drive shaft clearance, or lack of....

[zerocool]

This is my second drive shaft and imagine my concern when I whipped off the rubber earlier today to find metal shavings. I immediately thought..... "oh no.... not again"

2011s drive shaft disaster:

I checked the splines and CV joint and pleasantly I found the all looked lovely and greased just like I left them after the last shafy CV joints failed.

So where are the shavings coming from.....

Shavings:

Shaft edge has markings from hitting the shaft housing:

Inside of the shaft housing:

No damage to the outer shaft housing:

So my question is.... whats gone wrong???

I did replace the shaft housing with another from a none ADV model along with the shaft from a none ADV model, could it be that, am I operating my suspension at too great a extreme, too much load, not enough load?

 

[davegs]

This is my second drive shaft and imagine my concern when I whipped off the rubber earlier today to find metal shavings. I immediately thought..... "oh no.... not again"

2011s drive shaft disaster:

I checked the splines and CV joint and pleasantly I found the all looked lovely and greased just like I left them after the last shafy CV joints failed.

So where are the shavings coming from.....

Shavings:

Shaft edge has markings from hitting the shaft housing:

Inside of the shaft housing:

No damage to the outer shaft housing:

So my question is.... whats gone wrong???

I did replace the shaft housing with another from a none ADV model along with the shaft from a none ADV model, could it be that, am I operating my suspension at too great a extreme, too much load, not enough load?[

I'm sure it's to do with it not being an adv shaft, if he dosent appear pm Steptoe he'll tell you for definate.

 

[PaulRS]

My guess is that the drive shaft wasn't fully engaged to the gearbox shaft.

Inside the splined part of the U-joint, there is a snapring/lockring which should lock into the groove in the gearbox shaft.
When installing the shaft, it needs a blow with a hammer to 'snap' into place, fixing the two together, that gives you the few mm you need.

Paul.

 

[(RIP) DitchWater]

IIRC I know that the drive shaft is different for a GSA over a GS but I don't know much about the swinging arrm.

Is your torque arm standard length?

 

[Two wheels good]

Realoem quotes the same part num for swing-arm but different numbers for driveshaft. (based on '02 model). No details listed measurements.
26117655802 GS driveshaft
33172338126 GS Sarm

26117671303 GSA driveshaft
33172338126 GSA Sarm

 

[fatnfast]

I would go with PaulRS on this one. When I had mine apart I gave it a good clout to make sure the snap ring located correctly.
As I understand, the part numbers differ as the ADV shaft is indexed to aid fitting it aligned correctly.

 

[PaulRS]

As I understand, the part numbers differ as the ADV shaft is indexed to aid fitting it aligned correctly.

ADV shaft has a 'blind spline', aka like a keyway so it fits in one position only.
Length wise they are the same.

Paul.

 

[Welshman]

My guess is that the drive shaft wasn't fully engaged to the gearbox shaft.

Inside the splined part of the U-joint, there is a snapring/lockring which should lock into the groove in the gearbox shaft.
When installing the shaft, it needs a blow with a hammer to 'snap' into place, fixing the two together, that gives you the few mm you need.

Paul.

Agreed, I had the same issue other end, it needs a smack to seat the circlip otherwise the movement all happens top or bottom not in the middle where its supposed to

Bad news is, the splines on the top of your driveshaft or worse g,box may now be buggerred

No vibration or noises????

 

[zerocool]

im pretty sure the shafts are the same except for the mark on the splines.

its possible I didnt get it all the way home when I rebuilt it last time, ill make sure its OK when reassembled.

There are no problems with the bike, ride is perfect and I wouldnt have known there was a issue as I have not heard any noises, I can only imagine that this has happened slowly over a large number of miles.

 

[zerocool]

torque arm is standard length

what is the best technique for reassembly?

Im guessing:

1. shaft on and whacked with rubber mallet
2. shaft housing slid over
3. bevel box on - does this also need a whack? to secure the splines

 

[DrFarkoff]

what is the best technique for reassembly?

1. shaft on and whacked with rubber mallet gently tapped on to the shaft it should not take massive effort to clip on, an old trick is to dunk the splined bit in a bucket of boiling water to swell it a bit Obviously keeping the UJ out of the water, Thats an old trick taught to me by my foreman in Scania So Simple and really helps when putting an output flange back on an GRS900 gearbox
   
   
2. bevel box on - does this also need a whack? to secure the splines No this should be an easy sliding fit with a good anti seize aluminium grease
   
   

 

[PaulRS]

Long end of the shaft goes to the gearbox, obviously, secure with a blow from the hammer.

Short end goes to the bevel box, again secured with the same technic.

Bevelbox on, sliding the two halves of the shaft together.

Check if both U-joints are phased, as in lined up correctly and give all splines a coating of Moly lube.

Paul.

 

[DrFarkoff]

Wrong info Paul it's a 1200

One piece shaft no chance of misaligment (unless you have twisted it with brute force)

The rear section is now the sliding part of the earlier shafts and should slide easily

Long end of the shaft goes to the gearbox, obviously, secure with a blow from the hammer.

Short end goes to the bevel box, again secured with the same technic.

Bevelbox on, sliding the two halves of the shaft together.

Check if both U-joints are phased, as in lined up correctly and give all splines a coating of Moly lube.

Paul.

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

Wrong info Paul it's a 1200

One piece shaft no chance of misaligment (unless you have twisted it with brute force)

The rear section is now the sliding part of the earlier shafts and should slide easily

Looks like a 1150 to me

 

[zerocool]

Looks like a 1150 to me

It's definitely a 1150, 2003 vintage

 

[DrFarkoff]

I'll hold my hand up and say Sorry Wrong bike for some reason I thought it was a 1200 in that case you need a good clunk with a mallet each end to get it to locate and be careful of the shaft alignment I think Steptoe has a picture of how they should be phased on here somewhere

 

[zerocool]

progress update

new parts on today and the clutch leak has stopped. Washers were definitely to blame. A 10mm bleed nipple now features as a part of my travel toolkit.

Now to reassemble the shaft, for myself and others benefits here are the drive shaft alignment or phasing pictures: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=472815

although this thread seems to contradict it.... http://bmwmotorcycletech.info/phasing.htm

It seems to may that phasing onto the gearbox is not important, there are not alignment markers on the old or the new splines but on the bevelbox end there are so I'm taking it as thats the issue to get right. Can anybody confirm or deny ? The workshop manual is useless on this topic.

 

[PaulRS]

I never saw any alignment marks on either the gearbox or bevel box end?
But then again, I never really looked for them.

Got pic's?

Also, when you phase the shaft on the workbench, you'll see that they are a few degrees off.

Even the works manual doesn't mention it, thats correct.

To install;

Fit shaft to gearbox, whack it.
Fit other shaft to bevel box, whack it.
Fit swingarm.
Then align both shaft ends as close as possible and fit bevelbox to swing arm.

Don't forget the rubber gaiter, DAMHIK.

Paul.

 

[zerocool]

Hi Paul,

The marks I refer to are three:

• pivot points
• spline positioning
• marks that I made based on the alignment of the origional shaft, all of which agree except as you noted the small difference in the pivot points which are fractionally offset

Been on a quite a few rides since then (despite breaking my left foot..... shhhhhhh, don't tell the doctor) and all seems good.

Im not sure if I mentioned already but I discovered the difference in the different drive shafts, the replacement shaft is longer in its wider section and shorter in the narrower section with the rubber cush insert. This means the "neck" of the shaft is deeper in the shaft housing where it is narrower. Its probable that its very unlikely for others to have this problem as I think its a combination of the longer outer shaft component and also the lack of being whacked over the securing ring that caused the grinding.