1150GS Starting problems

OK stripped & cleaned the starter motor but in the process managed to short the positive terminal on the solenoid to the frame. Its all back together but now the starter motor is inoperative. I've checked the fuses in the fuse box and they all appear intact - please don't tell me I've f**ked the solenoid?
 
nock said:
OK stripped & cleaned the starter motor but in the process managed to short the positive terminal on the capacitor to the frame. Its all back together but now the starter motor is inoperative. I've checked the fuses in the fuse box and they all appear intact - please don't tell me I've f**ked the capacitor?
Click to expand...

Capacitor?
Which capacitor?
 
Lesson for the future: isolate the battery earth before doing anything like this :thumb

With regards to your starter, I'm not actually sure if there's any fuse in the starter circuit - it's one of the few bits of the bike that's permanently live and as you'll have seen from the size of the cables, handles a lot of current.

It's unlikely that shorting the live feed to the solenoid to earth will have damaged the starter but it will have whacked a lot of current through the starter cabling.

To test the starter, take a piece of wire and carefully try jumping a live from the positive terminal of the battery to the live terminal on the solenoid (just tap it onto the terminal - you'll soon know if it's working).

If it does work, then you're into fault finding back through the circuit.
 
So I've stopped beating myself up about making my schoolboy error not isolating the battery (I should know better!)

With a test light I found power to the starter motor and power from the starter button to the starter motor when it was pressed. I took the starter motor off and tried to get at the solenoid. I undid the screw that holds it to the casing and then tried to free it off with a few gentle taps with a hammer. Closer examination suggested that it may be a screw fit as there are slight flats either side, didn't have anything thin enough to fit, so gave up on that idea.

I decided to try Mattw 's test so refitted the starter and hooked it up. Lo and behold its now working as it should - maybe the hammer tapping freed up a slight short inside the solenoid? :nenau

Tried some old plugs in the bike that I knew were working and found that they were no better than the original set. Looks like it's back to replacing the Hall Effect Sensor.
 
nock said:
So I've stopped beating myself up about making my schoolboy error not isolating the battery (I should know better!)

With a test light I found power to the starter motor and power from the starter button to the starter motor when it was pressed. I took the starter motor off and tried to get at the solenoid. I undid the screw that holds it to the casing and then tried to free it off with a few gentle taps with a hammer. Closer examination suggested that it may be a screw fit as there are slight flats either side, didn't have anything thin enough to fit, so gave up on that idea.

I decided to try Mattw 's test so refitted the starter and hooked it up. Lo and behold its now working as it should - maybe the hammer tapping freed up a slight short inside the solenoid? :nenau

Tried some old plugs in the bike that I knew were working and found that they were no better than the original set. Looks like it's back to replacing the Hall Effect Sensor.
Click to expand...

I don't know why you are not trying new plugs instead as advised.
It's not expensive, and they can be used later.
Another thing, not trying to piss on your attempts so far, but I hope you realise that doing the hall sensor is not that difficult, however, blundering around as you are, can do more damage than good. I'd be tempted to have someone do it for me. :thumb2
 
nock said:
Thanks for that - really appreciate the encouragement - so you've never made a mistake eh?
Click to expand...

Don't worry, you are learning lots by trying. Get the HET changed. If you are not in a rush, source some replacement triggers and follow the replacement procedure, Cheap to do but may take time to get delivered. If not stump up the cash and get the bike working. Keep the old trigger plate and replace the triggers on that for spare or resale. Best of luck.
 
nock said:
So I've stopped beating myself up about making my schoolboy error not isolating the battery (I should know better!)

With a test light I found power to the starter motor and power from the starter button to the starter motor when it was pressed. I took the starter motor off and tried to get at the solenoid. I undid the screw that holds it to the casing and then tried to free it off with a few gentle taps with a hammer. Closer examination suggested that it may be a screw fit as there are slight flats either side, didn't have anything thin enough to fit, so gave up on that idea.

I decided to try Mattw 's test so refitted the starter and hooked it up. Lo and behold its now working as it should - maybe the hammer tapping freed up a slight short inside the solenoid? :nenau

Tried some old plugs in the bike that I knew were working and found that they were no better than the original set. Looks like it's back to replacing the Hall Effect Sensor.
Click to expand...

Great :thumb2

You dodged a bullet and I guess had a good learning experience. Those who've never made a mistake have never done anything :)

As others have said, it's worth trying fresh plugs before attacking the HES but no big deal to change the sensor plate (just expense).
 
Hey Nock

Not Knocking you "But" You have a bike that won't go and you have sorted the starter Well done you but What is the problem to go to a motor factors and buy a couple of fresh clean new plugs Instead of making do with schitty old ones

If the bike didn't fuck about or run like a bag of spanners or can you Tell us Did the revcounter jump about all over the place before it died? Then it May be the Hall effect sensors

Confucius say Take the easy path before jumping to a difficult one!

Wet plugs and old ones lying will have moisture ingress to the surface and a portion of current will follow this path leaving a weak yellow spark
 
Here's another suggestion since the OP is changing parts: Have you considered that the fuel pump is actually pumping. Mine failed once but sounded like it was working upon "ignition on".

A simple way of checking this is to whip off each injector, one at a time, and try to start the engine, whilst pointing the injectors' output away from your face, and see if there is fuel being pumped out. This way you'll be sure your fuel pump is working even though you said your plugs were wet.
 
flatdog said:
I don't know why you are not trying new plugs instead as advised.
It's not expensive, and they can be used later.
Another thing, not trying to piss on your attempts so far, but I hope you realise that doing the hall sensor is not that difficult, however, blundering around as you are, can do more damage than good. I'd be tempted to have someone do it for me. :thumb2
Click to expand...

And no joy from a fresh set of plugs? :nenau
Was it a second hand HES from MW?
 
Do you still have a weak yellow spark? You say you have "changed the coil and HT leads" weak spark would always throw doubt on the coil, what was the replacement and why the change?
I assume from the words you don't have stick coils so the primary should be 0.5 ohms and the secondary 7.5 k-ohms according to the Haynes manual. worth a check.
After all that if the replacement HES is OK then the next suspect could be the Motronic unit. Maybe a diagnostic check of the unit.
 
Might be worth double checking the HES as well especially if it is a used one, using this simple tester:

http://www.ebbo.org/2av54.php

I thought it sounded like duff plugs as well, but worth looking at what warmshed said.

good luck
 
Reset the ECU - made no difference.

Whipped out the injectors - nice fine regular spray that travelled about 8 - 10 inches before falling out of the air.

Actually got a detonation outside the cylinder suggesting the spark is sufficient.
 
Does the spark still look weak and yellow or is it a nice fat blue?

The compression of the combustion chamber gives sparks a hard time - a spark when the plug is not fitted might not mean that it's working properly when under pressure.

Are you sure the fuel you're seeing spraying from the injector is actually fuel and not water?

Failing that, it sounds like you're ruled out fuelling issues so all that remains is ignition - I'd be thinking about buying / borrowing a coil and trying that.
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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