Fixing ABS with Fiesta motor

[Simon-GS]

On my 2008 GSA I have fixed the dreaded brake fail warning (non servo) a few times by cleaning and opening out the brush holders in the ABS motor. I am getting a bit tired with this now so am looking for a more permanent fix. I have acquired a late model ford fiesta ABS unit and removed the motor. From reading various forums this should fit straight on BUT the eccentricity of the motor is more on the Fiesta (2mm) compared to the BMW (1mm). Does anyone have any long term experience of running the Fiesta motor on the BMW ABS?

The alternative is to pull the fiesta motor apart and use the brush plate from this on the BMW motor. It seems a shame to split it if I don't need to, and I don't have the correct size puller...

 

[UturnTony]

I can't advise you of the suitability of the replacement although i have read they do work but, as far as i know
the Fiesta and other Ford models ABS unit suffer the same failures as the BMW fitment.

 

[snaponphil]

Hi, ive got one sitting in my garage for same repair, but it'll be summer before I get round to doing it.

 

[kyrano]

Interesting thread, Is there any particular year you have to use the fiesta ABS pump from ? and does it fit all years BMW's ?

 

[Bendy toy]

My 05 Renault Espace had an ABS unit that looked identical to the one on the 08 GSA. The car unit was still working fine though its mounting box (under the front bumper) was rusted to death.

 

[Simon-GS]

I believe its the later model fiestas, mine is from a 2013 to 2015 (mk9?) part number CV21-2C405-EA. The electric motor looks identical to the BMW unit on my 2008 from the outside apart from as I mentioned the eccentricity of the motor spindle. I believe the brush and holder assembly was modified slightly to prevent the sticking issues but I only read that on the internet so wouldn't like to comment on the truth of that. The next step is to check the motor with 12v to make sure its all good then remove the BMW motor and see what the differences are and how it can be made to work. ideally I will just swap the motors, failing that I will swap the brush assemblies and reuse the BMW motor.

 

[Bendy toy]

The original motor is held by staked pegs (for want of a better word) on the aluminium block.
They have to be sliced off but then there's nothing to attach the new motor.
Has anyone drilled & tapped for some small retaining screws? The obvious risk is hitting a component beneath and scrapping the whole unit.


Sent somehow.

 

[(RIP) orbit]

I believe its the later model fiestas, mine is from a 2013 to 2015 (mk9?) part number CV21-2C405-EA. The electric motor looks identical to the BMW unit on my 2008 from the outside apart from as I mentioned the eccentricity of the motor spindle. I believe the brush and holder assembly was modified slightly to prevent the sticking issues but I only read that on the internet so wouldn't like to comment on the truth of that. The next step is to check the motor with 12v to make sure its all good then remove the BMW motor and see what the differences are and how it can be made to work. ideally I will just swap the motors, failing that I will swap the brush assemblies and reuse the BMW motor.

I asked the same question here, http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/434205-ABS-stopped-working-2007-GS interesting reply from "king key "

seems there was no problem with the fiesta motor .

 

[Simon-GS]

Thanks for that Orbit, so it seems at least one GS has the Fiesta motor ABS running successfully. I wonder how many miles King Key has on the repair?

Bendytoy, I did see a post on another site where someone had drilled and tapped the ABS module then used cut down washers to secure the ABS motor, search for it as the key is not to go too deep. Last time I fixed mine I epoxied it, seems secure enough and the worst case is that it falls off and the ABS fails again leaving me no worse off than I am now. I am hoping I will be able to break the epoxy free to remove the old motor, will be a good test of its strength.

 

[beachnut]

Just for info - my Motoscot repaired ABS on my 2007 GS is still working fine - just took the bike out for its first run after being sat in the workshop unused for over 2 months.
The only problem I had was my rear brake binding so cleaned it and fitted new pads.

 

[Santa-2512]

It wont fit Pre Aug 2006 models . Post aug 2006 you need to check your Vin against the EPC

There is a 4 month window on MY 2006 when this was fitted

 

[(RIP) orbit]

Thanks for that Orbit, so it seems at least one GS has the Fiesta motor ABS running successfully. I wonder how many miles King Key has on the repair?

I epoxied it, seems secure enough and the worst case is that it falls off and the ABS fails again leaving me no worse off than I am now. I am hoping I will be able to break the epoxy free to remove the old motor, will be a good test of its strength.

HI Simon GS , If you do get to fit the fiesta motor I would like to know how you got on , did it work ok etc. Unable to PM you as you are not a member .

 

[Simon-GS]

Its on my to do list. I have the motor and now have a small enough bearing puller. I believe the motor will fir straight on but the eccentricity of the shaft is greater on the Fiesta motor and i don't know enough about the valves it operates to know if this will cause an issue, possibly encouraging wear in the future? Some have said its OK but for me there is not enough data to be sure. I will have a look at it in a few weeks and report back on what I find/do.

 

[Simon-GS]

So I got round to it this evening... I removed the BMW motor from the ABS unit, removed the bearing from the front of the bearing so the motor front plate which holds the brush assemblies could be removed. I did the same on the fiesta motor. The bushes on the fiesta unit appeared thinner and moved much more easily in the brush holders. The BMW brushes felt 'gritty' and stuck in several places. The fiesta brushes moved much more easily and the springs easily pushed them the full length of their travel.

Reassembled the BMW motor using the fiesta front plate with brush assembly, refitted to the bike and all seems to work as it should.

Could I have simply swapped the entire ABS motor? Possibly, the valves that the motor operate seem to have plenty of travel but for the sake of the extra 10 minutes to remove the bearings and motor end plates plus the cost of a new bearing I think its worth swapping the brushes and letting the rest of the ABS work as BMW (Teves) designed it to.

Lets see how long it stays fixed for.....

 

[(RIP) orbit]

Thanks for the update , any chance of some info on the bearing puller and source / pt no of the bearing you replaced on the motor ?

 

[Simon-GS]

Of course, I can see that would help...

First the ABS unit was from ebay, search for Ford Fiesta ABS Pump Mk9 2013 2015 CV21-2C405-EA. cost about £45
The bearing came from simplybearings.co.uk -Extreme-Electric-Motor-Quality-Rubber-Sealed-Deep-Groove-Ball-Bearing-10x26x8mm and was £3.38. inc vat.
The puller I ordered from ebay. its on the way from Hong Kong. In the meantime I borrowed a windsceen wiper arm/ battery terminal puller which did the job perfectly Just make sure it closes up to less than 26mm. You have to cut some grooves in the outer part of the bearing for the puller to grip as you cant get behind the bearing, use a dremmel or similar for this.

When you refit the bearing be careful to press it home just on the inner part of the bearing. Before removing the bearing I measured the exposed part of the shaft on my motor to be 12mm. Using a small socket I gently tapped the bearing on the shaft to the correct depth.

One trick worth noting is how to fit the end bearing back in the ABS body. You have to put it in at 90 degrees to where it should be then flip it to the correct orientation. It took me ages to figure this out first time!

It is possible to remove the motor from the ABS unit without taking the ABS unit from the bike. Its fiddly but saves bleeding the brakes etc. Well, it was possible on my bike

 

[(RIP) orbit]

Excelent, you are a gentleman sir.

Just have to pluck up the courage to go for it now , will try to source the abs unit from a scrappers here in France and get a bearing , then keep them to look at untill the fault and the red light stop being intermittent and start really pi****g me off .

Once again thanks for taking the time to reply .

 

[King Key]

Thanks for that Orbit, so it seems at least one GS has the Fiesta motor ABS running successfully. I wonder how many miles King Key has on the repair?

Bendytoy, I did see a post on another site where someone had drilled and tapped the ABS module then used cut down washers to secure the ABS motor, search for it as the key is not to go too deep. Last time I fixed mine I epoxied it, seems secure enough and the worst case is that it falls off and the ABS fails again leaving me no worse off than I am now. I am hoping I will be able to break the epoxy free to remove the old motor, will be a good test of its strength.

The GS belongs to my friend and the ABS is still working fine, sorry I don't have mileage details. We drilled and tapped 2 screw holes to carry the motor, it is a fairly low stress mounting.

 

[Bendy toy]

Good to know there's enough metal depth to take the new screw holes.


Sent somehow.

 

[andeebee]

Good detective work chaps.
Looking on ebay it seems the same module was fitted to a few in the Ford range.
This one is from a 2013 BMax http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2013-FORD-B-MAX-ABS-Pump-10-0212-0921-4-CV21-2C405-EA-233/272500818063?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3D5f73db8a85394c86a2d25d189eb2dd90%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D272487346140
I would imagine getting as new a module as possible in the hope that the internals work for that little bit longer.

Following this thread closely as I am expecting this to be next on my list of adventures with my Adv...