Travel insurance

It appears, as Wessie surmises that if you DID travel from your home area on a bike greater than 125cc (with no upper limit) - then you are covered?

But - as I said before, it isnt that clear, and I've seen much more concise cover/restrictions on other policies.

To me, the (atrociously badly drafted) policy reads that bikes up to 125 cc bikes are OK, providing you hold a suitable licence and wear a crash helmet and are wearing appropriate clothing and used it to ride from home.


I wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole.


If I get a chance I’ll drop into a branch of Nationwide and ask the chimps. The question is simple: Are customers insured if they are riding bikes of a cubic capacity greater than 125 cc and if so, subject to what conditions if any? I’ll also ask our in-house wordings guru her opinion. I’ll not lead the witness; I’ll simply ask her what cover is provided by the policy in respect of riding a motorcycle.
 
Very interesting thread and many thanks to those like Wapping and Blackal for their well considered and knowledgeable inputs. My travel insurance has expired and I am looking to renew it in May when I go to France for a week and the IOM in August but I will need a policy that will also cover me on a trip to Croatia that I hope to do later in the year.

You may well find it cheaper to buy an annual ‘multi-trip’ policy, rather than two singles. Assuming that is the ‘multi-trip’ policy covers all the activities you intend to carry out and destinations you intend to visit, of course.

Some good advice, ripped from the web:

Not sure when you should buy travel insurance?

When should you buy travel insurance?

The simple answer to this is ‘when your money is at risk’, in other words, as soon as you have made a financial commitment towards your trip.

If you’ve purchased a flight, put a deposit down on a holiday or paid out for accommodation, now’s the time to get travel insurance in place. Think of travel insurance as a backup if things don’t go to plan – it’s your security if you have to cancel!

When to buy single trip insurance

If you’re buying single trip travel insurance, providing the policy includes cancellation cover, you will be protected from the moment you pay!

This essentially means, that if you are forced to cancel your trip between the time you purchase your cover and your holiday departure date, you can turn to your insurance policy to recover your holiday costs (minus any excess applied to the policy).

When to buy annual multi trip insurance

Annual Multi Trip travel insurance works a little differently. Unlike single trip insurance where the cancellation cover becomes active the moment you pay for the policy, the cancellation cover on annual multi trip kicks in from the policy start date instead.

So for instance, if you pay for your policy today but don’t start it until 4 weeks’ time, you actually have no protection in place for those 4 weeks. This isn’t necessarily a problem providing you have not already booked and paid out money towards a holiday. If you have, it’s wise to start your annual policy on the same day you pay for it!
 
Seems clear to me that cover for riding a bike from home as your mode of transport is covered. Section 9 has the exclusion:

9. Motorcycles, mopeds and scooters
Any claim as a result of you using any motorcycle, moped or scooter, if:
• You do not wear a crash helmet.
• You are in control of the vehicle and you do not hold a valid licence to drive that vehicle type in your home area.
• The vehicle is above 125cc and you did not use it to travel from your home area.
• You are not wearing appropriate protective clothing.

Flipping those statements gives you the conditions in which you are covered i.e. must wear a helmet; must wear appropriate clothing (woolly as not clearly defined); must have a licence to ride that size bike and must have travelled from home on the bike (so not covered for fly-ride where you hire a bike in resort)

I read that particular line of the exclusion as saying: Excluding any motorcycle with a cubic capacity of greater than 125 cc AND of motorcycles with a cubic capacity of less than 125 cc, if you did not ride the lesser capacity (under 125 cc) bike from your home area.

My reading of the exclusion would seem to be backed by the ‘Inclusion’ section of the policy, which reads:

Included Activities

You are covered to do the activities below on your trip.

You are covered for Land-based activities:

Motorcycling (up to 125cc, crash helmet must be worn, and you must have a valid UK licence to ride the vehicle,
no cover under Personal Liability)

The important words there are ‘up to 125 cc’, followed by the requirement to wear a crash helmet, that you must have a valid UK licence and that you’ll have no Personal Liabity cover. The words, ‘up to’ also feature in relation to other activities, for example ‘Up to 3,000 meters’ in respect of trecking. There is the ability to buy ‘top-up’ cover to increase this height limitation should you wish to wander about above 3,000 meters. There is no similar ‘top-up’ in respect of motorcycles. The maximum cubic capacity is fixed at the 125 cc limitation.

There is no mention of the inclusion of motorcycles of a cubic capacity of greater than 125 cc. I think that we can be sure that they are not saying (or even implying) that you can ride a bike of greater than 125 cc or that if do, you do not need to wear a crash helmet, that you do not need a valid UK licence and that you will enjoy Personal Liability cover if you do so.


Anyway, it’s an an atrociously worded document. I would stay well clear of it.
 
Some interesting points there, and thanks Wapping for going into some detail.

A thread (maybe even a poll) asking which companies people are actually insured with could be a great help, as there seems to be a lot of grey area as to which companies actually insure you for riding a motorcycle abroad.
 
Some interesting points there, and thanks Wapping for going into some detail.

A thread (maybe even a poll) asking which companies people are actually insured with could be a great help, as there seems to be a lot of grey area as to which companies actually insure you for riding a motorcycle abroad.

Or - a thread where people add the name of the Broker offering the insurance, with the the basics of the policy without a story/comments on prev posts etc...... otherwise it becomes a monster for people to trawl through.

Broker
Annual/single trip
Cost (at the time)
Engine capacity covered.

The simpler the better, as it should only be seen as a starting point for individuals to check out which one suits themselves.
 
Pre-existing medical conditions

I have high blood pressure which is controlled using candesartan; fairly common these days.

I usually use Worldwide Travel or Post Office and was gobsmacked at the hike in the premium as I declared this. In the end I spoke to NatWest who told me over the phone that because my condition was under control I was still covered by my bank policy. Didn't get it in writing so will be checking now.

Thanks to all the contributors to this thread.
 
I think it’s a commendable idea, but it won’t work. Why?

A. Many bods don’t look at similar ‘What’s best, mate’ threads. Anything from waterproofs, to tyres, to which way to go.... each topic starts its own weekly request, often more than once in any seven day period

B. It assumes that someone will be arsed to read their policy, having only bought it because their mate says it was best

C. There are too many variables. For example, there are at least three blocks of policies available from the Post Office alone. These three blocks sub-divide down into separate policies. There are two from Nationwide.
 
I have spoken to our wordings guru....

She said her overriding view is that it is very badly drafted.

She said she can read it two ways, basically mine and Wessie’s. She then commented that a motorbike rider would, in the event of a claim, want it read in the most advantageous way to the claimant, understandably. She then went on to say that in the event of a claim dispute hitting the desk of the ombudsman, the authorities would - as far as is reasonably possible - favour the ‘innocent’ bloke on the Clapham omnibus, over the insurer. But, her view is that you do not want to find yourself injured (or worse) arguing the toss with an insurer. Much better to be certain BEFORE the event, rather than be left wondering afterwards.

Her advice, without her talking to the insurer, would be to:

A. Take the cover as it is free

B. Buy a second and separate Travel policy that clearly states the coverage available, making sure it suited your needs. As she put it, “Good Travel policies are so cheap, why wouldn’t you? Nobody is going to hang you for having dual personal insurance, providing you declare it at the time of making a claim”.

I did much as she suggested when I had dual cover: One a Post Office policy and one from HSBC, free with my bank account. It was fine I when I claimed, the HSBC claims process being much simpler than the Post Office’s who demanded I jumped through several hoops to prove I had been delayed when the Chunnel broke down. I would have to do that anyway if I wanted to cover to ride a motorcycle outside of Europe, as the HSBC policy specifically excludes it.

Her last bit of advice was that if anyone with the Nationwide policy was in any way unsure, they should check with the insurer, via the helpline number. Keep a good note (time, date, who you spoke to, the question and the answer) and, better still, ask the insurer to confirm in writing. Then do not lose the confirmation.
 
A worthwhile professional assessment, thanks.

Two things spring to mind in the above though:

1). Having two policies in place - does she envisage any issues with each underwriter arguing about primacy while a policyholder or his family is trying to effect treatment/repatriation?

2). The written confirmation of cover, supplementing the existing policy - this is something that needs to be copied/scanned and ensured that it is attached to the policy certificate/document in such a way that persons acting on the policy (the policy-holder/relatives/NOK etc) are aware of it.
(One of the reasons I ditched Carole Nasher was that they thought it was acceptable to change the wording of a policy document by sending me an e-mail explaining the reason for the incorrect wording)

Thanks for following up!
 
As far as I can see from the policy included within the link,

https://www.nationwide.co.uk/-/medi...y_Travel_Insurance_Policy-from-1-nov-2019.pdf

the policy INCLUDES coverage for motorcycling..... but, hang on.....



Then, reconfirmed in the General Exclusions:





Now, if someone can explain to me how riding a motorcycle of a cubic capacity of greater than 125 cc is covered, I’m all ears. But hey, maybe littleade rides a little bike?

Littleade rides a 1200GS LC when his wife let's him, but thanks for asking .... I posted the idea as it might just suit some on here, if it does great, if not those it doesn't haven't really lost anything and can instead buy a policy that suits their needs. FWIW I think Wessie has interpreted the policy correctly and a tosser riding from home is covered no matter what the size of the bike :beerjug:
 
Back to the OP's original question, I use Direct Travel based near Fareham.
As I have an on going medical condition (Diabetes)a full medical questionnaire was needed, but the outcome was that providing I was insured in the UK for said M'cycle then there would be no problem in either the EU or worldwide depending on which policy I purchased.

A EU multi-trip policy (trips up to and including 90 days) was £60 last year.

HTH
Neil
 
A worthwhile professional assessment, thanks.

Two things spring to mind in the above though:

1). Having two policies in place - does she envisage any issues with each underwriter arguing about primacy while a policyholder or his family is trying to effect treatment/repatriation?

2). The written confirmation of cover, supplementing the existing policy - this is something that needs to be copied/scanned and ensured that it is attached to the policy certificate/document in such a way that persons acting on the policy (the policy-holder/relatives/NOK etc) are aware of it.
(One of the reasons I ditched Carole Nasher was that they thought it was acceptable to change the wording of a policy document by sending me an e-mail explaining the reason for the incorrect wording)

Thanks for following up!

(1) Not a particular problem at all. Many people often have dual insurance without realising. For example, some credit card companies give 'Travel insurance' (often quite limited) automatically when the card is used for making the payment to the hotel or travel company. When making a claim, the insurer(s) will often ask "Is there any other policy in force?". If there is and you know there is, say yes and give each insurer the details of the other; they will sort it out quite amicably. For example, most Travel policies include death by accident. There is no limit as to how many times you insure yourself against your own death, so both policies would respond in full, as would any other quite separate life policy (or policies) you might have.

Whilst it’s easy to bitch about insurers, they are generally not there to waste their own time nor yours.

What would – without a shadow of doubt - be fraudulent would be to present a claim to one insurer for, say, your lost Rolex watch – lost on holiday - and simultaneously present the same claim under your Householders comprehensive policy and under your second Travel policy, thereby being indemnified three times over.

(2) It’s a good idea to give a copy of the policy (usually there is a simple summary) to someone you trust back at home, preferably with any amendments or endorsements. When you make a claim the first question the insurer will ask for is the policy number. Sometimes they won’t even start without it, quite understandably, as it’s their only way of finding YOU (and what cover you have bought) amongst maybe millions of others, some with maybe the same name, in the same town and maybe the same street! Not least, your nearest and dearest responsible adult will need to know who to call on your behalf and they can’t hold a séance too easily.

I called my Travel insurer (it was Zurich, at the time) without my policy number (I had their phone number at least) when I injured myself out for the day in France with my parents, who lived there. Zurich agreed to help me, but I had to give them my credit card number as security, until I got back to my parents’ place and could give them the number.
 
As NeilDD and others have said, if in doubt...... declare it!

Yes, the premium might go up. But, turn the same coin around: How much would you pay to be properly insured when you are in-extremis abroad, all alone, when your claim has just been declined for non-disclosure as you had somehow 'forgotten' your three heart attacks or that you suffered from A, B and C in the Ladybird, "Doctors' Book Of Easy to Remember Diseases and Ailments"? One hell of a lot more, I guess.
 
[SUP][/SUP]
Littleade rides a 1200GS LC when his wife let's him, but thanks for asking .... I posted the idea as it might just suit some on here, if it does great, if not those it doesn't haven't really lost anything and can instead buy a policy that suits their needs. FWIW I think Wessie has interpreted the policy correctly and a tosser riding from home is covered no matter what the size of the bike :beerjug:

You are happy, that's the main thing indeed.

:beerjug:
 
The appropriate clothing bit is vague as previously mentioned. I assume they mean something akin to not wearing T shirt, shorts and flip flops whilst riding. Whereas Jeans, jacket, gloves and boots (not necessarily CE approved) being reasonable :nenau
 
The appropriate clothing bit is vague as previously mentioned. I assume they mean something akin to not wearing T shirt, shorts and flip flops whilst riding. Whereas Jeans, jacket, gloves and boots (not necessarily CE approved) being reasonable :nenau

Underwriters are starting to require that clothing has to be ‘designed for motorbike use’. No requirement for CE marked, but your M&S or GAP jeans would not be good enough. Bike jeans by Draggit/Hornee etc - would. Gloves could be from a bike-tat stall at a local bike show, but (as far as I believe) - they would still be ‘designed for bike use’. Jackets - similarly.

Don’t forget that gloves in France require to be CE-approved (so don’t cut the tabs off)

That said - I think an underwriter might have issues in claiming that your lace-up rigboots were not designed for bike use against an assertion that they provided more protection than many ‘bike boots’ - but I’d rather be in a position of strength than have to argue with them from a hospital bed.

Maybe some underwriters will hold back on such requirements, but they tend to like to have a finite assessment of their exposure to risk - hence they like these limitations. (And limitations that are clear-cut and unambiguous). They have to draw a clear line in what protective clothing they require, and ‘seem’ to have it right at: “Requires to be clothing designed for motorbike use”

Might happen in the future that CE-marking is required - who knows? (Or maybe that becomes a European Law, like helmets)
 
The appropriate clothing bit is vague as previously mentioned. I assume they mean something akin to not wearing T shirt, shorts and flip flops whilst riding. Whereas Jeans, jacket, gloves and boots (not necessarily CE approved) being reasonable :nenau

It’s as vague as YOU want to make it.

If you were in a no-fault collision with a car, sending you flying down the road in your shorts and T-shirt, a judge might well rule that you had - in some part at least - contributed to your injuries. As a consequence, he might reduce your award accordingly. It is only reasonable that an insurer might well take the same course of action should you just slide off your bike whilst hooning in the same clothing. The good news is that the hospital that will probably end up treating you probably won’t care but they might just enjoy scrubbing your arse cheeks with a wire brush and industrial bleach to get rid of the gravel; more than you anyway.

Of course you can ring up to debate the issue with your insurer and then wonder (moan) why they charge £30 when you next call to change your registration number, which only takes a second. You might even get them to say that it has to be clothing X, Y and Z. But you are now possibly at a disadvantage. Before you didn’t know and could potentially argue your case but now you do know (as you have insisted on being told) should you fail to have worn X, Y and Z when you only nipped down the road for a minute and fell off (diesel, natch).

Whilst you are on the phone you can also debate the old biker favourite of: “What’s a recognised road?”. It seems that some would not recognise a road, even if they saw it; which is worrying.
 


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