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Thread: Overwhelmed (not)

  1. #17
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    Another possible insurance issue might be storing your bike in Italy etc. Your UK insurance is unlikely to cover that, you'd need to bring it back to the UK to store it. There are normally limits to the number of days out of the UK on your policy, plus leaving the bike and going off can invalidate it.

    I tried to leave a bike in Italy for 6 months once and I was told it would be uninsured, I couldn't find a way round it. You might find a policy with unlimited days out of the UK in the year but still the issue of leaving the bike unattended.

  2. #18
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    The latter is a continuous problem.

    When you take out a policy of motor insurance in the UK, you make a declaration as to where the vehicle is kept for the majority of its life, along with who the main primary driver will be. This is known as a ‘material fact’ which, to some degree or another, the insurer uses to assess whether (a) They’ll accept the risk in the first place (b) What premium they’ll charge.

    As I understand it, you’ll be declaring an address in the UK, much like I’d declare my home in London as the place where my bike is kept. You though intend to actually keep the bike in Italy for much of the duration of the policy and beyond. Put simply, you have lied over a ‘material fact’, whereas I have told the truth.

    Given that you have an international driving licence and the bike is Italy bound, you might well need the services of an insurer / broker that is a cut above the average call centre chimp, trained to only deal with requests to insure quite simple things.

    Of course if you never make a claim, the chances of being discovered as having lied about a ‘material fact’ are very, very small. Why? Well, insurers don’t spend all their time checking that their customer has told the truth when applying for insurance in the first place. Insurance is unusual in this regard, as it is a contract founded on honesty, which the courts recognise. It is only when the chips are down that anyone starts to take an interest.

    PS The other thing that yiu might like to consider is the possible need to put the bike onto Italian plates, given that you’ll likely exceed the period of grace that all European countries (including the UK) allow before a vehicle is regarded as imported. Again, it is only when the chips are down that anyone in authority starts to take a possible interest in this; so “Wing it mate”, if that’s your thing.

  3. #19
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    Can you buy the bike in a friend's name in the UK, they insure it with you as a named rider?

    Doesn't solve the storage abroad issue but you can get a bike courier to bring it back to the UK or just ride it back, its only a couple of long days

  4. #20
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    Why not buy, register and insure a bike in Italy, rather than follow ever more convoluted ways to get around the problem in the UK.

  5. #21
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    I can look into buying the bike in Italy, I can also bring it back to UK and store at my mothers, its just I had found a place in I think Milan that the storage for a year wouldn't be much more than the petrol and ferry fare to get back to England.

  6. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wapping View Post
    Why not buy, register and insure a bike in Italy, rather than follow ever more convoluted ways to get around the problem in the UK.
    Unfortunately not so easy, assuming bikes are treated the same way as cars.

    In order to buy a car in Italy you first need to be an Italian resident

    According to the UK Government, you can take your car abroad for up to 12 months. However, in Italy you are only allowed to import the vehicle for up to six months in any period of 12 months. Therefore, if you plan to keep your UK car in Italy for longer than six months, it must be registered in Italy. The laws of Italy trump any other rules in the UK.

    Family member is half Italian but doesn't have residency, he uses a car that his cousin bought for him and keeps when he isn't there, insured for any driver. Registration and insurance in the cousin's name.

  7. #23
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    I know. I put it up as a counter to the ‘Get a mate…’ idea.

    Therefore buying a bike in the UK, assuming it’s ‘easy’ to insure, telling the insurer it’s going to be at a UK address (when in fact its going to be kept in Italy) and having to re-register in Italy after six months, is looking like a really cunning hot plan. That is all before it apparently then gets moved to Sweden.

    Or the alternative of getting ‘a mate’ to come in on the cunning hot plan…..

    All this to save riding the UK registered and insured bike back to the UK from Italy, because it’s ‘cheaper’ or ‘easier’ to garage it in Milan. And the fellow was thinking that the choice between riding across France to Spain versus the taking of a ferry was overwhelming?

  8. #24
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    Quite. From northern Italy it's a day or two back to sunny England, much easier than the storage plan. Or even make it part of the trip rather than a motorway blast at the end.

    One take on it which says what has been said earlier

    https://www.carolenash.com/tips-guid...n%20UK%20roads.

    Might need that mate in the UK in the end

    Also as suggested before look at the travel site

    https://www.horizonsunlimited.com/hu...e-europe-69311

  9. #25
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    Overwhelmed was just the title of my post, as I was struggling to find the information for what I am trying to do. Nothing crazy, in fact friend of mine is doing a RTW tour now riding for a month putting bike in storage for 6mths then picking up where he leaves off. He has not gotten to Europe yet poor guy.
    I work for a living so would rather spend my time riding new roads then keep having to come back to England, then retrace my steps back to the starting point days away.
    I am not overwhelmed in my choice to ride France or bypass was just looking for opinions.
    If it cannot be done then so be it, I will either rent a bike, or purchase a bike and return to the UK on each leg of my trip.
    There has been some great advise on this thread, I have checked the links and read articles. Thank you all.
    I am surprised to see a Mod being such a Richard, Richard.

  10. #26
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    Lots of people ride around Europe and indeed the world, probably ignoring some of the niceties of what they should be doing. There are lots of examples on this site alone of bods going to highly ‘inventive’ or convoluted ways of circumventing insurance requirements, just to be at home in the UK, without ever leaving these shores. Several times we see fellows insuring vehicles at their parents’ address as it’s cheaper or just taking the vehicle abroad and leaving it there, still UK registered, until they fancy using it again. That’s all fine and, as said above, the chances of being caught out are very small. Why are they very small? That’s easy. No Italian policeman or customs official is going to take any interest in one vehicle on English plates, which just trundles past their noses, any more that a British cop or official is going to take any notice of an Italian plated bike in Durham. Similarly, no insurer is going to spend time checking every five minutes whether a bike they insure in the UK (with an extension into the EU and a few other specific countries) is actually in Durham, Milan, Lisbon, Cape Town or Tokyo. You’d need to do something very wrong to set alarm bells ringing and anyone investigating anything too deeply, in which case when you brought a vehicle into a country and whether it was precisely insured at that one moment in time will maybe be the the least of your worries. In short, you’ll (more likely than not) get away with it for the lifetime of your travels, just as people get away with driving around uninsured, with no MOT, no road tax or with defective vehicles for months or years on end. Or you could just be unlucky. In other words, just do what you find easiest and suits you best.

    The peage tag question, you’ve had answered. It’s a sticky st the top of the French section. If you forget, Google: ‘French motorway tag’.

    The carnet question, you’ve had answered.

    You’ve been given two pointers to the HUBB forum / website.

    The jury is still out on whether you should ride across France to Spain or catch a ferry. Everyman and his dog has an opinion on that, just as they’ll have an opinion on whether anyone should ever as much as even as look at a motorway. You’ll know what to do when the day comes, I’m sure, not least as you ‘Wing it’.


    Now we’ve worked out for ourselves your circumstances and you’ve been given the information you sought, enjoy your (underwhelming) trip to Europe, when it comes. It’ll be awesome.

  11. #27
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    Thanks for all the tips guys, I did call RH for the insurance and they where super helpful and spent 2 days trying to accommodate me, but alas they are a no go.
    To be clear I will be 100% honest with the insurance company, I am not looking to lie in order to get the insurance and then have it be invalid when the bike gets stolen somewhere on my trip.
    I also called the superbike rental company, it was $8k for 9 wks rental on a 2018 GSA. Although a lot of money it did include fully comp insurance.
    I was just told about the Greencard insurance for the Schengen zone. I have to do more research to see if that will work to purchase and register a bike or not. Big down side is from my first look it only covers 3rd party.
    I assume and am probably wrong that you may be able to pay additional for theft and comprehensive coverage.

  12. #28
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    The Green Card simply confirms that the holder of the card has third party liability insurance in place for the country / countries specified on the card.

    https://www.mib.org.uk/making-a-clai...tem-explained/

    To me at least, you are making it hard for yourself through wanting to garage the bike in Milan for months on end, as it’s this piece which is apparently screwing up your otherwise easy plans.

    Why not buy yourself some time as follows:

    1. Buy the bike in the UK on English plates and insure it, using your mother’s address as the truthful place where the bike will live.

    2. Ride the bike across France (or take the ferry) to Spain / Portugal / Italy anywhere else within the EU, that your insurance covers, without the need for a Green Card. Want to go to Morocco? Easy, ask your UK insurer if they’ll issue a Green Card for the country or just buy third party insurance at the border.

    3. Bring the bike back to the UK when you have finished that part of the holiday. In other words, do exactly what 99% of the correspondents to this forum do every day of their waking lives, all without (for most of them at least) too much drama.

    That at least is easy and gets your holiday (which is all this really is) underway.

    Then, toss a coin as to whether you’ll do (as some - possibly lots - do) and garage the bike in Milan on its UK plates, instead of bringing it home. OK you’ll be gambling on the bike not being stolen or somehow damaged in Milan, as you’ll maybe be in breach of what you told your insurer and / or you’ll maybe be in breach of Italian import rules but that’s just a risk you can either accept or not. Whilst the bike is sitting in Italy (and assuming your UK insurer won’t insure it whist it is) you could even cancel your UK policy and take out a fresh one once you decide to restart your holiday.

    Or, just find some haulage company that will bring your bike from Italy back to the UK (and will haul it back, when you want restart your holiday) so you don’t ‘waste time’ riding the damned thing. These haulage companies do exist, as people on this site do use them.

    Or, once the bike is insured, spend some time seeking out a specialist insurer who will insure you the way you want it done. They will very possibly exist, you just need to find them, which may well require effort on your part. The HUBB forum will maybe point you in the right direction. Why must they exist? Because people ride motorbikes around the world and into far flung places; they are unlikely to all be uninsured and - to be legal - all you need is the third party element of cover. Think outside the box, perhaps? Contact one of the companies that escort UK bods on jaunts to China and find out how they arrange insurance. I have a vague memory that they use a specialist broker in Holland or something like that. That is what you need to find.


    PS I have changed your title, just in case anyone would think (even for one minute) you were ever overwhelmed

  13. #29
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    Give these guys a shout. "BIKE STORAGE | Knopftours Website" https://www.knopftours.com/bike-storage

    A couple of US acquaintances have bikes stored with them for use in Europe.

    Sent from my moto e30 using Tapatalk
    "But you're not posh."

  14. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern jock View Post
    Can you buy the bike in a friend's name in the UK, they insure it with you as a named rider?

    Doesn't solve the storage abroad issue but you can get a bike courier to bring it back to the UK or just ride it back, its only a couple of long days
    https://www.eurobiketrans.co.uk/italy/

  15. #31
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    That place is certainly well positioned and reasonably easy to get to.

    I’d happily leave it there and forget about insuring it for the duration, subject to cost etc. I’d forego any concerns about import obligations, webbel wot I is.

    I also guess that Americans also arrange insurance? They might have news on how to do it best, perhaps?

  16. #32
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    OK so I want to make this easy and not defraud the insurance company.
    So lets forget leaving the bike in Italy I will plan a round trip visit starting and ending in England and keep the bike in the garage at my mams house.
    From the insurance companies I have spoken to including RH they will not insure me because I am not a resident. I am not going to lie, with the high probability, the bike could get stolen and then I don't get payed out because I lied about residency which can easily be proved that I do not live in England.
    I have one last shot at this, I think. That is if my Mother can buy the bike and register and insure it in her name.
    I don't know if this is possible because she does not have a motorbike license.
    If she can do this, then the question would be can I be a named rider with an international drivers license and USA address.
    I am sorry this has been more lengthy than I imagined, a lot of advise here has been to do things that maybe a little bit in the gray area, which I am uncomfortable to do, I have a family here and if I lie at all and the insurance is void, then A) I will not get paid out for cost of bike and B) Worst case if I end up a pavement pizza, my life insurance will most likely not pay out because I was doing something illegally or fraudulently.
    The insurance companies at least here are full of slimy adjusters who will look for anything not to pay out.
    The day I bought my first bike a CBR600 I understood the risks of riding and have lost several friends over the years as I am sure we all have. But that day I took out life insurance to make sure my family is taken care of if anything happens to me.
    So if I can't do this trip 100% above board, then I won't do it.
    I will do a managed trip with Celtic Rider around Ireland or last night I was looking at some tour companies in Morocco that look amazing for 10day trips.
    Again I thank you all for the input I have read all your links and traced down all the recommendations.

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