SAT suspension is the best !!!

not sure if I posted a follow up...

they agreed to swap out the rear shock at low cost… so its now the later part and guess what, exactly the same (as in crap)

So I went back and we got 3 bikes out all the same model 1290 super adventure, 33ltr petrol tank, 19" front, spoked wheels, trail tyres, WP active suspension, all the toys etc. The tech didn't even know how many modes the bike's have, even suggesting "may be it doesn't have an off road mode" !!! (they are all supposed to have 4 suspension modes: Off Road, Comfort, Street, Sport, but after dealers flash bikes they seem to go to some random mix and match disaster), nor did he know that you can put the bikes into a mode to display cluster software version (and each was running a different version...) it only relates to the cluster and not the software in the rest of the bike, however for me, its indicative dealers don't know what they are doing / they aren't flashing the whole bike correctly to save workshop time!!!

All built within 20 months of each other
1) an early 2015 (9k km) bit of a dog, was just sold approved used.
2) a late 2016 (mine 7k km) mint
3) an early 2017 (4k km) mint

the suspension on each behaved completely differently and NONE of the bikes were remotely close to acceptable. I think the issue results from dealers flashing bikes with the wrong software (maybe trying to unlock more power from the more road focused models) or they are just stupid / lazy and early bikes were really shit

forgetting the random joke that is how poor the engine map is, the random power output pre / post / or post again flashing or that the nanny support was increased and has ruined the bike, here's just the incompetence regarding the suspension:

bike 1) front forks: displaying a known fault on early bikes. noisy, rattley, harsh, stiff, little movement. Modes didn't do much in way of change, disgusting trash fit for the bin
bike 2) front forks: silent, smooth, plush. Modes: Off road OK, the rest are wrong but if you didn't know better you might think it was OK, lacking compression damping in street and particularly in sport (best of this bunch if you ever wanted to go off road... but half as good as they had been, after breaking them doing a software update)
bike 3) front forks: little determinable change in damping or movement between modes, fork action very firm, but well damped and moves smoothly and quietly. No Off Road mode, (clearly only suitable for fast road use).

so basically a mixed joke, now the back

bike 1) Rear Suspension: long travel, compliant well damped movement, with noticeable softening of action in Off Road damping mode. (exactly how I would expect all three bike’s to behave – its rear had a similar response and travel as the front of my bike used to have before a software update ruined my forks)
bike 2) Rear Suspension: with new damper unit fitted. Too little compliance, heavy damping in all modes, Sport, Street and Comfort were identical. Off Road mode slightly softer, but I would say this mode is closer to what the bike should have in Sport mode for road use
bike 3) Rear Suspension: heavy damping in all modes with Sport, Street, Comfort and Off Road all identical. Clearly both front and rear suspension has no Off Road damping modes at all, as is, both front and rear suspension on this bike is only suitable for fast road use.

So there you go, it appears the dealers and or KTM have mix & match software which they don't even seem to be able to write and or apply to the bikes correctly.

The one good guy they have in service reception (when he's off guard, did state they have flashed bikes and lost modes and or not been able to get them to behave correctly and owners have been upset about it). I wrote to KTM Austria about these findings and they said it might take a while to investigate and answer my questions !!! Still waiting

My 1290 SAS seems fine, good difference between modes and no clunking.

My 1190 went weird "soon after" a service, as in I noticed odd stuff like the RHS clock did not show the same suspension mode as set on the LHS LCD panel, but you could feel the difference so it was changing modes OK as indicated on one side of the clocks.

Bike out of warranty and KTM reckoned it needed new clocks, but dealer stuck by me and in the end KTM Austria "dialed in" to look at the issue and managed to fix it remotely, I don't think the dealer cocked it up (They sell / maintain enough of these things) and they tried re-loading from scratch again before going back to KTM.

I think sometimes it may be dealer / mechanic related if they don't have the sufficient knowledge on how to update these bikes, but I also think the KTM systems are often under-developed and full of bugs (as are most things in this word of marketeers and bean counters running the show)

This crap does put me off KTM a little, but most manufacturers (certainly European ones) aren't much better and use us as free beta testers (well, ones that pay for the privilege) but the day my dealer fails to back me or get the right result will be the day I never buy another KTM, until then I will buy any KTM I really like on the test ride.

I have to say that my unease on the 1290 GT was probably down to the suspension

I never ever felt confident on it despite the fact that it never put a foot wrong really but it always felt just a little too edgy despite trying all the different modes

always felt track ready rather than road

RedRick Esq. said:

I have to say that my unease on the 1290 GT was probably down to the suspension

I never ever felt confident on it despite the fact that it never put a foot wrong really but it always felt just a little too edgy despite trying all the different modes

always felt track ready rather than road

Click to expand...

All things mentioned on a road test I saw of the new one which is much more compliant.

I had a similar issue on my 1190 - what had ben very compliant suspension suddenly became very firm and uncomfortable. Changing modes made no difference. Tried 2 dealers and they both assured the suspension was working correctly - I had been riding the bike for 12k miles and knew there was a problem! But no sensible response for the dealer - I relied their demo bike and it was just as uncomfortable as mine.
As the bike was nearing the end of warranty I changed to a new 1290 SA. The suspension on this never gave any problems but I P/exed soon after expiry of warranty for a bike with manual suspension.

on another forum they had a pop, so I added another post

" In my riding group there are multiple SA Mx champs, some couple MX des nations guys etc and they have never experienced the issues with the 1290's or KTM in general like you have. #justsaying"

jolly good, maybe the software u get is OK....

mine was (more or less) OK until a "safety recall" came along and the whole bike was flashed with an update. After that these changed:

Severe Engine stutter on / off closed throttle in heavy traffic - almost imperceivable improvement in Sport - which it desperately needed as was unusable, but now its slightly worse in Comfort!
Engine performance now a joke. From frankly unbelievable and bonkers mental in to a lawn mower. Went back re flashed and it now has half of what went missing back again

Leany over & nanny mode assistance... From 200mm continuous wheelie from rest to 160kph, if u nail it through the gears (with it farting and stuttering as it stops it accelerating like I want it to with 500mm of air), in to a complete embarrassing mess. It now gets 100mmm of air and turns it off, wheel comes down, power comes back on gets a 200mm wheelie, more intrusive assistance, wheel comes down, comes back on, 300mm wheelie and just as you thought thank f*ck for that, it will now just go down the road normally like it used too (as we're at 120kph and it will be running out of go), in comes intrusive assistance again ! So rather than just doing what you want, the bikes computer creates a series of small scruffy wheelies making it look like you can't ride (and pissing you right off as you know it used to be OK !!!).

Then you get the nanny leaning over traction interference cutting power trying to come out of a bend like the shit that BMW have on the GS LCs. It never did that before, never needed it and I don't want it.

Then we get the suspension.

Since the updates the front has gone from OK but sportier modes needed more compression damping, to having less compression damping ! and mental random behaviour sometimes taking 20 minutes to swap over when you've changed it

The back was always virtually solid. With off road as stiff as I'd want on for hard road use and three others that were all the same (ok on a track and nowhere else). After the software update no change at all on the rear. Went back 5 times, in the end swapped out for the later rear damper, almost no different - with no soft plush of road compliance that is clearly there on one early 2016 bike they had (and not on a later one either !).

Its been flashed three times and was rechecked with them claiming the system says nothing to update, when the new rear damper was fitted.

So you disable all the nannies and the terrible throttle modulation from its fly by wire system makes it extraordinarily difficult to dial in the right power level. Half the time I'm trying to judge if the power went walkabout because some cretin stole it, or if the computer just doesn't want me to have it today (so intentionally ragging it for all its got trying to understand power characteristics and max go rather than focusing on whether the front has 900m of air or not) - which gets fairly exciting. As the only place I can do it means narrow, worn out joke roads with corners and usually some woman on the wrong side of the road trying to kill you). Or I just want to ride it fast like I can on the GS with no effort whatsoever But this is always much slower, and it wants a f*cking fight all the time. The old electronics used to do it just about OK for you and if the rear shock had had SOME movement maybe it would be able to keep up with a GS.

It all stems from the idiots who have the first third of its throttle mapping so wrong it basically needs the electronics to calm it down, but the update has now gone from well judged to nanny having a moment. Its killed the front suspension and not given me a sensible off road or comfort choice at the back (just permanent off rode on the front and two tarmac sporty options at the back). They are clueless retards !!!!

reading those posts suggests it could be intentional....

slow it down and make the suspension stiff, offer a test ride on the current model and magically its smoother faster better.

Anyone ever got any traction pushing these ideas to an audience big enough to get KTM to wake up. Not only would that not be cricket- its highly illegal and were not talking minor differences but total transformation and more dangerous !!!