DCT Rear Brake Conversion

DING-DONG said:

So a 53" brake line should route without the need to take the tank off ? Or would you use a longer line.

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Yeah 53" should be enough. I managed with a 50" but only just with nothing to spare at full steering lock.

A 55" should give you more routing options.

It'll just be fiddly with the tank left on, but it's a nuisance taking the tank off. So your choice really.

Just a point to note.

The HAT Manual version is about 10kg lighter than the DCT version.

But the DCT has all these extra parts... rear Parking Brake with cables / caliper and pads, larger Rear Brake Carrier and shield, rear brake reservoir and pipework....

Dumping all that lot must be 2kg worth.

So getting the weight down a bit more

Bloody hell I commend you for the effort to do that I couldn't be arsed!

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk

Georgeeboi said:

Bloody hell I commend you for the effort to do that I couldn't be arsed!

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Doing projects like this allow you to really get to know your bike. It's time invested so it all becomes a bit more personal and meaningful.

Also, if you crash it.... you can most likely repair it yourself at 10th of the cost that a dealer would charge.

Nice job.

Owen Snell said:

Nice job.

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Cheers

Oh..... and to note :-

In the official Honda Workshop Printed Manual, the rear wheel spacers are depicted the WRONG WAY ROUND.

The correct way is as follows:-

Left hand Sprocket side has the collered spacer

Right hand Brake disc side has the standard spacer.

Thanks to Smogbob on here find out that little gem, which kept me stalled for 3 hours today while I triple checked everything as the rear wheel kept locking up when turned, after torquing up the axle bolt......

:fucking bastard smiley here:

Finished Pics Here

https://www.ukgser.com/forums/showt...-Twin-DCT-Modified-Pics?p=5432626#post5432626

Hello @warlord. Thanks for all the info on this thread - it's been really helpful. Can I PM you with some questions about how you've found the conversion now you are used to it? I'm new to the forum and cannot see an obvious PM button?

Many thanks
Joe

Hi Joe,
You need to be a subscriber to use the PM function (£12 a year)
Warlord will be along later, and may be able to arrange other means of contact

Ah, thanks @NeilDD. I've only looked at this thread. If there's sufficient AT content here I'll happily subscribe. I'll take a proper look through later.

@warlord, I am more than happy to post my questions on this thread if that is okay. They are on my particularly unusual experience with the bike so I didn't want to bore everyone.

All the best.
Joe

Steeplechasing said:

Hello @warlord. Thanks for all the info on this thread - it's been really helpful. Can I PM you with some questions about how you've found the conversion now you are used to it? I'm new to the forum and cannot see an obvious PM button?

Many thanks
Joe

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Hi Joe,

I let my Subscription to this Forum lapse for the time being, so your Private Message wouldn't get to me anyways.

However, in answer to your question, in my opinion the conversion is brilliant. This bike should've been like this from the start.

The notable things after the conversion are:-

- The left lever isn't a clutch lever. It's the rear brake. Sounds obvious, and I got used to it immediately, but you have to warn others before they try to ride it.

- When you pull the brake lever, the foot brake lever rises. You can feel it press against your foot as the system applies hydraulic pressure. This means sometimes you need to maintain your foot position to resist foot pedal movement, to maintain hand lever pressure.

It's a characteristic, but hasn't caused me any problems.

- You no longer have any way of securing the bike from rolling away when parked. As the old cable handbrake is now removed.

I use a cable tie to lock the rear hand brake lever..... but I'm going to invest in two hydraulic line locks that are manually operated at the master cylinder end. This'll allow me to lock front and rear brake (or any combination) while parked.

WOULD I DO THIS CONVERSION AGAIN??

a) For 100% road use.. No

b) For any decent off-road use.. Hell YES

Warlord said:

Hi Joe,

I let my Subscription to this Forum lapse for the time being, so your Private Message wouldn't get to me anyways.

However, in answer to your question, in my opinion the conversion is brilliant. This bike should've been like this from the start.

The notable things after the conversion are:-

- The left lever isn't a clutch lever. It's the rear brake. Sounds obvious, and I got used to it immediately, but you have to warn others before they try to ride it.

- When you pull the brake lever, the foot brake lever rises. You can feel it press against your foot as the system applies hydraulic pressure. This means sometimes you need to maintain your foot position to resist foot pedal movement, to maintain hand lever pressure.

It's a characteristic, but hasn't caused me any problems.

- You no longer have any way of securing the bike from rolling away when parked. As the old cable handbrake is now removed.

I use a cable tie to lock the rear hand brake lever..... but I'm going to invest in two hydraulic line locks that are manually operated at the master cylinder end. This'll allow me to lock front and rear brake (or any combination) while parked.

WOULD I DO THIS CONVERSION AGAIN??

a) For 100% road use.. No

b) For any decent off-road use.. Hell YES

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Subscribe again, we love you in the B&B, hope you are better now

JohnnyBoxer said:

Subscribe again, we love you in the B&B, hope you are better now

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Yes John, thank you. Getting better.

Still got a dry cough and getting tired quick, but Louise and I are both up and about again

Many thanks, Warlord.

I'm looking at having the conversion done (am completely non technical) to give me the confidence after a couple of offs where I don't really know what I did wrong. First was on pulling in to park on the road outside my house. A couple of seconds after stopping the bike shot forward into a parked car about 3 metres away. Bike was okay and I was just bruised but I had no idea how I'd got there. I assumed I'd simply leant sideways to put the side stand down but hadn't put it into neutral and that sideways lean had led to an inadvertent slight twist of the wrist. I put it down to one of those stupid things I do from time to time and got on with it.

In early November I was putting the bike away for the winter which meant me bringing it up the long, steep, twisty path (30ft above road level) to the house. I've just returned to bikes after about 10 years away (last one was a GS1200 but I'm far from being an accomplished rider - back then or now). Anyway, near the top of the path, last bend, there was a half inch 'ramp' in the concrete. I'd been riding at walking pace using a combination of duck walking, rear brake, front brake ... clumsy stuff. I was on the rear brake and trying to just rev a tiny bit more to get over this wee ramp. Next thing I knew the bike took off. By the time it hit the garden wall about three meres away a combination of the surge of acceleration and the steepness of the path - maybe 25 degrees - had slid me off the back and onto the concrete. I was fully geared up in that I was wearing an Aerostich with all its armour in but I should have had separate back armour. I broke my pelvis in three places and my right wrist.

I've recovered well and am looking to get back on the bike. But I've been trying to find out exactly what I did wrong. On the AT forum I found a post where a rider said that the operation of the rear brake on the AT not only applied the brakes but it also substantially cuts power delivery. That would have gone a long way toward explaining things. In the 2nd accident I might well have had the throttle open say half an inch while trying to get the balance right of rear braking and power. If that rear brake was fully on and I had come off it altogether, effectively suddenly releasing not only the brake but sudden full power again, that would have explained things - assuming the AT forum poster was correct in his assumptions, though, if he was, then I'd say that's a pretty serious hazard if Honda have not highlighted it to riders.

Anyway, I thought if I got the conversion done I'd have much better rear brake control given the sensitivity of fingers versus through the sole of a boot (assuming that brake lever works as a normal brake lever does in that it only needs gradual pressure as the front brake lever does). I'm unlikely to do any off roading other than a forest track at slow speed, but I'd be more than happy to pay the necessary to have the confidence of knowing exactly how the bike will react under all circumstances.

All the best.
Joe

Hi Joe,

I've had my bike 2.5 years now, so I've got a reasonable idea how it works.

Your Incident One

I'm presuming you didn't get as far as putting your side stand down because it would've killed the engine.

So if you were leaning over the bike to look down at the side stand, you must've twisted the throttle while still in gear.

My bike is a cable throttle, but I think the newer ones are electronic throttle. Which model and year was yours?

Your Incident Two

Ideally to get over bumps, you need motion and momentum leading up and over the bump.

If you rode up against the bump, and came to a dead stop, as you then reapply the throttle to get over the bump, the bike clutch will slip.... as you increase the throttle it'll slip more.... as you increase throttle more, it'll suddenly bite and then you'll be thrust forward aggressively.

In this scenario it's highly possible you applied more throttle as you fell back off the bike. Leading to your accident.

At a guess.

However, in both of the situations above, having a rear brake lever may have helped....

But, more throttle control practice will also serve you well.

Getting over small bumps is a technique, especially using a DCT bike.

The DCT can take off pretty sharply if you're not careful.

I think that's a very fair summary @warlord, thank you. My bike is 2019. Do you think then that this claim that rear brake application significantly reduces power while it's depressed is inaccurate?

Also, is the converted brake as easily pulled as the front brake lever?

Best wishes
Joe

Steeplechasing said:

I think that's a very fair summary @warlord, thank you. My bike is 2019. Do you think then that this claim that rear brake application significantly reduces power while it's depressed is inaccurate?

Also, is the converted brake as easily pulled as the front brake lever?

Best wishes
Joe

Click to expand...

Being a 2019 model I think you've now got the throttle by wire, which is electronic.

Mine is a 2017 model which is cable (mechanical) throttle.

Reason I mentioned this, is because most throttle by wire machines have a throttle reset (calibration) procedure. Maybe you could try this???

I've no idea if applying the rear brake would also reduce engine power.... but yours being throttle by wire this is plausable.

My rear brake hand lever has same resistance as the front brake, except when I apply the rear foot brake at the same time... then it becomes stiffer to operate.