-track combinations - so he knows a thing or two about stresses and how to make a frame that's up to the rigours of hard off-roading.

More to follow...
 
Proof of concept

In order to identify whether this conundrum could be solved or whether it would be a dead-end, James and Gavin sourced a 620 frame and went to work.

This is where the original terra mostro and my il Bastardo start to diverge.

At the headstock, much reinforcement was deemed to be necessary, along with an alteration in the geometry and a lengthening of the head tube to bring the rider's stance more upright. The pic below shows this on the mock-up. The finished version will have more aesthetically beautiful sculpting, but similar strength. You'll also see that the steering head angle was altered, using purpose-designed eccentric press-in bearing seats. The bearings here, and elsewhere, are probably over-specced in order to make sure the whole thing's really robust. I guess you don't win loads of grasstrack races by building frail chassis...

At the swinging arm pivot, things become even more critical. The original design just doesn't seem to be fit for the twisting tresses of off-roading (and nor was it designed for those stresses). Gavin's design see the addition of heavy aluminium bracing plates, with large bearings sunk into their internal surfaces. A new spindle runs through the engine mounts, swing arm guides and the new bearings. The whole solution is super-rigid and, I think, looks great too.

As the design develops, we intend to run removable pillion pegs, rider footpegs and the side stand from these same alloy plates.

So far so good.

We've all now signed this design off as a 'go'. It's looking good.

The next step is now for me to engage the second expert - Chris Tunbridge (Tunneruk of this parish). Plenty of you are familiar with Chris's brilliant work and keen eye for detail. Chris is going to manage the strip-down phase, but far more importantly he'll be looking after the detailing (and of course painting) of the re-build stage.

Progress from here will not be rapid - we're looking at months not days - but I'll keep the thread updated as we make progress. :thumb
 
sorry, forgot the pics:

The modifications on the 'mule' frame:
 

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Will be following this with interest as I had a 750monster cracking bike, please don't get my brother on about them he had a s2r monster wishes he never sold it lovely bike
 
Monster love

I paid only £1750 for my lovely, great condition 620ie complete with probably £500 of saleable carbon bits.... in terms of fun per £, how could you possibly beat that?

As I said, the biggest risk to the project is that I've just grown to love this thing so much in its current form.

Still, CT's workshop and spanners beckon...:green gri
 
Don't forget the big fekkoff tye spikes :eek:

master-snow-and-ice-with-this-winter-ready-ducati-monster_1.jpg


EDIT.....being more serious, found this one as well :)

269c06d617c5d4df09d520ff70573689o.png
 
Definitely following this build with interest. I loved the terra mostro and tried to get a kit shipped to the UK but alas it never happened.
 


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