breathable jacket versus waterproof over jacket

Gore-Tex 'cleaners' etc.....

Different treatments are recommended for different brands and types of Gore garments.

We sell Klim. All Klim garments are the 'shell' variety, ie the waterproof layer is the outer shell of the garment. The Gore membrane (the PTFE layer with millions of tiny holes as mentioned above) is laminated between a tough outer material, usually a 'ballistic' nylon or cordura, and another inner layer to protect the membrane.

The breathability and subjective waterproofing relies on the outer layer being treated to make water bead up and run off as it lands on the jacket.

After a period of time that treatment becomes less effective and the outer layer of the laminate 'wets out'. Basically that thin outer layer will hold water.
now if you can imagine the membrane is now completely sealed by actual liquid water in the very outer fabric layer. As you sweat the water vapour now hits a cold layer of liquid and condenses on the inside of the jacket making you wet. Water vapour cant pass through water, it just condenses and becomes water!

Once the jacket has stopped beading water the first thing to do is wash it on its own in a washing machine with no chemicals. Tumble dry it. This should re-activate the water repellant coating.

If this doesnt work wash it again, then treat with a spray-on reproofing spray and tumble dry. We sell Revivex as it is recommended by Klim. You only treat the outer shell. This is important as if you treat the inside the wicking effect of the inner layer wont work as it will bead-up any moisture inside the jacket and not transfer it to the membrane.

Im not a real fabrics expert but having spent a lot of time using and learning about Klim garments. This is the correct procedure for them and i hope it explains a little about how Gore-Tex shell garments are supposed to work.

Like a high performance bike they need some maintenance to keep them working at the optimum level!

I dont know how the jackets with a waterproof liner are supposed to work.
 
the membrane stops the water getting to you doesnt need looking after other than washing to stop grease clogging the little holes thats the goretex bit. The treatments are to make the outer layer not goretex repel water so it doesnt become waterlogged and cold. That needs doing every so often when the water stops beading.
 
Its a common misconception and also a marketing dream that goretex can be re treated!
I went on a goretex course a few years ago when I worked at a BMW dealership.
Goretex is from scotland, it was discovered by mistake and is a closely guarded secret in how its made, it has many patents, which is why there are so many other 'copies'.
Basically goretex is a membrane which after its production process is full of holes, These holes are, smaller than a water droplet molecule but bigger than a water vapour particle, hence waterproof and breathable. Goretex works better if there is a temp difference, thats why it always works well for walkers and other kind of sports as you generate a lot of heat. They also say it works better when wet to get rid of moisture on the inside!However not always good for a biker as there isnt as much heat difference each side of the goretex so it doesnt really know which way to pass moisture vapour if you like.
Hence going on this theory, no re-treaters are ever going to work as goretex is not a treatment waterproofer like say a silicone coating, it just is a culinder basically.
Goretex only leaks when eother the seams split, it has a hole in it or it can actually wear out, ie go thin.
If you wash goretex and use softener it will make it leak as the softener makes the goretex wick moisture in.

The temperature you are interested in is getting the temperature inside the goretex above the dew point - so that you can actually get the vapour through the membrane. :rob

As to cleaning goretex - it is made from PTFE filament and if hydrocarbons, HFCs and MethylEthylBadShit doesn't affect PTFE - I can't see Ariel, Bold or Lenor Conditioner making much of a dent in it............ :blast

Al :thumb2
 
The temperature you are interested in is getting the temperature inside the goretex above the dew point - so that you can actually get the vapour through the membrane. :rob

As to cleaning goretex - it is made from PTFE filament and if hydrocarbons, HFCs and MethylEthylBadShit doesn't affect PTFE - I can't see Ariel, Bold or Lenor Conditioner making much of a dent in it............ :blast

Al :thumb2


So is this temperature difference the reason why they don't recommend heated grips in the rain?
( because the 'goretex' in the gloves works in reverse?)
 
So is this temperature difference the reason why they don't recommend heated grips in the rain?
( because the 'goretex' in the gloves works in reverse?)


I reckon.

The water on the outside - evaporates and can therefore pass through the membrane.

Al :thumb2
 
Hi-viz goretex jacket arrived today, good fit over my jacket. Well pleased, just want it to piss down now.
 
I have been to the Dirt Bike Show today and bought a Powerxross jacket and a pair of Powerxross gloves from the guys at Adventure Spec.

A very nice product and a decent set of guys too.
 
Its a common misconception and also a marketing dream that goretex can be re treated!
I went on a goretex course a few years ago when I worked at a BMW dealership.
Goretex is from scotland, it was discovered by mistake and is a closely guarded secret in how its made, it has many patents, which is why there are so many other 'copies'.
Basically goretex is a membrane which after its production process is full of holes, These holes are, smaller than a water droplet molecule but bigger than a water vapour particle, hence waterproof and breathable. Goretex works better if there is a temp difference, thats why it always works well for walkers and other kind of sports as you generate a lot of heat. They also say it works better when wet to get rid of moisture on the inside!
However not always good for a biker as there isnt as much heat difference each side of the goretex so it doesnt really know which way to pass moisture vapour if you like.
Hence going on this theory, no re-treaters are ever going to work as goretex is not a treatment waterproofer like say a silicone coating, it just is a culinder basically.
Goretex only leaks when eother the seams split, it has a hole in it or it can actually wear out, ie go thin.
If you wash goretex and use softener it will make it leak as the softener makes the goretex wick moisture in.

Actually Nikwax do a range of products that clean goretex and improve the water repellancy. :rob
 


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