2008 F800GS EWS Immobiliser Fault(s) - Problem Solving Help

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Hows all,

I'm having some difficulty with my F800GS 2008 bike and as i'm exploring my working theories and eliminating potential causes, my options are becoming limited.

I'm looking to some of the experts in the club who may have had some similar issues or experience with the problems that could possibly narrow down the root cause.

Here's a brief summary so far,

Problem Statement
Engine cut out while travelling 120kph on the motorway, EWS error was displayed on the dash and the bike was unable to start again. A number of days later, the bike did start, the fault appears intermittently on start up.

Determine Root Cause
The GS911 diagnostic tool was used to carry out an evaluation of the bike, the following codes have been displayed. Once error codes were deleted, these did not appear during live running of the bike. When the bike is shut off and restarted, once EWS (sporadic on start up) has been displayed on the bike, these errors appear again.

ZFE Basic – Vehicle Electronics
2 fault codes found:
41787 Left heated grip malfunction, open-circuit
The fault is currently present.
41754 CAN-bus timeout to BMS-K (engine) control module
The fault is not present now.

CAN-Kombi-K7 – Instrument Cluster
2 fault codes found:
37651 CAN-bus timeout with BMS-K control unit
The fault is not present now.
37652 CAN-bus timeout with BMS-K control unit
The fault is not present now.

ABS8M1 – ABS Brakes
59701 CAN bus: No communication with the Engine (BMS-K) control unit
The fault is not present now.

Working Theories

1. Battery
Electrical fluctuations was a probable cause from a faulty battery cell or connections. I did notice a drop in voltage to 1.2v when EWS was live, this may be down to protection of the system?. This was ruled out after a battery test on the cells and connection check on the battery terminals

2. Ring Antenna
The ring antenna was replaced but the EWS remained, tried both keys

3. Connections
The EWS intermittent fault was turning on an off by maneuvering position of ECU out of its fixed location, not repeatable or confirmed during a short period of time of testing
More tests for bad connections, broken wires etc needed

4. Left heated grip malfunction
This has not been working for months previously with no observed faults with the vehicle

5. ABS
The ABS sensor flashing remained on while driving about 6 months ago, this was the only observable problem with it, the ABS disc is also rusty but unknown if this causes any issues other than cosmetic.
ABS fault shows there is an error somewhere.
 
Have you checked out the ignition switch? ......... http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/213964-Ignition-switch-problems-(merged-thread)

Otherwise replacing ring antenna should have sorted it. Are those battery details correct? - should it read by 1.2v or is it reading 1.2v across the battery when you switch her on. Either would look stange, but a massive voltage drop suggests either major earth/neg leakage or a failed battery. What was the testing regime? Can you beg/borrow a known good battery from a mate to retry the readings?
 
Not yet as the ring antenna was suspected as the fault initially, thanks for that link.

The voltage drop was detected by GS911 while trying to run diagnostics, the EWS error was live and once live it blocks GS-911 from running. However this popped up during one test with EWS live "Failed to communicate with controller, check battery GS-911 reports battery voltage as 1.14V: no response from controller)

The battery was brought to a specialist and tested out for everything (with the exception of a drain test) and it showed up as healthy.
 
This is looking at the EWS, which runs on a low voltage - we need someone with a manual to tell us what value to expect (does the GS911 manual tell you?. However, if it won't spark up the antenna you simply can't get past go.

Once you have checked that ignition switch for damp ingress, along with the local wiring condition, hopefully she will fire up. If not then one has to reconsider the battery condition, maybe even the stator & reg/rec. How old is that battery & what brand? IIRC BMW had problems with exide branded batteries back in the day, but surely yours would have been changed out by now. It may also be worth checking the earth/neg tags which can get corroded. It would also be interesting to know the voltage readings across the battery terminals as you switch on.
 
I'll investigate the ignition switch today and see how I get on. I'm trying to locate the manual, as far as I know, the GS911 doesn't give out the expected values.

The battery is 1- 2 years old, I bought it last year during the summer in England, its a MotoBat.

The manual would be ideal to have right now, do you know where I can get them? i've heard of a Haynes manual and BMW.
 
Here is the Haynes Manual ........... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-F800...ns-2006-2016-Haynes-Manual-4872-/182419547787. Shoud be available in Eire too. However, with the advent of canbus, these sometimes prove a tad vague when it comes to problem solving.

Motobatt you say. These are fine, but sensitive to ever being overcharged (reg/rec), undercharged by having too much loading, or if ever allowed to go flat. They need to be kept on a battery tender when the bike isn't in use. Whilst I am still interested in the voltage readings, it is always easier to drop in a known good battery, just to remove one unknown.

Good luck checking that ign switch.
 
Ews failure - common,

But luckily easy to fix -

before you go and sepend £30 odd on a replacement which may not be faulty, try the following.


Ignition off and key out


With the steering in the straight ahead postion
insert key and turn ignition to start position

Does EWS show on the kombi (dash) Y/ N does bike start Y/ N - turn ignition off remove key


Turn steering to full LH lock
insert key and turn ignition to start position

Does EWS show on the kombi (dash) Y/ N does bike start Y/ N - turn ignition off remove key

Turn steering to full RH lock
insert key and turn ignition to start position

Does EWS show on the kombi (dash) Y/ N does bike start Y/ N - turn ignition off remove key

If you get a failure in any of the positions but a start in one or more other positions, its unlikley to be the EWS ring antenna

Its more than likley a broken wire in the loom.

I had similar starten with the odd ews in the morning bit would be cleared in the evening ??

then as the broken wire separated, i could only get it to start on full RH lock - nothing at straight ahead or LH lock

I'd allready purchased a new Ring antenna and was getting the same fault when plugged in, so i new the fault was else where.


If it's a broken wire, its an easy fix, but very time consuming. i had to strip the whole of the front end & tank off the bike to

get to the loom under the headstock (R1200GS), then peel back the outer sheath until i found the broken wire -

Right in the middle of the bundle in an apparantly non stressed area -

( i reckon the cable tie round the sheath was the root cause).

If you do a search in the hexhead section you'll see the thread
 
I keen to know how you get on I have the same fault on an 2009 f800gs .
mine happened after a long stint in the shed unused . I have key on ews on dash no neutral on screen and low beam is lit up.
I have replace ring antenna ,no go
tested both new old antenna on r 1200gs ,both work fine.
took battery from r1200gs put in 800 no go r1200gs runs fine.
checked voltage of batterys f800gs 12.60volts ,r1200gs 12.50volts
but f800gs is original battery 10 yrs old I'm going to just put a new battery in due to age.
next will start looking at the lome.
pls keep us informed as to your outcome
cheers from down under
but this is where I'm at. I'm very keen to know if you have any luck
 
Unfortunately I had to have a new ecu a couple of years ago...2008 800gs

what was the symptoms you experience mine
no neutral on dash
low beam on
ews on dash
no fuel pump prime noise
warning triangle lit up on dash
no start
I would be interested to know if you had the same?
 
what was the symptoms you experience mine
no neutral on dash
low beam on
ews on dash
no fuel pump prime noise
warning triangle lit up on dash
no start
I would be interested to know if you had the same?

I honestly can't remember about the neutral, or low beam thing, but I did have the EWS note on dash, the warning triangle and no start. Didn't listen for the fuel pump. The dealers came and picked it up and back to theirs. When they got it back to the shop it started ! They kept it for a few more days and then got the no start about 2 days later. Only thing that then got it going was a new ECU (~ £750 !!!!) Hope your isn't the same. Mine was one of the first 800GS's March / April 2008
 
I honestly can't remember about the neutral, or low beam thing, but I did have the EWS note on dash, the warning triangle and no start. Didn't listen for the fuel pump. The dealers came and picked it up and back to theirs. When they got it back to the shop it started ! They kept it for a few more days and then got the no start about 2 days later. Only thing that then got it going was a new ECU (~ £750 !!!!) Hope your isn't the same. Mine was one of the first 800GS's March / April 2008

Doesn't sound good Deano, I haven't come across anyone that needed an ECU replacement until yourself.

My bike is 2008 around this period (need to confirm)

Did they say exactly what was wrong with ECU? any error codes? cost of labour on top etc.
 
Doesn't sound good Deano, I haven't come across anyone that needed an ECU replacement until yourself.

My bike is 2008 around this period (need to confirm)

Did they say exactly what was wrong with ECU? any error codes? cost of labour on top etc.

No they didn’t tell me error codes, but there have been a couple of people on this forum who required new ecu s. I think one was a 700 gs. The bill was about £750 including labour, a lot of which was messing about trying to find fault. If I didn’t get the ecu, I would have had to pay the diagnostic labour and take the bike away! Not too much choice really ! Having said that , it’s only cost servicing in 8 years up to that so small mercies
 
Thanks guys for your input I talked to my local BMW mechanic(not dealer) he said IF the ecu is at fault he is n't confident he will get his gs911 to make contact with ecu and a dealer needs to set up a new ecu to bike he can't do that without a bos machine or something.. He has been a BMW tech for the past 25yrs and I trust him more than the dealer and he said he has only come across 1 other dead ecu and the dealer has only done 4 so they are not that common here in nz but they seem common on the internet and in BMW cars. Oh why can't BMW make the awesome bikes they make I love to ride them but pls just do basic electrics to do the job with heated grips pls I would be shit scared to take a BMW through Africa only because of the electrics if something goes wrong you really are stuffed it seem to go against there robust exterior image that appeals when all this hi tech lets them down. Let the road bike have all the tech keep adventure bikes basic and streamlined.
When I think of our farm bikes they go till they fall to bits of wholly wheels and broken parts my BMWs would never stand up to the abuse they stand and you push the button and they just go and if not you can generally fix it yourself if you have the time.
.just a thought from down under.
 
Thanks guys for your input I talked to my local BMW mechanic(not dealer) he said IF the ecu is at fault he is n't confident he will get his gs911 to make contact with ecu and a dealer needs to set up a new ecu to bike he can't do that without a bos machine or something.. He has been a BMW tech for the past 25yrs and I trust him more than the dealer and he said he has only come across 1 other dead ecu and the dealer has only done 4 so they are not that common here in nz but they seem common on the internet and in BMW cars. Oh why can't BMW make the awesome bikes they make I love to ride them but pls just do basic electrics to do the job with heated grips pls I would be shit scared to take a BMW through Africa only because of the electrics if something goes wrong you really are stuffed it seem to go against there robust exterior image that appeals when all this hi tech lets them down. Let the road bike have all the tech keep adventure bikes basic and streamlined.
When I think of our farm bikes they go till they fall to bits of wholly wheels and broken parts my BMWs would never stand up to the abuse they stand and you push the button and they just go and if not you can generally fix it yourself if you have the time.
.just a thought from down under.

Just to back that up Ken, my GS-911 is locked out when EWS is live on the bike, it will not run any diagnostics, it will give a readout to turn on ignition, immobiliser is active and some other possible causes to allow diagnostics to be run.

Totally agree on all the high tech fancy electronics and additions, I'm on a 2008 model 800GS and given the electronics that are on that, I'd be afraid to go near a new 2019 model 850, I can only imagine the range of electronics on that and multiple failure modes that could stop you in your tracks. And with those failure modes, specialists and special equipment are needed.

There is a lot to be said in the engineering world that simplicity is key for longevity and reliability.

Old style GS bikes with minimal technology are great for travel, especially on adventures in the likes of Africa, my uncle has travelled throughout it many times with older model GS bikes.
 
Well good luck with yours. I talked with another BMW dealer today and he seemed very switched on which gave me confidence so booked bike in 9th march to run his tech gear over it so will wait and see . He said he would be hopeful he can get it to go without replacing the ECU and that he has only done 1 other f800gs ECU replacement to date but fixed ews faults and many different things can bring this fault up . I have to say I'm crossing my fingers but I have a feeling it will be an ECU replacement :(
I have seen people online open up the ECU and have repaired it(this guy had short circuited it by accident while fitting an accessory to battery ) and was locked out this could be an option in the UK if these tech guys are about.

I do know I guy here that might be up to it and if the ECU is been biffed I'm going to open it up and let him look at the insides before ordering the new one.
 
Hi guys.

I typed bits oft this in a PM the other day, but thought it may be useful to others...

Disclaimer: I am no expert. Take the below as exactly what it is: ramblings of a random bloke on t'Internet. It is a pointer to start googling and investigating further. My motive is only to offer info to try to offer some info to help fellow bikers.

So, that out of the way, EWS (Electronische Wegfahrsperre) can come up as an error for many reasons, but thinking logically... Simplistically speaking, the bike key holds a passive "chip" inside it with a code, it goes in to the antenna which [given that the electronic power is there] agitates the key chip and "reads" the code off the chip, sends it to the ECU, which, then, compares it with the stored value and allows the bike to be started if they match. So, components involved : Key, antenna, some wiring, ECU [and indirectly the battery].

So... if the low-beam stays on, there is no whirring from the idle-actuator, no pulse on the fuel pump and no gear indication on the LCD... those symptoms are the same as it the ECU [BMSK-P] was actually completely disconnected. It would then not be illogical to think that the ECU is not booting up. If you can use a multimeter, you can do some basic tests. Head to the smaller of the two ECU connectors under the seat. Disconnect it and do some continuity/voltage tests. If I remember the pinouts correctly (let me know if they are not as expected and I will double-check/correct the post for future reads):

1) Firstly, check that you are getting power to the ECU. You should have the battery voltage [~12V] across pin-3 (-) and Pin-6 (+). (Pin-34 should be the switched +12V [i.e. ON when IGN ON]). The belts-and-braces method is to wire a consumer (like a small automotive (12V) light-bulb) to those to check for the solid current under load.

2) Check you are getting good earth too.(continuity to the frame/engine/battery(=) @ pin 3) may as well check the brown cable going from the battery(-) to the engine on the left side, near the starter.

3) Since you are already at the ECU connector, If you have disconnected the ring-antenna, you may as well check the continuity to the ring antenna; Although that is unlikely to be the problem at this stage, If the theory is sound and the ECU is not booting up at all.
Pins 1234 @ ring antenna should have continuity to pins 8,43,55,57 on the smaller ECU connector, respectively. Numbers are cast into the connector but are very small. Top-tip: Use your phone camera for magnifying if your eyesight fails you in this endeavour. :) Ensure that there is no continuity between the ring-antenna connector pins too (in case of cables chafing against eachother)
[You may need some pins to insert into the connectors if your multimeter probes are too fat.]

If all of this is as expected, chances are the ECU has a problem and is not booting up...
Hope that helps someone...
 
Latest update

I did all I could but without a shed and time I couldn't go pulling at the bike for hours on end so I had to give in and send it to a BMW garage to sort it out, plus they gave me the new 850GS as a loan bike,

Here is the latest, and my god what have I let myself in for :-O

I was given a quote of €426 just for diagnostics so far and €935 for a new ECU (DME) but they don't know if it'll work??

I had informed the garage that I already changed out the ring antenna, battery test etc....

Unfortunately when diagnosing it is a process of elimination, so the tech would start at the cheapest component and work his way through the test schedule. See report below:

“Connected ISID tried several times to carry out quick test as unable to establish link due to EWS fault. Eventually carried out quick test. EWS not responding. Removed steering lock to investigate. Retaining clip for antenna ring Arial broken. After several attempts ignition turned on and bike started. Will need to replace pick up arial and recheck. “
 


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