Battery, Optimate --- HELP

[locp10]

The battery on my 23 month old GS seems to be on the way out. I went to the bike on Saturday only to get the dreaded "clack clack clack" of the starter. It had been stood for a only a week. After jumping it off from the car, I went to visit my local dealer for advise. When I told him that it was sttod for a week before it failed to start he asked me if I used a BMW of Optimaate maintenance charger, he seemed surprised when I said no.
Therefore I have a couple of questions :-

Is it normal to drop enough charge in a week to stop the bike starting ?

Is it best to use an Optimate through the winter

If I invested in an Odyssey battery to replace the crappy original, would you still Optimate it through the winter or are they good enough not to need it.

 

[BeemerBaz]

The battery on my 23 month old GS seems to be on the way out. I went to the bike on Saturday only to get the dreaded "clack clack clack" of the starter. It had been stood for a only a week. After jumping it off from the car, I went to visit my local dealer for advise. When I told him that it was sttod for a week before it failed to start he asked me if I used a BMW of Optimaate maintenance charger, he seemed surprised when I said no.
Therefore I have a couple of questions :-

Is it normal to drop enough charge in a week to stop the bike starting ?

Is it best to use an Optimate through the winter

If I invested in an Odyssey battery to replace the crappy original, would you still Optimate it through the winter or are they good enough not to need it.

I cant leave mine any longer than 3-4 days before the battery runs down. Mine is just 12 months old. I use a BMW charger all of the time.

 

[gsbiker]

I've not got my GSA yet but I did enquire about the Optimate as I have one for my RD. BMW said it would be ok to use an Optimate. I also enquired about a factory fit alarm and they said it would drain your battery within a week. So based on what you've said I would say it's normal to lose enough charge through a week to prevent startup especially now it's getting colder?

 

[PatchGS1150]

I use an optimate IV all the time on my R1150GS (2001). Have no problems at all. It is always plugged in and it keeps the battery in tip-top condition. The IV also has some really neat features that allow you to plug it in and forget about it.

Highly recommended

 

[locp10]

Did the dealer say it was ok to leave the battery connected when using the optimate 4 --- I have read somewhere that it can bung 20+ volts into the battery if it's sulphated, won't that "worry" the Canbus

 

[JIm]

Hi,

Left mine some time, got the deredded clack from the solenoid.

I connected my Oxford battery tender. Then, after a couple of days, I remembered something about sulphate, flat batteries and battery tenders doing something bad. I unhooked the Oxford, prepared for an expensive school-boy error and tried the bike-it started and everything seems ok with the systems.

Perhaps I've got away with it, I didn't think you should charge a flat battery with an optmate/Oxford tender?

Jim

 

[Wapping]

Hi,

Left mine some time, got the deredded clack from the solenoid.

I connected my Oxford battery tender. Then, after a couple of days, I remembered something about sulphate, flat batteries and battery tenders doing something bad. I unhooked the Oxford, prepared for an expensive school-boy error and tried the bike-it started and everything seems ok with the systems.

Perhaps I've got away with it, I didn't think you should charge a flat battery with an optmate/Oxford tender?

Jim

Don't worry about it, nor about rescuing de-sulphated batteries. No harm will come to the battery or the bike.

I have rescued dead batteries with no problems. They sometimes do not hold their subsequent charge too well but that is not the same thing.

I have two BumW's, both Canbus, both connected to two Optimates 24/7/365. Neither have blown up, burst into flame or disappeared in a shower of sparks.

I have used Optimates in exactly the same way for over 15 years, on assorted bikes and vehicles. No problems at all.

 

[Pukmeister]

I don't know about the latest Optimates, but when I purchased my Hawker Odyssey battery, the only approved trickle charger was a C-Tek Multi XS3600. This is due to the amount of current/voltage the charger puts out, without the instruction manual to hand I couldn't tell you the exact figures.

Check Hawkers website for approved chargers, if you buy an Odyssey (or similar AGM technology cell) you need to check which charger is compatible otherwise you may damage the battery or void the two year warranty on it.

 

[Paul Rochdale]

I've a pair of Optimate IIIs connected to my R100GS-PD with it's Odyssey battery, and a Pan. Summer and winter. The bikes always start first time. I have tried to revive a completely dead battery with an Optimate but it cannot manage it. They are really intended for keeping a battery topped up and when storing a bike/battery.

 

[Timolgra]

Odyssey battery on my 1150, never use an Optimate and it'll always start first time after being left for 2 months.

 

[Fanum]

Odyssey battery on my 1150, never use an Optimate and it'll always start first time after being left for 2 months.

Same here...and bike lives outside 12 months of the year.

Optimates are very good at masking the problem, but I'm sure they're not actually doing a battery any good, leaving it plugged in all the time

 

[Wapping]

Same here...and bike lives outside 12 months of the year.

Optimates are very good at masking the problem, but I'm sure they're not actually doing a battery any good, leaving it plugged in all the time

But your 'kept outside bike' is used regularly, no doubt, so keeping the battery in tip-top charge? Or maybe it has a larger battery than that fitted to an OE 1200GS, which may need a little help from time to time?

Optimates do not mask a problem at all, nor do they do any damage to anything, no matter how long they are left connected or whatever type of battery. 15 years of use has established that, to my satisfaction at least. Optimates (and similar devices) simply keep a battery that is not being used, topped up. Nothing more, nothing less. They will not switch into deep recovery mode if the battery does not need it. They do it very well. BuMW's own smart charger does the same, as will near enough any half decent charger / trickle charger. But they will not keep a battery good forever. Just as a battery that is not charged at all, or is only charged on a bike (no matter how good its charging system) will not last indefinately.

If, when the topped up battery is run on the bike and it is not charging from the bike's system - or the battery is the bike's sole electrical system due to another fault - (broken alternator belt, broken alternator or rectifier, say) then the battery will go flat in pretty short order. That will happen, no matter what.

Lots of people blame the bike and the battery. More often than not it is not the problem at all. People always look for the most complicated solution, ignoring the easiest ideas first. More often than not they are simply not riding the bike far enough to get a decent charge and / or are leaving the bike for weeks or months on end, to simply discharge the battery. Flat twins require a lot of umph to get them started. Factor in modern electrical systems which will not light up, unless a half decent current is there (anyone tried to bump start a modern car with a very flat battery?) and the result is a forgone conclusion.

Or, just as likely, they have have imported some extra drain on the battery at rest: Aftermarket alarms and / or umpteen devices wired direct to the battery (because it's easy) and thus permanently live. How often do we see that touted as a good idea?

Factor in irrational fears fears about de-sulphating* and / or canbus burn out and, just like oil, it develops a life of its own.

Their solution? Spend good money on ever bigger batteries, to mask the problem, more often than not. Then not charge them properly and still wonder why their batteries are going flat.

===

*Some people should maybe do a Google search to see how a battery works and what happens when a battery is left to go flat and stay flat for months on end. It really is very simple. You can make a very basic battery from an orange and two different metals, for heaven's sake. If the plates end up shorted together, or so covered with deposits, that no current will flow, no amount of effort will bring it back to life or keep it charged.

 

[Bertie]

Battery, Optimate

Following two battery failures despite using an Optimate, I have purchased a dedicated BMW charger, and have had no further problems.......to date

 

[Technopole]

Batteries

It seems common for the OE battery to fail at about 2 years. I bought the BMW charger to keep me limping along until my Odyssey battery came. Since fitting that I have never had a problem, no matter how long I leave the bike, which also lives out in the drive in all weathers. If I am doing mostly short runs I try to remember, just once in a while, and if it's dry to put the charger on. No more problems. No more fear and doubt when turning the key. Job done.

 

[Fanum]

But your 'kept outside bike' is used regularly, no doubt, so keeping the battery in tip-top charge? Or maybe it has a larger battery than that fitted to an OE 1200GS, which may need a little help from time to time?

Batteries are designed to go through cycles- to be discharged and recharged.

If you keep it in a fully charged state all the time, it's not being used as it was designed.

I have no scientific data or theory to back any of this up, but my gut feeling (and hearing about so many batteries failing even though (or because) They've been on charge all the time) tells me a battery should be used as intended....cycled properly.

Muscles cramp, Screens burn in, bows harden and crack, the natural order of things is to work then rest and recover......chemicals settle and drop residues, stressed things crack......It's just not natural I tell you

 

[Brian ROSEN]

BMW charger better ?

"....Following two battery failures despite using an Optimate, I have purchased a dedicated BMW charger, and have had no further problems.......to date" If you use an 'ordinary' optimate type charger it will do the job intended quite satifactorily BUT normally must be connected to the terminals - it will NOT work via the auxiliary socket as does the BMW special; If you are happy to pay three times the price of an optimate because that saves you taking off the seat, fair enough. I really do not think there is any other advantage; As a matter of interest the new 2008 model has an increased alternator output ( 720W from 600W) but I never had any problems in 4 years with the old model - but it was ridden almost every day and the optimate connected if liable to be unused for more than a few days. Incidentally as insurance companies here do not consider an alarm serves any useful purpose I have never understood why anyone fits them; when the wind gusts here one can hear the swimming pool/ car/ motorcycle & house alarms all setting off + all the dogs barking so nobody takes any notice of any of them!

 

[Wapping]

Batteries are designed to go through cycles- to be discharged and recharged.

If you keep it in a fully charged state all the time, it's not being used as it was designed.

I have no scientific data or theory to back any of this up, but my gut feeling (and hearing about so many batteries failing even though (or because) They've been on charge all the time) tells me a battery should be used as intended....cycled properly.

Muscles cramp, Screens burn in, bows harden and crack, the natural order of things is to work then rest and recover......chemicals settle and drop residues, stressed things crack......It's just not natural I tell you

Then it seems I have been lucky over the 15 years of 24/7/365 Optimate usuage....Five (or there abouts) of which have been with BuMW......Never had to buy a new battery and most of the bikes well over the seemingly magical two year mark. Fingers crossed my luck will continue....

If it doesn't then, hey-ho, I will have to find the cause and /or buy a new battery....

In the meantime BuMW or the AA can rescue me....Now there is a real worry!!!!!

 

[Fanum]

Then it seems I have been lucky over the 15 years of 24/7/365 Optimate usuage....Five (or there abouts) of which have been with BuMW......Never had to buy a new battery and most of the bikes well over the seemingly magical two year mark.

Hmmm...therein lies the crux of my point Richard, nay, the very proof of my pudding ......none of my last three BUMW batteries have lasted less than 5, yes FIVE years, and none have been optimated

The persecution rests its case

 

[Wapping]

Hmmm...therein lies the crux of my point Richard, nay, the very proof of my pudding ......none of my last three BUMW batteries have lasted less than 5, yes FIVE years, and none have been optimated

The persecution rests its case

A point if I may, my lord.

My learned friend who, by his own admission, had no scientific data or theory to back any of this up, beyond his gut feeling (large as it doubtless is ) - is now changing his tune. Depite his pitiful lack of evidence, he does little more than persist in this foolish belieif, stating that batteries have to cycle or they will die an early death....now citing the example of five years and no charger....I on the other hand have Optimated for fifteen and seen batteries that have lasted more than five, too...so we are all square, as they probably (do not) say say in the Inns of Court........All rise! Lunch will be taken in the Wig and hangman....awaiting his lordship's pleasure...


PS Bill, do I not remmeber a vague appeal for help a year or so ago...over a flat battery, somewhere in Kent.....

 

[GSmonkey]

Is it normal to drop enough charge in a week to stop the bike starting ?

Is it best to use an Optimate through the winter

If I invested in an Odyssey battery to replace the crappy original, would you still Optimate it through the winter or are they good enough not to need it.

-It shouldn't, if it does, there's something wrong. Depends however on the state of charge at the start of that week.

-Yes

-Yes