France 10days ish

Dirty Ming

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Righto, at the risk of getting grief from Wapping et al, I'm after some suggestions for a trip I'm hoping will come off this September.

Things it must include:-
Departing and returning via Plymouth/Roscoff

At least one night in La Rochelle

A visit to Oradour-Sur-Glane

Millau Bridge

Any car or bike related museums, events, etc that we can do on days off.

Obviously nice roads, but no narrow gorge type ones as we'll be .........in a BMW Z4. Not quite a bike I agree, but it's the only BMW I'm going to have that can take 2 people and it's nearly as much fun as my KTM, plus we can share the driving. I've been told this trip isn't all about flying round mountain bends but Madam Ming would like to have some time out of the car and visit some interesting places. Now, I'm not too steady on my feet and can't walk long distances, especially in heat, so she might be walking around Oradour on her own. I've already seen it but would like to visit again if I'm up to it. I'd really like to take in some bike or car action if there are any events going on that would still go ahead in the current climate. I realise most would have been cancelled so if there are any bike or car museums, collections etc that are open I could plan a route joining them up. I fancy seeing the Millau bridge as it was shrouded in mist and was pi$$ing down when we went on the bike a few years back. Could possibly spend a few days in the Pyrenees as she's not been there. Maybe take in a visit to a winery or brewery:beerjug:

So far I'm looking at getting in at 3pm to Roscoff on the Sun 30th Aug, stop somewhere about 6pm.

Day 2 to La Rochelle and overnight

Day 3 poss again in La Rochelle and overnight near Oradour.

Day 4 take in the visit to Oradour and on southwards. This is where I need help! I've no idea where to go and what to see from here on until we return on Sat 12th Sep ton a 3pm sailing. Ideally no toll roads and as few large towns as poss (unless they have the aforementioned attractions in them). Also want a couple of non driving days if there are places you could recommend to spend some time in, maybe taking in a train on a scenic line or a city open top bus tour. We've done both in Barcelinoa and they were great days off the bike - we're open to suggestions! Defo not sun worshippers so no need to visit the Med coast. We're in a Z4 and the roof will be down as long as it ain't raining so there won't be much room in the boot so hopefully won't need to visit many shops......

I'm sure I can rely on your collective knowledge of things to do and places to stay/visit that I'd spend days and days on Google and various forums tyring to find out. I'm rather busy at work and dealing with a dying mother and my beloved spaniel so don't have a lot of spare time on my hands right now.

Many thanks in advance,

Ming
 
I’d suggest the BMW Z4 owners club forum, as this is a site dedicated to bods who ride awesome Adventure steeds. I presume they go away, too?

Before we do anything, do something to help yourself. Go to Kurviger. Select the second routing mode from the choice of four. This will exclude motorways but not at the expense of adding in goat tracks. Put in the places you know and the start / end points. Look what it spits out. That is near enough your direction of travel but not necessarily the actual roads.

Then spend a couple of pounds buying Michelin’s 726 map. This is created exactly for what you need. On it you will see the green ‘Bis’ tourist roads. These are signposted all the way across France. Match these to the route spat out by Kurviger or by Google maps, Excluding motorways, option, either will do.

Things to see? Well you‘ve got the only two UKGSer approved, ‘Must do’ sites in France. There is nothing else. If you don’t quite believe me (you’d be wise not to) just trolly along to the Michin app and they’ll list out everything and anything on offer, pin pointed to exactly where you are or where you ask it to look around.

It looks like this:

5294ceed544b4d4ba426e9e718826473.plist


Find something that you (and your legs) would like to see.
 
I’d suggest the BMW Z4 owners club forum, as this is a site dedicated to bods who ride awesome Adventure steeds. I presume they go away, too?

You can be an irritating tosser at times however other times you can be quite amusing, today being one of these times. :D
 
You seem to have the first few days sorted.
Millau town itself is fairly pleasant
East of there you have the Tarn & Jonte Gorges. Not all of the roads are single lane goat tracks. Meyrueis is a great spot to settle for a day or two. It's where 2 rivers converge and has half a dozen hotels to choose from. Mine was the Hotel Europe. Daytrips around the valleys and viewpoints or just dick about in the village.

Working your way north from there via Puy Mary to the source of the Dordogne at Mont d'Or or nearby La Bourboule. Take a bus tour to the top of Puy de Dome outside Clermont Ferrand as they no longer allow you to drive up there. I rode up there in 1995 before they closed the road to traffic.

Stop in Blois on the Loire where you can do day trips to Chateaux before heading back to the coast.

There you go, you can choose the hotels and joint the dots as it's not like you don't have time to do some research
 
Rather than 2 nights in La Rochelle, what about at least one on Ile de Re ? Close to La Rochelle but not so manic.

I can recommend Hotel Le Galion in St Martin de Re.
Owner is a biker,free garage parking,or at least he’s never charged for 2 wheels .

Lovely setting.
 
A week later and you could have gone to see qualifying for the re-scheduled Le Mans 24 hour race on the Friday, before your departure on the Sunday. It would have worked out quite neatly.
 
This is what your route down sort of looks like:

863b7b189e3f369c06bb0a4874611ea1.plist


You can pretty quickly see that, in your time available, your return is either:

1. West to Bordeaux and up, the blue line, or

2. Up to about Le Mans’ish and then west-north-west’ish, the red line

Both routes have their merits.

What you might notice is that there are motorways running parallel to both lines. There is nothing wrong with French motorways in a car. Use them to save time and spend longer at places you want to see.
 
Thanks guys, very helpful.

The Z4 owners club spend more time polishing than driving and don't often go abroad, apart from driving down the motorway to their second homes in Spain. I have a KTM for biking adventures but the wife's given up riding pillion hence the Beemer.
Dates are fixed as she can't change her holiday which is a shame as I think she'd like Le Mans lunacy.

I'll have a look at those recommendations later, thanks
 
Try the KTM owners club forum? They MUST go away sometimes, surely? No? OK, looks like UKGSer is THE source of help on all topics.... :D :beerjug:

Please do not read the following as an attack on you. I set it out simply as a reminder to lots of people who ask for the same and very often much more.

What posts like the opening one maybe overlook is that it’s actually quite hard to plan other people’s holidays. Great non-motorway roads to ride, things to see and do, places to stay, if it’s to be done properly, takes time. Go to a bespoke travel agent for a holiday and they’ll spend time asking you what you really want and charge you for the output. Yes, you can get recommendations to see the 24 hour car museum or the vineyards of Bordeaux or whatever but sometimes they are many many miles apart, they may take a day (or even just a morning) to see, which all eats into the time available to get home (in this example only) from Millau via Roscoff, avoiding motorways, a minimum of 700 miles, with a return route different from the way down. 700 plus miles is a long way for someone to sit down and find ‘nice roads’ (obviously) and then find places to stop in and then marry them up with things things to see and do.... and still somehow get someone (totally unknown to them) back to THEIR ferry on time. You don’t have time, why might someone else have time or even the inclination to do it?

For understandable reasons you are short of time between now and September but sometimes you do have to make time for your holiday. Let’s see how you might make some time by cheating. In fact it’s not cheating at all. All you are doing is tapping (literally) into help - other than what is available from UKGSer - that is out there.

Here is an example. Everyone loves Michelin maps, with their green flanked ‘Scenic’ roads. The same company has a wealth of experience and products available to help everyone and anyone. Anything from the very simple but excellent 726 tourist route map (though it took a lot of effort and imagination on Michelin’s part to create the map and physically signpost the actual ‘Bis’ roads), through many great guide books, umpteen other different maps and now a great FREE app. As an example only, here is how to use the app. Have in mind that I did all this on an iPhone, from my bed, in minutes, just to how quick and easy it can be. Here goes:

Go to the App Store and download the app. I use an iPhone and an iPad it works well on both. The Michelin website also works well on a home pc. The advantage of the mobile app is that you’ll probably not have your home pc with you on holiday.

When installed, app button looks like this:

f2e41d3b6c32a7ba6235c82a76fd38c7.plist


When you open it up, type in your start and end points, taking care that you use the correct place name as it’s not entirely unknown for two towns to share the same name. If the route offered up looks bonkers, you’ll probably know what you have done. You can add intermediate locations or move places up and down the list, too. In this example I just used the basic, Millau to Roscoff. Before you hit the button for the app to run, scroll down to set your preferences:

41a958a2b174ae1e752a1ab28aa95883.plist


55833769d20b79c9d8cae2233ca809b9.png


The app will then spit out a route for you:

c8b1a4964059e2810a13a13020270413.png


Now comes the clever bit. You can zoom into the map and / or use its buttons to find suggestions on places to stay and things to do. Here is me zoomed in near Chinon and the ‘sites to see’ button circled:

48a29f777855c6545745a2283a1d2f0e.plist


Tap on the ‘sites to see’ button and markers appear:

b79f687ec3b42aef4a5886f311bd7941.png


Zoom in and the markers expand out:

5e5f205ee315e522609c0f06272a1d0d.png


Tap on a marker or look at the drop down list:

ff164455c58a810e4b84fd0fbe3882a3.png


See something you like? Great. Ask the app to take you there:

a07e0ae4a366602f84a292afe3e7e893.png


You can do this wherever and whenever you like along the 700 mile route.

Don’t like the road that the app generated? OK change it, either on your own paper map or by whatever method you find easiest.

It took me longer to type this lot on an iPhone, scribble on the pictures and switch into Tapatalk to post them than it did to play around within the app. It is that fast and easy to use. Could you use it to make an entire holiday? Yes. Does it require a bit of effort on behalf of the holidaymaker? Yes, but as a reasonable alternative to simply asking some unknown third party to spend their time creating your holiday for you, it is a very valid one. The opening post is several hundred words long. That took time, so time is available, despite all the challenges. Use some of it profitably.

Cheers,

Richard
 
Thanks for taking the time for that, Richard - much appreciated.

I have downloaded both that Michelin app and also the one in green for places to visit, so will have a look at filtering out what we're not interested in and focus on what we are, then plot a route. I think my preference, seeing as we're going to visit La Rochelle and Ourlande, is to continue south to take in some of the Pyrenees, then hed northeast towards Millau and north west via Le Mans back to Roscoff. I've also had a look at the Le Mans schedule and am looking at including a visit on at least one of the days the event is open.
Didn't know about the Michelin app and am a bit old school and enjoy looking at maps and as my France one is a bit out of date I'll get the one you recommend.

Thanks all, Andy
 
Excellent. Let us know what you settle on and, more importantly, how it all goes.

Best wishes to mum and the dog.

Richard

PS You'll see that the 726 map is really very good for clear outlines of the main motorway and non-motorway (including 'Bis" roads) across a very big country. It is though useless if you want to find a small village (even some towns) and lots of roads, simply as it strips them all out. People ignore it as they always head towards the most detailed maps they can find, which are great if you want to see lots of small roads and places, nowhere near where you want to go. The other useful things about 726 are:

a. It clearly marks the payage barriers before cities, between which the motorway is feee but usually pretty fast. Only a really stubborn biker mate would ignore a free motorway in preference to slugging through Nancy, Boulogne or Lyon.

b. It marks the free 'airs' on the motorways. These are usually of pretty good quality, part of which you pay for through the much moaned about payage fee.
 
As you say, doing high mileages on a motorway in a car is infinitely preferable to doing them on a bike and also the less time I'm stuck in traffic the better. I've done Spain and Portugal for the 3 years on a bike and have got used to how easy it is to make progress. Then I went to the Vosges region with a mate on the bikes and couldn't believe how slow the progress was through many French towns, due mainly to the proliferation of speed bumps on the entry to many of them. Not so bad on the bike as you can whip past a lot of it but not so good in a car.
Have emailed the LeMans circuit to see what my options are as they will do a free ticket for my wife (as carer) and free parking, hopefully somewhere near a grandstand. I'll take my earplugs....
 
It will be interesting to see what the ACO say.

I go to Le Mans for the 24 Hour car race each year. This year will be very different (not least it's having to be run September, not June) as the Friday now has the new idea of hyperpole qualification, as opposed to every other year when nothing at all happens on Friday on the track.

Assuming it is the same as the Thursday of a normal race year, the grandstands (except for the ACO stand) will be free on a pot-luck basis. I see that the disabled / assistsance parking is near the main entrance. https://www.lemans.org/en/news/spec...th-open-arms-at-the-24-hours-of-le-mans/49293 . If I were a gambling man, they will (and indeed should) police the 'Blue badge' requirement pretty thoroughly.

Getting in and out by car is not too bad, though because Friday is now the new Thursday, if you see what I mean, there may be more people than might have been around for a Thursday practice / qualifying schedule. One thing is for certain, the hotels in Le Mans will probably already be fully booked and / or bloody expensive. We once stayed about an hour and a half hours north of the circuit, where rooms were easy to find and regularly priced; I think I got us seven twin rooms there without too much difficulty.

Here is a link to the full revised and apparently final 2020 timetable:

https://www.autosport.com/wec/news/150037/new-condensed-fourday-2020-le-mans-timetable

The Thursday will be good, trust me, a full day crammed in. Friday would be good, if you can get there early as it finishes around lunchtime. You could clear off afterwards (take the motorway) and continue your return journey onwards towards La Rochelle to catch the boat on Sunday.
 
We're just planning a ten day jaunt to the Pyrenees in late August (and keeping fingers firmly crossed) in the German convertible of choice, the SLK 250. :D

Our route is aimed more at spending time on the Spanish side of th Pyrenees, so getting through France will include a long-ish roof up motorway day on the way out and the way back, follwed by some non-motorway roof down days at a more relaxed pace on quieter roads. A couple of previous favourite places will feature on the journey, including the Gorge du Tarn and the Coteaux de Champlitte for my favourite wine.
 
May be just me but I was very disappointed with our visit to Oradour-sur-Glane.

Of course it is all very sad and the graveyard with photos of some of those killed is deeply moving - and the history is of course tragic but I think there are much better sights to see and things to do.

I have never seen so many Singer sewing machines in my life.
 


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