Cymarc Tuning

TOM.

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HI folks, just letting you know about my recent experience with Mark Hooton at Cymarc. As you all know Mark is a well respected supplier of stainless steel parts for our bikes and has recently started to offer servicing, diagnostics and tuning for BMW’s.

I have just gone down the same path as my dad and fitted Keihen headers and an Akrapovic silencer to my GSA TC. As everyone knows this makes an already lean bike even leaner so that left me with option of either fitting a power commander, a hilltop remap or have Mark and his colleague Martin install a Dimsport Rapid bike pro Tuning ECU. I was initially going to go with a Hilltop option as my Dad had this done to his bike and the results were very good but around the same time I was informed that Mark was branching out into tuning. I had met Mark when he supplied some stainless parts for my bike and was impressed with his enthusiasm and professionalism when dealing with his customers so I was keen to speak to him about tuning my bike. I met Mark at his immaculate well equipped workshop in Scunthorpe and he went through what he could offer and what to expect from the Dimsport rapid bike.

Mark offered me a go on his own rapid bike ECU fitted LC GSA which seriously impressed me with its performance but having not rode a standard LC I had nothing to compare it to. Anyway I took the plunge and booked my bike in with Mark and a few weeks later after a holiday touring the Picos on the bike I dropped it off with Mark and Martin for the work done.

Mark assured me that the greatest care would be taken with the installation and was true to his word, I even received images throughout the week of the bike being worked on.When the installation was completed Mark called to arrange a time to collect the bike and he could run through what he had done and how the software works.

Well,what does the bike feel like now the ECU has been installed? I can say without exaggeration that it feels like a completely different machine, the throttle response is as sharp as a nail and it pulls like train through every gear,the front wheel even tries to lift in third when giving it the “big un”. Its now become an absolute joy to ride.Compared to my dads bike which is identical but with a hilltop remap it feels more responsive and just as fast.

So after my experience with Mark and Martin I could not be happier, the bike is great which was looked after like one of their own first born!, their knowledge on BMW’s is first class and their professionalism towards me was exemplary. I am also really pleased to know that I have a good bloke like Mark just around the corner who will bend over backwards to help out when I need him, I know where I'm going when the BMW warranty runs out!.

A couple of the photos Mark sent me during the fitting.




 
Actually, and excuse the flippancy, it depends on what kit for what bike but basically it ranges from £350 to £550 or thereabouts - and it depends on which kit


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Believe these were the choice of HP2 owners in the past.
I understand the basic 'Easy' unit is an O2 manipulator that helps the closed part of the fuel map.
Now, where have I heard of that idea before?
I'm not knocking Mark here, his stainless products are well respected and he doesn't stick the arm in on price, but he comes across that he would rather not do any more of these tuning units?
It took a week to install! I thought it would be a pain to take it to Hilltop for a day.
Is that why Mark isn't keen?
I fitted my AF-XIED units in under an hour and my bike is transformed.
BTW Tom, changing your exhaust doesn't make it run any weaker. The stock ECU adapts to modest changes.
A question or three.
When you go to trade it in for an LC, as you will, what happens to the Dimsport unit? Is it easy to remove and can it be easily fitted to another GS?
Will your friendly BMW dealer be a happy bunny if you leave it on when trading in?
Just a few questions the average tosser might ask.
 
comberjohn said:
Believe these were the choice of HP2 owners in the past.
I understand the basic 'Easy' unit is an O2 manipulator that helps the closed part of the fuel map.
Now, where have I heard of that idea before?
I'm not knocking Mark here, his stainless products are well respected and he doesn't stick the arm in on price, but he comes across that he would rather not do any more of these tuning units?
It took a week to install! I thought it would be a pain to take it to Hilltop for a day.
Is that why Mark isn't keen?
I fitted my AF-XIED units in under an hour and my bike is transformed.
BTW Tom, changing your exhaust doesn't make it run any weaker. The stock ECU adapts to modest changes.
A question or three.
When you go to trade it in for an LC, as you will, what happens to the Dimsport unit? Is it easy to remove and can it be easily fitted to another GS?
Will your friendly BMW dealer be a happy bunny if you leave it on when trading in?
Just a few questions the average tosser might ask.
Click to expand...

Ah, perhaps I have not explained myself properly fella :bounce1 I am keen to do more of these units, along with my colleague, as they great and make the bikes run as they should and not as the emissions control departments want (or need) them to run! It took a (happy) week to fit but can be done in just a few hours - don`t forget, this is as much as an indulgence as it is a commercial enterprise. The customer was away in any case and never paid for any extra time which was taken through choice. And its the reason I get such good feedback because the lads can see I`m not trying to screw every last penny out of them, do the job as quickly as possible, I have a day job anyway and I care for the bike as if it was mine - there`s not many commercial (albeit good I`m sure) establishments who can do that sort of thing, and survive.........

Regarding the exhaust and the ECU adapting to modest changes, we may have to agree to disagree about that one fella :thumb2 some exhausts are more efficient (especially without the cat) and can make the engine run lean and ask the owners who`s bike hunts and surges at low revs if their ECU`s are adapting and you may find out not. Not that I`m here to argue with anyone, we are all like minded bikers at the end of the day who love our bikes, and all I want to do is offer a difference of opinion, that`s all:beerjug:

Yes the ECU and wiring can be taken off (that`s much easier to do!) and it can be transferred onto another bike, depending on the bike and model of kit fitted. I have no idea what the BMW dealer would say about it being left on on trade-in. The next buyer may thank you that you did!

So, ride safe, thanks for showing an interest in the thread and if you ever want one fitting I shall give you some sort of discount :bounce1
 
You say the ECU and wiring can be taken off if selling. Does the bike still have the original ECU in place along with stock wiring or does it have to be replaced?
I think that you are being a bit trusting about the next owner or a BMW dealer being impressed, no matter how well it goes. A warranty from a dealer with it fitted? What are we supposed to do if it goes wrong? Dimsport? Never heard of 'em.
Only reason I'd heard of Dimsport was because I was doing some research last year when I was looking at options to having to travel to Hilltop for a re map from Northern Ireland. They are a bit too niche.

On exhausts. I agree that removing the cat seems to help the bike breathe, although anything I have read is anecdotal. Tried it myself, but my OPINION was that it moves the power higher up the rev range at a slight cost to mid range. Anyone can feel free to disagree. That's why I said 'my opinion'.
Regarding silencers. Have a search for an article that Motorrad Germany did when they tested around 20 of the top silencers for the TC, including putting them on a dyno. German efficiency!
The vast majority produced less power than stock, the top brands including Akro, only matched the stock silencer. I think that only two silencers improved on stock by a few BHP, but were seriously loud.
BMW have produced one of the most efficient silencers in terms of power and noise output, even if they are ugly as sin. There again, if you want to roar about like an arse with a power reduction, take your pick!
The ECU does adapt to small changes. But it stays the surgey, lumpy thing that it was with the stock silencer. They all do that, sir. Only changes to the ECU are going to make it run better.
Motorrad have a video on You Tube giving the sound on all of the different systems and virtually all nearly stalled moving off. Even the seriously expensive ones didn't help. Think the rider was getting the hang of it by the end.

So, who says that the ECU is capable of making small changes to the fuelling depending of input from things like the O2 exhaust sensors? There are supposed to be other inputs that do so as well, but I'm already on my limits.
Again, anecdotally, Geoff from Hilltop has told clients to go ahead and have a re map and change the exhaust later as the ECU will compensate.
Roger, who helped to develop the AF-XiED units has done extensive tests on the adaptability of the stock ECU and has came to the same conclusion.
Dimsport on their website appears to say that their 'Easy' unit does much the same as the AF-XiED units. Altering the signal from the O2 sensor causes the ECU to change the fuel ratio in the closed part of the fuel map, leading to better low and mid range performance.
There is some evidence that the ECU will eventually alter the open part of the map, but now I really am past my knowledge limit.
It's why there is a Lambda probe is in the exhaust in the first place and it's also why the sensor is removed when using a PCV.

I have had a PCV but have been running AF-XiED units for the last 12000 miles and love what they do for my GS TC. Have been down the road of a full sport exhaust system. Stuck it for two days. Now have the complete standard system back on, complete with flappy valve. Boring, but I find that it smoothes out really nicely at 120mph+. (Track days only, of course.)

Mark, as I said earlier, you are well respected for your stainless products at a sensible price and I hope that Tom is happy with his module and that your business prospers.
 
Just 3 points ,
1. The adaptive ability of the BMS-K ecu are far wider than I would have expected.
I have tried varying the air fuel ratio with a Techlusion unit on one cylinder of an R1200 whilst monitoring the AFR with an Innovate LM2 .
The Lambda sensors correct fueling errors and adapts them out remarkably quickly. So an exhaust and air filter change are are easily dealt with by the stock ecu.
2. Any doubt about the open loop adaptation from the closed loop changes can be seen with a GS911 in real time values. ( the latest updates let you view these adaptation figures in real time). Both short term and long term.
3. I am not sure why anyone would look for an alternative to the AF-XIED`s to alter the AFR from stock, as all the data I have recorded over 30K + miles show they work as stated and are small simple to fit and easily transferred to another bike.
 
Mistacat said:
Just 3 points ,
1. The adaptive ability of the BMS-K ecu are far wider than I would have expected.
I have tried varying the air fuel ratio with a Techlusion unit on one cylinder of an R1200 whilst monitoring the AFR with an Innovate LM2 .
The Lambda sensors correct fueling errors and adapts them out remarkably quickly. So an exhaust and air filter change are are easily dealt with by the stock ecu.
2. Any doubt about the open loop adaptation from the closed loop changes can be seen with a GS911 in real time values. ( the latest updates let you view these adaptation figures in real time). Both short term and long term.
3. I am not sure why anyone would look for an alternative to the AF-XIED`s to alter the AFR from stock, as all the data I have recorded over 30K + miles show they work as stated and are small simple to fit and easily transferred to another bike.
Click to expand...

Good points, especially about the 911 - I`ll have to update mine. Thanks!

And after careful consideration of all the opinions it`s clear that altering the AFR, by any method, can only be considered a positive in nearly every case.
 
Despite the above comments I went out on my bike again yesterday and did approximately 70 miles & am pleased to report that factually in the real world the bike performed very well as the rapid auto adaptation continued to build its base map. The engine acceleration was crisp and the power in the midrange was even stronger and was especially noticeable when Giving it some. I've had several sports bikes over the years including track bikes I'm not a novice and likewise I'm not an expert but I do know how the bike felt and how it feels now. I'm also a sceptical person and mark will probably tell you that I also didn't think there would be as much improvement as there is but I was proved wrong.
 
TOM. said:
Despite the above comments I went out on my bike again yesterday and did approximately 70 miles & am pleased to report that factually in the real world the bike performed very well as the rapid auto adaptation continued to build its base map. The engine acceleration was crisp and the power in the midrange was even stronger and was especially noticeable when Giving it some. I've had several sports bikes over the years including track bikes I'm not a novice and likewise I'm not an expert but I do know how the bike felt and how it feels now. I'm also a sceptical person and mark will probably tell you that I also didn't think there would be as much improvement as there is but I was proved wrong.
Click to expand...

What an excellent `real world` appraisal from a fellow biker who also has a healthy dose of scepticism (nothing wrong with that!)

:thumb2
 
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