license - insurance question [not bike related]

Tractors are go said:

I know, but you often have a better insight than most.

Yes, you have to declare most medical conditions.

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You are imagining things that are not real again.

You really do not need to declare most medical conditions to an insurer. There is a defined list of 7 conditions that might need to be reported to DVLA. Sometimes it is only necessary after a doctor instructs you to e.g. most people with well managed diabetes will not need to inform DVLA.

The list of the conditions is at https://www.gov.uk/driving-medical-conditions - you will note the 7 conditions that are listed. I believe the Black's Medical Dictionary lists thousands of other medical conditions that are irrelevant as far as motor insurance is concerned.

Sometimes, as with my sleep apnea, you are told by a doctor to self declare but DVLA will write to the consultant. If the consultant writes back and deems the condition well managed you will get a letter back from DVLA saying they are satisfied your condition is well managed and your driving is unaffected. This check will need to be repeated in 3 years but for those 3 years I do not need to declare this condition to insurers.

wessie said:

You are imagining things that are not real again.

You really do not need to declare most medical conditions to an insurer. There is a defined list of 7 conditions that might need to be reported to DVLA. Sometimes it is only necessary after a doctor instructs you to e.g. most people with well managed diabetes will not need to inform DVLA.

The list of the conditions is at https://www.gov.uk/driving-medical-conditions - you will note the 7 conditions that are listed. I believe the Black's Medical Dictionary lists thousands of other medical conditions that are irrelevant as far as motor insurance is concerned.

Sometimes, as with my sleep apnea, you are told by a doctor to self declare but DVLA will write to the consultant. If the consultant writes back and deems the condition well managed you will get a letter back from DVLA saying they are satisfied your condition is well managed and your driving is unaffected. This check will need to be repeated in 3 years but for those 3 years I do not need to declare this condition to insurers.

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I shall qualify my general statement for you, if you are specifically asked about medical conditions or treatments, by your insurer, you have to reply truthfully and the best of your ability.

Your insurer can ask whatever questions they decide.

DVSA however are a different matter, you are conflating two different organisations, as well you know.

If, DVSA are accepting of your medical conditions then you maybe licenced further, this does not mean that an insurer will take a similar position.

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Tractors are go said:

I shall qualify my general statement for you, if you are specifically asked about medical conditions or treatments, by your insurer, you have to reply truthfully and the best of your ability.

Your insurer can ask whatever questions they decide.

DVSA however are a different matter, you are conflating two different organisations, as well you know.

If, DVSA are accepting of your medical conditions then you maybe licenced further, this does not mean that an insurer will take a similar position.

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the question is most likely along the lines of "do you have any conditions that you are *required* to notify to DVLA" not "do you have *any* medical conditions" so linking the 2 organisations' policies is pivotal to the underwriting risk. The insurer cannot ask you for any information, only information relevant to underwriting the policy. They will not need to be informed of your halitosis or fungal toenail.

You may wish to refer back to Wapping's post. Insurers are generally quite reasonable and work in a highly regulated field. They are not going to concern themselves with the minutiae of your ailments unless they might have an impact on the underwriting process. If they start asking questions that are not relevant to their underwriting then their regulator is likely to question this.

wessie said:

the question is most likely along the lines of "do you have any conditions that you are *required* to notify to DVLA" not "do you have *any* medical conditions" so linking the 2 organisations' policies is pivotal to the underwriting risk. The insurer cannot ask you for any information, only information relevant to underwriting the policy. They will not need to be informed of your halitosis or fungal toenail.

You may wish to refer back to Wapping's post. Insurers are generally quite reasonable and work in a highly regulated field. They are not going to concern themselves with the minutiae of your ailments unless they might have an impact on the underwriting process. If they start asking questions that are not relevant to their underwriting then their regulator is likely to question this.

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The insurer can ask anything they want too, whether they will is a different question entirely. If it came to a major claim they will most definitely be looking at all the information provided.


The point was, if the insurers do not ask about it cannot be used subsequently as a failure to disclose, as they did previous.

Taking someone with type 1 diabetes, they would have to advise that they have notified DVSA, and that they are allowed to continue driving.

What if you are type 2, do you still tell the insurer, even though dvsa don't require you to advise them. What if you've never been tested and have no idea you're T2, although you show all the usual symptoms?

What about someone with MS, they're required to advise Dvsa and tell their insurer, suppose they're undiagnosed at time of policy inception.

They have the occasional trip/blurry vision/incontinence all of which they put down to overwork/tiredness/drinking too much alcohol. They never suspected MS

Suppose your mighty steed is quicker than all your mates bikes, is due to it having been tuned by a previous owner, even if you have no idea.

What answer do you give ?

You can only answer the questions asked, and if you're not asked, or it is outwith your knowledge, isn't your problem.

Which was the reason that the EU changed the regulations to what they are now.

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wittenham said:

Thanks all for the input. Let's assume I pass the test [otherwise, this is all academic].

- I passed my test on a manual in Canada in about 1978 [the manual bit is now irrelevant, because of the next point]
- I swapped my Canadian license for a British automatic-only in 2000
- my UK license has a code showing that I exchanged my Canadian license, but not the date I passed in Canada
- by coincidence, the UK license code for auto-only is 78 [the same as my first license pass], which had me temporarily excited about having a dated pass record

So, the open questions:
- can I drive the pre-97 pass heavier vehicle? [8250kg]? I think the answer is probably 'no'. There is no record of the date I passed the Canadian test, it may have been in 1999 for all the British authorities know.
- if, after passing, I insure a manual vehicle, how do I answer the 'number of years i have held a license?' question - I think it has to be <1, because it is relevant for the type of vehicle [same as if I had just passed a motorcycle test]. Ideally, the insurance company would do the risk calculation for someone in my situation, but i suspect they do not get enough of these examples to bother.

Lessons from this:
- it would be nice if DVLA would answer their phone, rather than auto-disconnecting. Or if that online help thing was actually online.
- tests are on an eight month waiting list, anyway
- see, what a mess: that is what comes of allowing immigrants into the country

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Update... after speaking to my insurance company, the situation is that when [if...] I pass my manual test, my license start dates flips to 2020, meaning I can now only get insurance as a new driver, unless i can somehow convince DVLA to change the date they will put on the license. The poor chap on the phone did concede that it was a bit odd that i would get >10 years NCD when I only had a license for [apparently] a few months....

To be clear, what this means is that the insurance I pay them currently for the auto box car would go up dramatically because i would change from a ~20 years of experience [in the UK] driver to a new one. Sigh....