Bike almost left me stranded because of electrics ... can you help me work out why?

revanslacey

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Hi guys. I was riding on my own up and down a green lane on my 1150 GSA on Monday when I stalled it. I pressed the starter and the engine barely turned over. It just managed to cough back into life but I was almost left stranded and I can't figure out why.

I'm guessing that either 1 - I had run the battery down by drawing too much current, or 2 - the battery is knackered, or 3 - it isn't charging correctly.

1 - I was running the bike with the HID dip headlight on and my Samsung Galaxy S4 charging for the GPS. I'd also been playing around with the ABS on the track. The phone is a bit crap and even when on charge it gradually looses power and feels warm to the touch. Could all that lot have drained the battery?? I thought you could run loads of heated gear off a BMW ... is all this lot drawing more power than that would?

2 - I thought my battery might be knackered but I've had it on an optimate before and after the trip and it shows a solid green light in the top right both times (after a bit of charging had happened). I think that means that the optimate thinks the battery is fine. Am I wrong?

3 - I managed to get all the way home without the bike stalling again. I had the phone charging and the HID light on all the way back. When I was back at home base I tried starting the bike a few times and the engine turned over without a problem. I figure that means that it must be charging - at least partially.

So I'm stumped. Any of you guys able to point me to the likely cause? Do I need a new phone? A new battery? Or to take my bike to the fixers for them to check the charging? I don't want to get stranded somewhere off the beaten track.

Thanks for your help.

Richard.
 
Could be a starter motor problem. The separater plate floating around or one of the case magnets is loose.
 
stonehenge said:
I would go with number 2
Click to expand...
Ditto, check with a meter that the alternator is charging the battery, check the voltage of the battery after charging or a good run then check it again a couple of days after using it..should not have lost any voltage or at most a tiny bit. A fully charged battery is around 12.8 volts, around 14.3 whilst charging via alternator.
 
revanslacey said:
Hi guys. I was riding on my own up and down a green lane on my 1150 GSA
Click to expand...

Well there you have it That was your first problem

Are you capable with Spanners? If "No" then get it booked into Steptoe for a service and check over

A least when it leaves there you will be SURE, its as it should be
 
Check the simple things first-battery terminals, earth terminals and starter connections.

John
 
stranded

:beerjug: Just a mention of something that could cause this, overheating! You were on a green lane and this could happen, if stuck for example.
I have a twin cam gs and never had a problem starting but once I was stuck in an horrendous road works for a while and decided to switch engine off because I could see it was overheating. When we finally went to go the starter would not turn engine at all. Parked up for an hour and bike started as normal.:thumb2
 
The symptoms of slow rotation of the engine during a start, followed by normal starts thereafter, Points to the Starter motor as 'Steptoe' has said.

What happens when the separator plate becomes detached inside the Starter Motor, is that it welds itself across the windings creating a short circuit. Maybe not all the windings, just a few. If the short is present at the point you press the starter button then the battery has a low resistance path to earth across the Starter motor and the high current draws down the battery voltage, hence the slow turning starter motor. Now when you release the start button the starter motor has turned and the Short across the windings caused by the separator plate has moved position. So now it might not be showing a short circuit. So the next time you hit the start button the starter motor spins normally.

The Starter motor might be making some unusual noises, like clattering or grinding.

:thumb2
Ian

The late MikeP did a brilliant write up on starter motors and the last pictures in his post show what is happening with the separator plate and the motor windings.
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/207984-Starter-Strip/page2
 
+1 for Steptoe and Ian's suggestion.

I say this because of the possibility of a lot more vibration, bumping etc on the green lanes. A couple of years back on the way to Italy a coil stick went and this caused lots of vibration...which then loosened that plate in the starter...and gave me your symptoms.

I replaced the coil and removed the grease plate (still haven't put it back). Germany onto Italy and ever since its sorted.
 
Katnip said:
:beerjug: Just a mention of something that could cause this, overheating! You were on a green lane and this could happen, if stuck for example.
I have a twin cam gs and never had a problem starting but once I was stuck in an horrendous road works for a while and decided to switch engine off because I could see it was overheating. When we finally went to go the starter would not turn engine at all. Parked up for an hour and bike started as normal.:thumb2
Click to expand...

I wasn't stuck in any ruts or anything but I was practicing spinning the back wheel and getting a feel for the ABS in the mud. I don't think the temp gage was at the top though.

It reminds me that I stalled while slowly filtering through London traffic last year and had the same issue (but not quite so bad) when I pushed the button to start it. I was surprised as I thought there should be enough juice in the battery as I'd been riding for a while. I did get it going OK and I confess to filing the issue under the carpet ... until Monday. Perhaps it was due to overheating then too? Anything that can be done or is it just a matter of taking a break? :-/
 
Ian J Hartley said:
The symptoms of slow rotation of the engine during a start, followed by normal starts thereafter, Points to the Starter motor as 'Steptoe' has said.

What happens when the separator plate becomes detached inside the Starter Motor, is that it welds itself across the windings creating a short circuit. Maybe not all the windings, just a few. If the short is present at the point you press the starter button then the battery has a low resistance path to earth across the Starter motor and the high current draws down the battery voltage, hence the slow turning starter motor. Now when you release the start button the starter motor has turned and the Short across the windings caused by the separator plate has moved position. So now it might not be showing a short circuit. So the next time you hit the start button the starter motor spins normally.

The Starter motor might be making some unusual noises, like clattering or grinding.

:thumb2
Ian

The late MikeP did a brilliant write up on starter motors and the last pictures in his post show what is happening with the separator plate and the motor windings.
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/207984-Starter-Strip/page2
Click to expand...

Thanks. No clattering or grinding but, having read that thread, the intermittent fault does sound like it could be that rather than the battery. And one guy said that it was happening to him when the engine was hot but not cold - just like mine seems to. Rather than stripping it down (I tend to break more than I fix) I've ordered the reasonably priced starter motor from Germany that is recommended on page 3. Hopefully fitting it will be within my capabilities.

As a side note, I read that I could use the starter motor as a place to clip my optimate battery charger rather than trying to access the battery itself. Is that standard practice or is this something that could hurt the starter motor?

Cheers,

Richard.
 
revanslacey;. said:
As a side note, I read that I could use the starter motor as a place to clip my optimate battery charger rather than trying to access the battery itself. Is that standard practice or is this something that could hurt the starter motor?

Cheers,

Richard.
Click to expand...

It'll cause no problems - the terminal lead on the starter motor where you attach the charger positive clip goes to the battery positive
 
You can also charge your battery through the accessory socket which is 'always on' - well it is on my 1100 anyway.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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