Brake Issue

[Crosshair]

Hello all,
Picked up my '00 1150gs on Tuesday and one thing I noticed on the way home was the front brake.
The first pull of the lever resulted in fairly average braking performance but if you let go and quickly reapply the brake, braking is excellent.
This led me to believe the brakes needed bleeding (they already have braided hoses).
So, today, I bought one of those one-way bleeding tools and set about the brakes. I bled the left front caliper first, then the right front and finally the rear. Then, I accidently got some air in the back line and the back pedal lost all feel. So, I propped up the back of the tank and bled at the ABS unit and managed to restore feel in the rear brake. Whilst I had the tank up, I quickly bled the front system at that point too and there was a bit of air there.
I put everthing back together and the lever felt firmer.
Took it for a test ride and it was exactly the same!!!!!!!
What shall I try next?
Cheers in advance,
Andrew

 

[Jiffy176]

Push and hold the pads and pistons fully back. I read somewhere air can get trapped behind the pistons and will not be bled out unless pistons are back.
Hth.

 

[AdrianS]

You are bleeding the system correctly?

The handle bar lever and brake pedal operate the control circuit to the ABS unit -they don't operate directly the calipers. The circuit from the ABS unit to the calipers has to be bled separately with the tank off.

Just did mine - took about 1/2 hour after I got the tank off - lots of info in the archives.

 

[Crosshair]

You are bleeding the system correctly?

The handle bar lever and brake pedal operate the control circuit to the ABS unit -they don't operate directly the calipers. The circuit from the ABS unit to the calipers has to be bled separately with the tank off.

Just did mine - took about 1/2 hour after I got the tank off - lots of info in the archives.

Well, not entirely sure- first time i've tried bleeding brakes on anything

I followed this page here

I managed to get to the nipples on the ABS unit without disconnecting the fuel lines, just propped the tank up.

If anyone could link to a clearer step by step guide, that would be great.

 

[Crosshair]

Push and hold the pads and pistons fully back. I read somewhere air can get trapped behind the pistons and will not be bled out unless pistons are back.
Hth.

Whats the best way to push them back in?

I think i'm going to have to get some more brake fluid and have another go

 

[Steptoe]

You are bleeding the system correctly?

The handle bar lever and brake pedal operate the control circuit to the ABS unit -they don't operate directly the calipers. The circuit from the ABS unit to the calipers has to be bled separately with the tank off.

Just did mine - took about 1/2 hour after I got the tank off - lots of info in the archives.

Stop. ---- you're talking about the servo brakes, his bike is an 2000 model, with plain and simple ABS non servo.

 

[Crosshair]

Stop. ---- you're talking about the servo brakes, his bike is an 2000 model, with plain and simple ABS non servo.

Yep, year 2000, ABS II, no servo's here.

 

[B4ndit]

Had no issues when I did mine for the first time earlier this year and I was a barke bleed virgin and a mechanical numpty to boot.

Did the ABS first then bled the brakes.

Had a little problem with the black rubber liner in the rear reservoir. IE I ended up with no rear brake until I took out the liner and got fresh fluid in.

 

[Jiffy176]

Whats the best way to push them back in?

I think i'm going to have to get some more brake fluid and have another go

I removed calliper fitted bleed tube, opened bleed screw the with the pressure released just pushed the pads back by hand. The fluid and air from behind the pistons is pushed out as the pistons go back. I then secured the pads so that the pistons remained fully retracted and bled as normal.

Not sure if this is the correct way and I'm sure someone will be along to advise but it worked for me.

 

[Crosshair]

Cheers guys.
I thought it had all gone smoothly. I was trying to do it as the link I posted recommended, without touching the ABS unit. Old skanky bubbly brake fluid came out, fresh new fluid went in
Then I got air in the back line and had to go to the ABS unit to bleed it out. So whilst I was there, I bled the front bleed screw on the unit too.
Hey presto, should be fine but no difference

So, if I....
1) Bleed the ABS unit front and back screws.
2) Bleed the front left calliper, pushing the pistons in at the same time.
3) Bleed the front right calliper, pushing the pistons in at the same time.
4) Bleed the rear calliper, pushing the piston in at the same time.
All should be fine and dandy???

 

[Crosshair]

Ok, so today I took the callipers off and levered the pistons back in and wedged in some blocks of wood.
Then, I lifted the tank and bled the front system at the ABS unit bleed screw.
Next, I bled the rear system at the ABS unit bleed screw.
Then, I bled the front left calliper.
Next, I bled the front right calliper.
Finally I bled the rear calliper and reassembled everything.
The result?
Well, if I brake without releasing the lever ie constant increasing pressure, the brakes are fine. They've got more than enough power to stop the bike quickly, even locking up the front momentarily if desired.
However, if I brake once very briefly, then reapply the brakes, they are still better than the first pull.
What I would say, is that the difference between the two i less after this bleed.
Can any other 1150 owners confirm whether this is normal behaviour, or are there further options to try and get that full power that the second pull of the lever produces, first time every time???
Cheers for now,
Andrew

 

[B4ndit]

I know you say you have braided lines. But look at them again.

On my old OEM lines I could get full braking for a short while then I would lose the back brake. It was ballooning near the rear calliper. Changed to braided since and no problems. But its worth you having a look.

Sounds like you have done as much bleeding as you can so it may be time to look elsewhere in the braking system.

 

[Crosshair]

Yep, they are HEL braided lines.
At low speeds its not even an issue but when pressing on a bit, it would be nice to have the 'extra' brake power that the second pull on the lever yields

 

[B4ndit]

Have you read this?

http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?t=279294

 

[Crosshair]

Have you read this?

http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?t=279294

Yep
Couldn't see anything that helps me with my problem?

 

[zzr1100d1]

Can any other 1150 owners confirm whether this is normal behaviour
Andrew

My 2000 1150 has exactly the same characteristics as yours, dont know if this is normal behaviour but only recently noticed it. My pads do need changing, will let you know if it makes any difference.

Not sure that it will though.

 

[Crosshair]

My 2000 1150 has exactly the same characteristics as yours, dont know if this is normal behaviour but only recently noticed it. My pads do need changing, will let you know if it makes any difference.

Not sure that it will though.

Cheers, my pads are pretty good....