Arse It! Still Intermittent starting...

[sockpuppet]

My bike hates me

Ok, the starting issues that persisted before the crash are still there. Bike now back from Woolastons behaved for them. Didn't for me - if anything its now doing it more than it was. On the up side its now shiney again and looking particularly sweet.

So far. Steptoe has replaced the old Hall Sensor with a 2nd hand unit.

I've replaced the Motronic with a second hand unit.

Symptons are no spark or injector signal. Any ideas on what I should try next?

I reckon the fault has to appear between the HES and the motronic either wiring or other fault. Going to test between the HES plug and the motronic plug with a ohmeter later.

Any thing else I should look for while under the tank?

 

[kirky1298]

long shot , but is the sidestand switch ok

 

[sockpuppet]

Bike turns over so its not a kill switch or side stand switch problem (afaik).

Just doesn't want to fire as its spins over. Once the bike starts it'll run all frikkin day at all rev ranges. Its just getting it started.

I suppose it could also be one of the sensors either air, oil temp etc thats not allowing the bike to start.

 

[kirky1298]

are you sure the hall sensor that you replaced the original with was ok ?? try checking the wires in the sensor for brittleness and cracking , if found , try replacing the wires on the sensor ,, costs nothing and you might get lucky

the fact it was wet, cold and damp on the ride down through france may indicate bad wire insulation as you have said , i would still be inclined to think hall sensor though ..

"On the up side its now shiney again and looking particularly sweet" ---- so they washed it for you ?? water ?? insulation ?? fault getting worse ?? catch my drift ??

 

[kirky1298]

when you get it running try spraying water onto the wiring harness with a hand sprayer between hes and motronic , if bike cuts out , hey presto !!!

 

[sockpuppet]

I shall give it a whirl. Not sure if the new HES worked properly as it was 2nd hand spare.

In a way it would be easier if it failed completley so I could find the frikking fault!

 

[DrFarkoff]

You could try setting the back of the tank on a block of wood and using a positive lead on the battery and a neg on the exhaust clamp and connecting and running your car beside it

Does the extra Oooomph let it start?

If so Try taking tha starter out and cleaning it well and grease the gear doo dah inside and clean all it's earthing points and try again

Possibly drawing too much current?

Frame earth points good? ECU earth good???

Bike turns over so its not a kill switch or side stand switch problem (afaik).

Just doesn't want to fire as its spins over. Once the bike starts it'll run all frikkin day at all rev ranges. Its just getting it started.

I suppose it could also be one of the sensors either air, oil temp etc thats not allowing the bike to start.

 

[(RIP) Kaister]

Push the starter button harder - it lets more elecktrickery thru

 

[sockpuppet]

Thanks guys, I'll investigate the starter next. Mine has external jump points so easy enough to try it - no where did I leave that car battery.

 

[DrFarkoff]

Thanks guys, I'll investigate the starter next. Mine has external jump points so easy enough to try it - no where did I leave that car battery.

2 things

:- try it off a running car not just a battery

:- Do NOT put negative to negative on the battery terminals on either the car or the bike (good in your case as you have external power points)

Put the clamps on an exposed part of the engine or bodywork that will give a good connection! This should stop the surge form destroying the battery or the electronics

 

[monkeyboy]

I presume if the bike is turning over then it's not going to be the battery.

You are positve you're getting no spark AND no fuel simultaneously? You are sure the petrol pump is priming? Take an injector off and see if there is any pressure behind it. It should maintain 3bar even when switched off and should pop off with some pressure. I had a problem with my R1100S the other day - seems the pressure reg had stuck open. There was only measly fuel pressure and the bike was an absolute bitch to start but ran fine. On mine I could hear the fuel running past the pressure reg and back up the return. New pressure reg and whoof - I can barely get my finger off the start switch quick enough now.

Could you have some iffy HT leads or a coil fault? I HATE electrics! The sidestand switch disables the whole motronic and and the fuel pump and injectors even though it lets the bike turn over (unlike the kill switch) I think. That is the symptom you sound like you have, but I'm assuming that you hear the fuel pump prime when you switch the ignition on. If it's all silence when you switch on, then I'd go for sidestand switch or more probably the relay/s.

 

[sockpuppet]

Aye, no fuel and spark is the diagnosis. Steptoe used a noid to diagnose no injector signal and no spark by usual methods. I don't have a noid handy but there was no spark yesterday. It did spray fuel when I took the injector out but that could just be the engine on one of its "i'm going to start moments".

Fuel pump is priming. Its twin spark. I've changed all the plugs and both stick coils (I had some spares from the trip) and it still didn't want to go.

Note to self, when checking for no spark make sure you detach the injector trigger - especially on twin spark bikes where the other spark plug is still connected. Woops I about shat myself. At least it blew all the crap out of the sparkplug channel.

 

[Packer]

If it runs ok once it's started perhaps there is poor contact on or in one of the relays. As the starter motor draws power the reduced voltage doesn't get across the poor connection.

Use a set of jump leads from another battery, negative to the chrome terminal on the back of the left pot and the positive straight onto the starter terminal (not the relay) with the bike ignition switched on. You'll still have full voltage from the bike battery to the engine sytems. Look out for the sparks as the jump lead hits the starter terrminal, keep your face away from it.

 

[DollyRocket]

As someone mentioned already, check all connectors - in my limited experience, wherever there is a connector -it is likely to end up as the weakest part of any circuit.

unplug and replug them (on headstock under tank) check the cables are not under too much tension - or corrosion.

Check lambda sensor is not faulty - perhaps motronic is not sensing lambda sensor and preventing fuel flow so not to kill the catalyst?

 

[sproggy]

Check lambda sensor is not faulty - perhaps motronic is not sensing lambda sensor and preventing fuel flow so not to kill the catalyst?

I very much doubt that the lambda sensor is in any way associated with starting - it plays a part only when the engine is running. In any case, the bike will start (and run) with a lambda sensor disconnected.