After 20K miles on the 1250 GS & 1250GS ADV - A honest review
- Thread starter Boxerlust
- Start date
There is little art to cornering on a bike fitted with telelever suspension.
Separating suspension forces from steering forces may be safer for numpties but I prefer to ride a bike with feedback from the front end .
It adds to the enjoyment , as does looking at the surroundings and banking a memory , be it in the mind or by photo .
Going from A to B as fast as possible on an anaesthetised bike does not interest me one bit .
Separating suspension forces from steering forces may be safer for numpties but I prefer to ride a bike with feedback from the front end .
It adds to the enjoyment , as does looking at the surroundings and banking a memory , be it in the mind or by photo .
Going from A to B as fast as possible on an anaesthetised bike does not interest me one bit .
Telelever is not only safer for numpties as you say it is also faster for experts 
That is why I don't understand why BMW went back to Fred Flintstone forks on the R1250R/RS...
Probably because all the lack of feedback nonsense you read from the idiots in the press...If you need the forks go down or bottoming out to know how hard to brake you probably are better off in a VOLVO or Prius...
Anesthisized bike says a guy riding a Africa twin where you don't know what is more boring...The slow steering of the 21" front wheel,the soft suspension turning the who ride in a wobbly mess or the 90 or so rear wheel-hp...
But BMW needs to get their heads out of their arses...If Harley advertises 152 hp for their laster 1250 PanAmerica desaster while only 125nm Torque the mighty GS should at least have 152 hp & nm
What a pile of bovine feces that new Harley P.O.S. for Harley posers who want to be as cool as Evan or Charlie,not...
R.I.P. H-D;First the Life Wire and now that wannabe GS with a chain uglier than even a Buell,if this was even possible Made in Thailand...Lord have mercy !
That is why I don't understand why BMW went back to Fred Flintstone forks on the R1250R/RS...
Probably because all the lack of feedback nonsense you read from the idiots in the press...If you need the forks go down or bottoming out to know how hard to brake you probably are better off in a VOLVO or Prius...
Anesthisized bike says a guy riding a Africa twin where you don't know what is more boring...The slow steering of the 21" front wheel,the soft suspension turning the who ride in a wobbly mess or the 90 or so rear wheel-hp...
But BMW needs to get their heads out of their arses...If Harley advertises 152 hp for their laster 1250 PanAmerica desaster while only 125nm Torque the mighty GS should at least have 152 hp & nm
What a pile of bovine feces that new Harley P.O.S. for Harley posers who want to be as cool as Evan or Charlie,not...
R.I.P. H-D;First the Life Wire and now that wannabe GS with a chain uglier than even a Buell,if this was even possible Made in Thailand...Lord have mercy !
Any bike is only as quick as the rider , period ! ( American speak to make you feel at home)
In Bike Magazine this month there is a big multi page homage to Honda’s VFR models as the 3 models left are all being phased out due to Euro 5. Bye bye to the V4. I took interest in a particular article because I have had a couple of V4 Hondas , currently a Crosstourer
In it there is a small piece about how one of the journos bought a Crosstourer from the original press fleet for himself , he kept it for 120,000klms. It only had one proper service & after that just an oil & filter service every time it had its annual MOT, never missed a beat . He tells of how on a track day photo shoot they used his bike, ridden by TT Rider Steve Plater , with a rear facing camera on it to shoot a Fireblade going round the track. They had to ask Steve to slow down so the journo on the Blade could keep up!
I can imagine how cornering at 120mph on a track would be fun but doing 120moh through the twisties on ‘suspect’ road surfaces is just plain dumb. You need to slow down and you might enjoy the ride a bit more ...
Oh and if telelever is faster for experts how come you don’t see any bike in WSB or MOTO GP using it. I loved both of my GSs because the telelever flattered an average rider like me, it was like a get out of jail card because if you cocked up your entry speed you could trail brake right through the corner without the bike sitting up in an effort to make the apex.
In Bike Magazine this month there is a big multi page homage to Honda’s VFR models as the 3 models left are all being phased out due to Euro 5. Bye bye to the V4. I took interest in a particular article because I have had a couple of V4 Hondas , currently a Crosstourer
In it there is a small piece about how one of the journos bought a Crosstourer from the original press fleet for himself , he kept it for 120,000klms. It only had one proper service & after that just an oil & filter service every time it had its annual MOT, never missed a beat . He tells of how on a track day photo shoot they used his bike, ridden by TT Rider Steve Plater , with a rear facing camera on it to shoot a Fireblade going round the track. They had to ask Steve to slow down so the journo on the Blade could keep up!
I can imagine how cornering at 120mph on a track would be fun but doing 120moh through the twisties on ‘suspect’ road surfaces is just plain dumb. You need to slow down and you might enjoy the ride a bit more ...
Oh and if telelever is faster for experts how come you don’t see any bike in WSB or MOTO GP using it. I loved both of my GSs because the telelever flattered an average rider like me, it was like a get out of jail card because if you cocked up your entry speed you could trail brake right through the corner without the bike sitting up in an effort to make the apex.
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we weighed spokes and cast wheels last year on my 1250 and spokes were lighter
we weighed spokes and cast wheels last year on my 1250 and spokes were lighter
Boxerlust,
I’ve just received a sticker which came with some parts I’d ordered.
Would you like me to send it to you ?
You could stick it on your tank and read it before every ride ?
I’ve just received a sticker which came with some parts I’d ordered.
Would you like me to send it to you ?
You could stick it on your tank and read it before every ride ?
I've spotted Boxlust problem, he is riding on the pavement
Rushy to answer your question why Telelever is not used in MotoGP or WSBK or Moto X for that matter where the fork still has a place to be used despite all its shortcomings that also breeds the misconception in the press or public that forks are "sportier"...
In Moto X you obviously need long fork travel.When you long at the geometry of a Telelever arm there is a limit on spring travel as also forks save a few pounds because the lack of the Telelever arm.
As for road racing compared to fast street riding where Telelever is better than a fork for reasons a) softer spring b) minimal fork dive that means that Telelever does not dive while soaking up all imperfections and not loosing traction like no fork can going hard into turns or stopping shorter in a straight line
Comfort,safety,speed - Advantage Telelever ! Also maintenance as there are no steering head bearings that wear,need to be tightened or changed.
The reason super expensive made out out of unobtainium forks made by Ohlin$$$ or White-Power (ktm) are still used in MotoGP or WSBK is that racetracks are SMOOTH and mostly have fast long sweeping turns where hard springs can be used that would be unrideable un bumpy roads as also fork dive can be used to shorten the trail to make the racebikes turn easier because they are set up for stability for speeds over 200 mph...All that does not apply for the street.
Telelever is a much better tool for roadriding.
As also for a boxer it is much easier to package Telelever than on a V or inline 4 engine configuration as also the driveshaft that does not loose any power because it is direct and not in a 90 degree angle like in a inline mounted conventionally or V engine configuration...Hope that answers the question.
In Moto X you obviously need long fork travel.When you long at the geometry of a Telelever arm there is a limit on spring travel as also forks save a few pounds because the lack of the Telelever arm.
As for road racing compared to fast street riding where Telelever is better than a fork for reasons a) softer spring b) minimal fork dive that means that Telelever does not dive while soaking up all imperfections and not loosing traction like no fork can going hard into turns or stopping shorter in a straight line
Comfort,safety,speed - Advantage Telelever ! Also maintenance as there are no steering head bearings that wear,need to be tightened or changed.
The reason super expensive made out out of unobtainium forks made by Ohlin$$$ or White-Power (ktm) are still used in MotoGP or WSBK is that racetracks are SMOOTH and mostly have fast long sweeping turns where hard springs can be used that would be unrideable un bumpy roads as also fork dive can be used to shorten the trail to make the racebikes turn easier because they are set up for stability for speeds over 200 mph...All that does not apply for the street.
Telelever is a much better tool for roadriding.
As also for a boxer it is much easier to package Telelever than on a V or inline 4 engine configuration as also the driveshaft that does not loose any power because it is direct and not in a 90 degree angle like in a inline mounted conventionally or V engine configuration...Hope that answers the question.
Big Derek...The cast wheels are lighter than the spoked wheels and not like you said.If I remember right ca 1 kg per wheel.C-F wheels for the GS would be even better
Arsey I would never put a Harley sticker on my bike but we can meet at the Suppenkuche this year since you dont have the balls to ride the Baja with me...
Arsey I would never put a Harley sticker on my bike but we can meet at the Suppenkuche this year since you dont have the balls to ride the Baja with me...
Can the mods please amend the thread title. It is not an honest review, it is a biased review.
Rushy forgot to mention 1 more point about why Telelever is superior to any fork , conventional or electronic...A electronic fork can resist fork-dive more than a conventional fork but can only try to impersonate Telelever by closing the valves.But it is only a fake Telelever because if you hit a bump going there are no suspension forces and the front wheel skips over that bump and looses traction.Not good if you brake hard adding braking distance or in a turn running wider hitting something or crashing out...As also a electronic fork braking hard in a straight line will still bottom out while Telelever retains probably 70 % of the suspension stroke no matter how hard you brake.As also as I mentioned before spring rates on Telelever are much softer than on any fork making the system so much better soaking up imperfections on the road... Question remains why did BMW go back to old tech on the R1200/1250R/RS ? Stupid move !
Question remains why did BMW go back to old tech on the R1200/1250R/RS ? Stupid move !
Posted by a fantasist with a serious LSD and crack cocaine habit
Now then Derek. Hows the leg ?
Or a complete feckwit
A telelever is just a geometry design. It is still suspended by a shock and it is unsprung weight which is definitely not something you want when the shock compresses and rebounds. There is inertia and friction that has to be overcome. The conventional fork design trumps a telelever in every department but comfort. It is a fact even BMW engineers will tell you. Sticky out cylinders and telelever is what the customer wants and has more to do with brand identity than efficiency. Like HD with their heritage engine designs which produces less power than what can be possible with a modern design unrestricted by heritage.
But this is the LC section where such reason will be dismissed as bollocks. Carry on.
Tannenbaum...As always clueless as ever 
Telelever can do what no fork can do - SEPARATE brake & diving forces or for You it is an anti-dive system that can still suspend and iron out bumps like no fork can !!!
Just to illustrate how superior Telelever is to a fork , even a electronic one in this regard is the fact that a bike with the same engine but being 40 kg's heavier and with less grippy tires was still faster on a handling track when europes biggest motorcycle magazine tested that a few issues back...The R1250GS-ADV beat the R1250R despite having less grippy tires,19" front-wheel and being a skinny female heavier thanks to Telelever
Just don't let the facts confuse you or your b.s. you contribute here as always...
The only reason BMW ditched the Telelever on R & RS is because it is cheaper and because some idiots still believe forks are better because Rea or Rossi run them on their bikes...But like I said MotoGP or WSBK tracks have little in common with the roads we ride on 99% of the time...
A XR version of the GS with more top-end and more road focused as also a another spin-of made like a modern version of the R1100S would be the best tools for the road period ! The would be also fast & fun for the track for most riders.
Of course a superbike that is useless and impractical for the road would be the better tool for the track in the hands of the few who can take advantage of the 200 rwhp todays 4 cylinders make as also the 80 pounds of weight savings and then on smooth tracks a fork still has it's place for reasons mentioned above...
And if Harley gets 152 hp out of a 1250 that even has hydraulic lifters it should be no problem for a company like BMW to top that easily and still offer gut-wrenching torque down low and in the middle thanks to shift-cam
Telelever can do what no fork can do - SEPARATE brake & diving forces or for You it is an anti-dive system that can still suspend and iron out bumps like no fork can !!!
Just to illustrate how superior Telelever is to a fork , even a electronic one in this regard is the fact that a bike with the same engine but being 40 kg's heavier and with less grippy tires was still faster on a handling track when europes biggest motorcycle magazine tested that a few issues back...The R1250GS-ADV beat the R1250R despite having less grippy tires,19" front-wheel and being a skinny female heavier thanks to Telelever
Just don't let the facts confuse you or your b.s. you contribute here as always...
The only reason BMW ditched the Telelever on R & RS is because it is cheaper and because some idiots still believe forks are better because Rea or Rossi run them on their bikes...But like I said MotoGP or WSBK tracks have little in common with the roads we ride on 99% of the time...
A XR version of the GS with more top-end and more road focused as also a another spin-of made like a modern version of the R1100S would be the best tools for the road period ! The would be also fast & fun for the track for most riders.
Of course a superbike that is useless and impractical for the road would be the better tool for the track in the hands of the few who can take advantage of the 200 rwhp todays 4 cylinders make as also the 80 pounds of weight savings and then on smooth tracks a fork still has it's place for reasons mentioned above...
And if Harley gets 152 hp out of a 1250 that even has hydraulic lifters it should be no problem for a company like BMW to top that easily and still offer gut-wrenching torque down low and in the middle thanks to shift-cam
What we really need is at least 160hp and 17 inch wheels in the next 1400 cc GS. 
Whatever, the telelever is just a geometry design, separating braking and steering forces is just geometry. Nothing more and nothing less. End off. It still has to be suspended by the very electronic shocks you are talking about. A single shock is inferior in handling suspension than 2 forks because the load and forces are split amongst 2 separate suspension components which makes is more effective because the design can be adopted to separate the functions of suspension in each, which not only keeps costs down but also makes it lighter and thus is can react quicker. Why is it the shock that fails when the suspension is worked hard like in off road conditions? The weight it carries and the amount of work done by the fluid overheats it. It is ineffective in dissipating heat as a single component. To counter this the design has altered to include remote reservoirs but it only solves part of the problem. A telelever solved a problem that existed decades ago in suspension design, but technology in suspension design negates that requirement. If a telelever is so good then the worlds largest motorcycle manufacturer with an R&D budget bigger than some countries' national budget has most certainly missed a trick. Maybe you should contact them to show them the error of their ways.
Your personal beliefs counts for zero because it can be rebuffed in a controller test.
It has all to do with brand identity and brand awareness. The RT and GS are the iconic BMW designs and hence stay true to the original. Much like HD engine designs.
Your arguments are one sided, biased and inaccurate. You are a mediocre rider with no specialist input into any development work of a motorcycle, accessory or tyre manufacturer. Who should we believe? Those with years of testing or competing at the highest level, project engineers, product engineers and companies researching, developing, manufacturing and testing of each component that makes up a motorcycle or you?
Your personal beliefs counts for zero because it can be rebuffed in a controller test.
It has all to do with brand identity and brand awareness. The RT and GS are the iconic BMW designs and hence stay true to the original. Much like HD engine designs.
Your arguments are one sided, biased and inaccurate. You are a mediocre rider with no specialist input into any development work of a motorcycle, accessory or tyre manufacturer. Who should we believe? Those with years of testing or competing at the highest level, project engineers, product engineers and companies researching, developing, manufacturing and testing of each component that makes up a motorcycle or you?
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