2020 KTM 1290 Superduke vs 2019 1250 GS-HP

Today I had a chance to ride a almost new (less than 1000 miles) EU-5 1290 Superduke my local dealer traded in by a guy who had bought too much motorcycle...He traded it on a R Nine T...Anyways on paper the Superduke is way superior to the 1250 GS being 40 kilos lighter and having 40 hp more...I was really excited to put it to the test to see what the so called "Beast" that is "Ready to Race" is all about Anyways took it on a twisty back road I know well to see how it compares to my stock 1250GS with ADV "sports" suspension and BMW cast wheels in stock 19" front & 17" rear sizes.
The 2020 Superduke 1290 was stock except for a Arrow pipe.My GS has a Akrapovic EU-3 pipe.Tires on the KTM are the sports Bridgestone 22 while I run Continental Trail Atack 3 on my GS...Anyways the KTM is actually pretty comfortable and the sound is pretty quiet even with the aftermarket pipe.Nothing wrong with the brakes either (Brembo Stylema) but the engine needs 4000 rpm to pick up cleanly while the GS thanks to shift-cam picks up cleanly 2000 rpm earlier ! Roll-on thanks to 140NM they feel about as evenly powerful up to 8000 rpm but between 7000 and 10000 rpm (where the rev limiter puts an end to it abruptly) the KTM feels almost superbike powerful ! The GS needs 30-40 hp more to be the perfect motorcycle engine for the street without losing the low-rpm tract-ability ! But anyways the KTM is only a one trick pony...In 3rd and 4th gear hitting 7000 rpm it will wheely.It has too much power for it's own good and can't put the power down in fast forward progress like an over-sized dirt-bike for the steet.This can be either exciting or scary depending how who look at it but definitely not fast on road or track.Power is nothing without control.Be it either too short wheelbase or too much torque a S1000R is just as fast but much easier to ride and thus faster on track or back roads.Even the GS that is 40 kilos heavier and 40 hp short on power is much easier to ride and faster than a 1290 Superduke on twisty backroads... I can't imagine what an M1300GS would do with a 17" front wheel and a 170 hp boxer....
The KTM is definitely not ready to race as I have never ridden a motorcycle that was so twitchy around the steering head and still steered slower than a GS at speeds above 50 mph...Good top end power for a twin (the fun starts at 7000 and is abruptly over at 10000 rpm) but no control...It will wheely and is very unstable in the twisties...What a let-down and another interesting motorcycling experience.Lot of power wasted on a unstable moto-cross chassis...The magazines definitely don't have a clue but I know now why 1290 Superdukes are so easy to pass on trackdays...
Not on the straights but the GS is much faster in the twisties...And with bags,centerstand,shaft-drive and Telelever much more practical... All we need know is 30 more hp on top !!!
Hopefully BMW is listening and doesn't waste their time & resources on junk like the R 18...

Yes..

Problem with KTM is the seat height on most of the bikes. They exclude a lot of potential, shorter, riders. I ride a factory low XR and can flat foot both feet. Gives you much more confidence IMHO.

Was this the 1290 GT or the SDR ?

I ask as despite the supposed same as but with a fairing the SDR is the better bike in every respect as a rider focussed machine

I would guess it's the SDR as the GT euro 5 hasn't been launched yet. I would agree about the track day comments but not versus a GS, more versus a modern day superbike. As for a GS being quicker on the road I would also disagree. But hey ho, we're all entitled to an opinion

johnnyboy said:

I would guess it's the SDR as the GT euro 5 hasn't been launched yet. I would agree about the track day comments but not versus a GS, more versus a modern day superbike. As for a GS being quicker on the road I would also disagree. But hey ho, we're all entitled to an opinion

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I agree - I traded in a Gen 2 1290 Super Duke R for my 1250 GS because I need to slow down (and I wanted something more comfortable and suitable for touring) - IMHO there is no way the GS is faster than the SDR in any respect, other than to grind its pegs.

Boxerlust said:

The KTM is definitely not ready to race as I have never ridden a motorcycle that was so twitchy around the steering head and still steered slower than a GS at speeds above 50 mph...Good top end power for a twin (the fun starts at 7000 and is abruptly over at 10000 rpm) but no control...It will wheely and is very unstable in the twisties...What a let-down and another interesting motorcycling experience.Lot of power wasted on a unstable moto-cross chassis...The magazines definitely don't have a clue but I know now why 1290 Superdukes are so easy to pass on trackdays...
Not on the straights but the GS is much faster in the twisties...And with bags,centerstand,shaft-drive and Telelever much more practical... All we need know is 30 more hp on top !!!

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......... and then you woke up?

I have several friends who ride 1290s. They have all ridden GSs and all prefer their KTMs just because they are more edgy.
Whether they are faster is all down to the rider.

Boxerlust said:

It has too much power for it's own good ...

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I agree with the above statement, but this applies to many bikes, i find less hp can be plenty of fun and allow you to use its full potential without scaring the life out of you, whereas 160hp+ on certain rd's is just overkill and someone with less ability will only use that power on straights to catch up.

I rode the EU-5 1290 Superduke R in black with a Arrow slip-on...It was quiet.It was powerful between 7 and 1000 rpm like a S1000XR or S1000R not like a S1000RR between 10 and 14000 rpm if you know what I mean...
Yesterday was very interesting for me because I realized that the media will only lie to you and these people are either clueless or whores of the industry...You have to experience the stuff yourself.
The 1290 R was one of the worst handling bikes I ever rode.Very twitchy & unstable and not even quick steering to the point of being unrideable if you want to go fast.Very scary to the point it will crash at any moment...Ready to crash All MOTOR no cycle...Except for the straights where the KTM is ballistic between 7 and 10 K the GS will eat it up But in 3rd or 4th gear if you open the throttle all the way to the stops (forget about it in 1st or 2nd) the front will come up fast so that the power is wasted on wheelies...It is like a powerful dirtbike for the streets.Also very impractical with the lack of centerstand,bags or luggage rack.A one trick pony that will wheely on demand but definitely not ready to race but ready to crash...
Oh well the power of advertisements...a S1000R accelerates just as fast but is much more controllable and more stable and is still quicker steering ! But you do not get the short shot out the cannon sensation around 8.9 and 10000rpm where the rev-interrupter catches you like a invisible hook...I hope the M1300GS gets 170 hp as 180 hp is too much for the KTM... THe GS is already faster with a miserly 136hp where the SDR makes 184 hp on the same dyno...
Sorry KTM guys and gals if the truth hurts...What I don't understand how a test-rider like Mc Williams who knows a thing or two about riding and working for KTM can sign of on junk like this as the handling is horrible.Stable like a bicycle where the bars will ozzilate at the slightest provocation... SCARY !!!
All motor no handling - Power is nothing without control !

One more thing about the KTM which is the only good part of the whole package...It is a little bit too quiet for my taste and does not really feel like a twin probably because of the light flywheel...it is very smooth and needs 4000 rpm to pick up cleanly.Below that it feels it will break the chain...
A 1400cc shift-cam boxer should not have this problem and give an easy and reliable 170-180hp which would be finally enough,especially with 150-160 nm TORQUE.More would only let the electronics cut out the power to prevent wheely-ing which would be pointless for a ROAD-bike...Like I said I learned a lot yesterday,a very interesting experience to say at least.

Stanford said:

I agree - I traded in a Gen 2 1290 Super Duke R for my 1250 GS because I need to slow down (and I wanted something more comfortable and suitable for touring) - IMHO there is no way the GS is faster than the SDR in any respect, other than to grind its pegs.

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Once again its down to the rider and where you ride. I wish i could replicate myself ride against myself and see the difference , but as i have ridden both there is not much in them to be honest , the KTM is as you say bloody fast , but the BM is better all day and can stay with the KTM all day on technical roads , over 120 yes the KTM is better but that's easy on big open A roads .....Unless you hunt them down in the mountains and break them lol

Boxerlust said:

I rode the EU-5 1290 Superduke R in black with a Arrow slip-on...It was quiet.It was powerful between 7 and 1000 rpm like a S1000XR or S1000R not like a S1000RR between 10 and 14000 rpm if you know what I mean...
Yesterday was very interesting for me because I realized that the media will only lie to you and these people are either clueless or whores of the industry...You have to experience the stuff yourself.
The 1290 R was one of the worst handling bikes I ever rode.Very twitchy & unstable and not even quick steering to the point of being unrideable if you want to go fast.Very scary to the point it will crash at any moment...Ready to crash All MOTOR no cycle...Except for the straights where the KTM is ballistic between 7 and 10 K the GS will eat it up But in 3rd or 4th gear if you open the throttle all the way to the stops (forget about it in 1st or 2nd) the front will come up fast so that the power is wasted on wheelies...It is like a powerful dirtbike for the streets.Also very impractical with the lack of centerstand,bags or luggage rack.A one trick pony that will wheely on demand but definitely not ready to race but ready to crash...
Oh well the power of advertisements...a S1000R accelerates just as fast but is much more controllable and more stable and is still quicker steering ! But you do not get the short shot out the cannon sensation around 8.9 and 10000rpm where the rev-interrupter catches you like a invisible hook...I hope the M1300GS gets 170 hp as 180 hp is too much for the KTM... THe GS is already faster with a miserly 136hp where the SDR makes 184 hp on the same dyno...
Sorry KTM guys and gals if the truth hurts...What I don't understand how a test-rider like Mc Williams who knows a thing or two about riding and working for KTM can sign of on junk like this as the handling is horrible.Stable like a bicycle where the bars will ozzilate at the slightest provocation... SCARY !!!
All motor no handling - Power is nothing without control !

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The truth hurts???? I'll take your word for it, this is clearly a wind up.................................You've probably got Ktm worried though

I own a 1250 GSA and a previous generation 1290 GT. If I'm riding with my quick pals (V4 Street fighter, V4 Touno, etc), then the 1290 GT makes it much easier to ride at the higher speeds. I can keep up* on the 1250, but it's much harder work and I'm riding much closer to the limit.

The KTM had proven to be the more reliable bike too, although I'll probably sell it next year as the itch had been scratched. Prefer riding the 1250, but no good if it needs new cams more often than new tyres





*Actually, I'm usually leading these rides because they can never be arsed planning anything.

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I had no idea what a pile o. s. the 1290 SDR is until I rode one yesterday...
Lot's of motor between 7 and 10000 when you open the throttle all the way but it will come up...So what is the point ?
But the chassis if you wiggle on the bars it will be as stable as a bicycle coming from underneath you...
All MOTOR no handling... For guys that like to ride Moto-X on paved roads...
Faster on straights than a GS for sure but then again if this is what you are after a S1000RR will leave the 1290SDR in the dust !
But on twisty back-roads the GS is way faster than the SDR and feels much better/safer doing so despite being 45 kilos heavier and 45 hp down on top-end hp...The KTM is useless for either Road or Track except you like to pull wheelies or like that shot out of a cannon feel on the last 2000 rpm of the powerband where you can either hoist a wheelie or try not to crash on a bumpy road trying not to get a crossed up landing...
I just can't imagine how good a GS with 17" front and let's say 170hp would be...
Or a R1100S with the Superdukes engine...
That frame was perfect staying stable not matter what road or surface and still steering light & easy.Just the engine was flat light stale beer...
I modern R1300S or M1300GS both with Tele-lever could do the trick...But as it is I would always bet anything on my R1250GS-HP going against any KTM !!! Ready to Race...NOT ! Great on paper but not so in the real world

Boxerlust said:

I had no idea what a pile o. s. the 1290 SDR is until I rode one yesterday...
Lot's of motor between 7 and 10000 when you open the throttle all the way but it will come up...So what is the point ?
But the chassis if you wiggle on the bars it will be as stable as a bicycle coming from underneath you...
All MOTOR no handling... For guys that like to ride Moto-X on paved roads...
Faster on straights than a GS for sure but then again if this is what you are after a S1000RR will leave the 1290SDR in the dust !
But on twisty back-roads the GS is way faster than the SDR and feels much better/safer doing so despite being 45 kilos heavier and 45 hp down on top-end hp...The KTM is useless for either Road or Track except you like to pull wheelies or like that shot out of a cannon feel on the last 2000 rpm of the powerband where you can either hoist a wheelie or try not to crash on a bumpy road trying not to get a crossed up landing...
I just can't imagine how good a GS with 17" front and let's say 170hp would be...
Or a R1100S with the Superdukes engine...
That frame was perfect staying stable not matter what road or surface and still steering light & easy.Just the engine was flat light stale beer...
I modern R1300S or M1300GS both with Tele-lever could do the trick...But as it is I would always bet anything on my R1250GS-HP going against any KTM !!! Ready to Race...NOT ! Great on paper but not so in the real world

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Sounds like a shite rider to me

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As for the 1290 Superduke GT I can't even get my long legs inside the flanks of the wide tank...And for the 1290 SuperADV with the 19" front wheel.More stable than either but slower steering than the GS and up and down hobby-horsing thanks to the missing Telelever up front...
B.t.w. roll on from 60 in 5th or 6th gear the 1250GS will eat the 1290SDR lunch like there is no tomorrow...You definitely have to shift down on the KTM to stay between 7 and 10000rpm where stuff happens...
I think I can't be too far off with my observations that 170-180 hp is enough for the road and everything above becomes pointless as Ducatis new V4 for streetbikes like the new 2021 Multistrada will have no Desmo -B.S. but instead will have 60 K km maintenance intervals and 170hp / 125 nm torque...Competition will improve the breed !

stanley said:

Sounds like a shite rider to me

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No , I agree with Boxer , look in the mirror before you make statements like that , i have and still feel the GS is better and the points he make are correct , stop getting on the Boxer band waggon of slagging him off

Worth the £12 alone

Would be interesting to see how many riders average over 6k rpm on a half or full days hooning with friends on their adventure bikes on tarmac.


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