FPC Carry Spare Vs Replace anyway

[Rasher]

If you're only going to Europe, there are BMW garages all over the place, so I wouldn't expect you to be out of commission for too long

Good point, but I would still have to pay for it as I do not think the BMW warranty pays for repairs abroad, plus if it happened on a Friday afternoon I could be stuck for 3 days. Carrying a wire / spare seems a reasonable idea.

I assume when they go the bike just instantly loses all power?

 

[Paul Wakefield]

It has been my impression that there are few newish bike fpc failures out there. A quick glance at the sticky seems to confirm this (I can't be bothered to do a detailed analysis) - most are older bikes and I would take a bet the majority of those are having original fpc failures (ie. do not have the newer units). The old fpcs were unreliable and I was delighted Tim pushed the issue. The new ones are not perfect but failures seem pretty rare.

My 2004 GS had an fpc failure (in 2004). But since then I have had no problems.

Personally I'd make sure I understand the workaround just in the case of the very small possibility of failure and stop worrying.

 

[Paul Wakefield]

BMW warranty covers repairs in Europe. You may have to pay but you can then reclaim.

 

[Rasher]

BMW warranty covers repairs in Europe. You may have to pay but you can then reclaim.

Sweet, may just stash a cable somewhere just in case I get one of these "rare" failures.

 

[itspilsbury]

Now guys I am totally confused. I have read this thread and others on this subject. I have obtained from my local dealer an old scrap FPC and cut the small 2 pin plug that comes out of the bottom of the controller, it has the blue wire and the yellow wire. Some posts contradict others as to which is the positive wire, some say blue some say the yellow????
I have made up a lead with a powerlet plug but obviously must connect the wires the correct way around.
Which one is the positive +v please????

 

[BBB61]

I did not realise how bloody unreliable BMW's are until after I had bought it, as well as FPC's blowing up all over the place on a daily basis it seems FD's are still failing earlier than a bloody chain - another one reported yesterday with a mere 14k on the clock.

So you have access to all the info that BMW have with regards to component failures then?

The things are bloody hand grenades and must be one of the least reliable bikes made in the last 30 years, yet command a huge price and massive servicing costs.

Based on what, what you have seen on the internet? If you look on the internet you will see that Elvis is still alive and the Holocaust never happened. As for servicing costs have you actually compared them with other makes? Do you have the facts and figures to back up your assertions? Have you contacted Triumph, Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki, Kawasaki and Ducati dealers to get quotes from them to compare with BMW servicing costs?

I really did think they were a bike you could expect 100k from without too many problems, high revving rocketships such as R6's easily exceed 50k these days despite producing 20% more power from an engine of half the capacity and cost about half as much as a 1200GS.

Current list price of the R6 is £9504. List price of the R1200GS is £10550. If the GS is twice as much as the R6 it should retail at £19000, going on your claims.

It is not hard to make electronics reliable these days, despite taking £11k of people for the GS BMW still refuse to spend a few pence more to provide a reliable FPC, same goes for the FD.

The evidence suggests otherwise, but let's not let that get in the way of your paranoia on the issue.

It is not so much the fact the FPC / FD are so shite, but even if you do replace them they will just let you down again, on the 8th model year these problems should be well banished.

Got the evidence to support that?

Unfortunately I cannot afford to swap the bike out right now and I do thoroughly enjoy riding it so have to make the best of it, hopefully it will struggle to 20k without blowing the FD / gearbox / Valves and I can sell it before the inevitable £1500 failures start mounting up.

What inevitable failures would they be then? I'm wondering because my 6 year old GS has done 36500 miles and it is still on the original FPC, EWS, FD, ABS, ECU, CIA. MI5 etc etc. Perhaps I have been unlucky then?

 

[Mark Hooton]

Jeez

Jeez, it`s easy to get scared witless and give up biking (or GS`s) for good!



Mark
www.cymarcbikeparts.co.uk

 

[Rasher]

Bloody hell when did 600's start costing £10k - You got me on that one, but I think a low performance plodder should have better reliability than a 600 screamer.

As to reliability, well just on this forum hundreds of FPC's have failed, they continue to fail even on new bikes and many owners have had more than one fail.

Same goes for Final Drives, multiple failures on the same bike and very low mileage failures. Quite a few owners here have reported multiple roadside recoveries from the one bike - compared to my 20+ years of biking on large capacity four strokes without a single recovery required (except a puncture)

BMW released the MU in 2008 and claimed to have improved reliability and with the 2010 model are also promising to improve reliability, so have now twice admitted to it being below par.

The much older 1100's / 1150's rarely report such issues and as the average 1100 / 1150 is older and with higher mileage that would also suggest the 1200's are less reliable.

I see quite a few owners do carry spare FPC's or bypass cables, I have never known owners of other bikes to carry spares like this, if there never was a problem and they were reliable then why do we have threads about "387 failures so far", "only respond if you have NOT had an FPC failure" - surely evidence that the things are not reliable?

I am sure some bikes have been reliable, others have been complete dogs, and probably a higher percentage of 1200GS' are dogs compared to most other models being sold today.

I think I will just carry a spare FPC as just because some do last many miles does not gaurantee mine will, hopefully if the FD has no play before I set off it will last a tour and with an FPC on-board I maybe have the same chance of making the trip as I would on a Jap bike

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

So you have access to all the info that BMW have with regards to component failures then?



Based on what, what you have seen on the internet? If you look on the internet you will see that Elvis is still alive and the Holocaust never happened. As for servicing costs have you actually compared them with other makes? Do you have the facts and figures to back up your assertions? Have you contacted Triumph, Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki, Kawasaki and Ducati dealers to get quotes from them to compare with BMW servicing costs?



Current list price of the R6 is £9504. List price of the R1200GS is £10550. If the GS is twice as much as the R6 it should retail at £19000, going on your claims.



The evidence suggests otherwise, but let's not let that get in the way of your paranoia on the issue.



Got the evidence to support that?



What inevitable failures would they be then? I'm wondering because my 6 year old GS has done 36500 miles and it is still on the original FPC, EWS, FD, ABS, ECU, CIA. MI5 etc etc. Perhaps I have been unlucky then?

I agree with you, Bob......................Rasher is 'banged to rights on that one'

 

[AberdeenAngus]

Now guys I am totally confused. I have read this thread and others on this subject. I have obtained from my local dealer an old scrap FPC and cut the small 2 pin plug that comes out of the bottom of the controller, it has the blue wire and the yellow wire. Some posts contradict others as to which is the positive wire, some say blue some say the yellow????
I have made up a lead with a powerlet plug but obviously must connect the wires the correct way around.
Which one is the positive +v please????

http://www.motorcycleinfo.co.uk/index.cfm?fa=contentGeneric.nvxszdkebklxuaer&pageId=428065

 

[BBB61]

As to reliability, well just on this forum hundreds of FPC's have failed, they continue to fail even on new bikes and many owners have had more than one fail.

And how many GS's (and other 1200 variants) have BMW made? It is well into six figures now. When you have some meaningful figures that can show that many bikes have failed then please let us know, but at the moment you have a few hundred which is a failure rate of less than 1 percent on the figures that are available here.

Same goes for Final Drives, multiple failures on the same bike and very low mileage failures. Quite a few owners here have reported multiple roadside recoveries from the one bike - compared to my 20+ years of biking on large capacity four strokes without a single recovery required (except a puncture)

Once again, anecdotal evidence from the internet is not conclusive proof that there is an across the board issue. How many people have not had any problems with these components? Do you have the statistics that show the full extent of the issue or is it just your usual glass half empty rhetoric?

BMW released the MU in 2008 and claimed to have improved reliability and with the 2010 model are also promising to improve reliability, so have now twice admitted to it being below par.

Do you have some links to where BMW have made admissions twice that things were not up to scratch? I remember seeing something in MCN a couple of years ago about the FPC's and an admission that things were not as they should be, but only the one article.

The much older 1100's / 1150's rarely report such issues and as the average 1100 / 1150 is older and with higher mileage that would also suggest the 1200's are less reliable.

The 1100 came on to the market in 1994 followed by the 1150 in 1999. Back then there was nothing like the level of forums available as there are now. UKGSer started in 2002 or thereabouts very close to the end of the line of the 1150's. The 1200 has been fully exposed to the internet whereas the older models have not had the same level of exposure. Neither did they sell in the same numbers as the 1200.

My 1200 is now about the same age as my old 1150 and the mileage of my 1200 is within a couple of thousand miles of that on my 1150, yet it was the 1150 that I had the final drive bearing failure on. In my own personal experience my 1200 and 1150 have been on a par, with the 1200 being ahead as it hasn't had a FD issue.

My 1100GS had issues with the finish on the wheel rims and spokes and the petrol tank was replaced outside of warranty as it was allowing fumes to seep through and was causing the paintwork to bubble up (plastic tank). This led to BMW replacing the plastic tanks with metal ones. It also did not run very well at low speed and I couldn't use any higher than third gear around town. A superchip cured that and transformed the bike. But this is an issue I didn't have with my 1200, which has run beautifully from day one.

Having owned the 1100, 1150 and now the 1200 I can honestly say, in my own personal experience, that the 1200 is no more or less reliable than its predecessors.

I see quite a few owners do carry spare FPC's or bypass cables, I have never known owners of other bikes to carry spares like this, if there never was a problem and they were reliable then why do we have threads about "387 failures so far", "only respond if you have NOT had an FPC failure" - surely evidence that the things are not reliable?

But it is not good statistical information, it is anecdotal. When you have some proper information please come back to us and let us know. As for other owners not carrying spares, what evidence do you have of owners of other bikes not carrying spares? Is that based on a quick survey down the pub or do you have something more concrete?

I am sure some bikes have been reliable, others have been complete dogs, and probably a higher percentage of 1200GS' are dogs compared to most other models being sold today.

And what evidence do you have to say that there are more bad 1200's than good ones? Or is it just your "woe is me" disposition kicking in again?

I think I will just carry a spare FPC as just because some do last many miles does not gaurantee mine will, hopefully if the FD has no play before I set off it will last a tour and with an FPC on-board I maybe have the same chance of making the trip as I would on a Jap bike

Either just get on the thing and ride it or if you are that pessimistic about the bike why not sell the bloody thing and get one of those Japanese bikes that you keep on about and ride that!

 

[BBB61]

I agree with you, Bob......................Rasher is 'banged to rights on that one'

Agreed Johnny. He has read all this stuff on the internet and is now shit scared to actually ride the bike incase his FD falls off/EWS fails/FPC fails/runs out of petrol/starts raining/rider has a brainstorm etc etc. I hope he doesn't start doing any research on food otherwise he might find himself deciding not to eat!

 

[Hexme]

Either just get on the thing and ride it or if you are that pessimistic about the bike why not sell the bloody thing and get one of those Japanese bikes that you keep on about and ride that!

Best thing I've seen all day

I'm on my 3rd GS/GSA, never had a problem and if I do I'll sort it, just ride and enjoy it

 

[Rasher]

OK so how many BMW cars are produced?

I bet they make far more cars than they do GS motorcycles and I bet they have had less diff failures on the cars than they have FD failures on the bikes.

I have used other forums for bikes and never seen anything like 100 reports on the same part, so the fact FPC's on this forum alone exceeded 387 several years ago suggests they are poor in relation to other makes and models.

Same for FD's, they blow up a lot more than they should, otherwise nobody would have got through 3 or 4, the law of averages would just not stack up, many owners have had 2,3 or 4 FD's go wrong, not possible through just bad luck.

Also why do they keep changing the design and maintenance requirements, if they were so bloody reliable they would still be fitting the original 2004 design and not recomending any oil changes. They have changed the basic designs, maintenance schedules, oil levels Just for fun? I think not

Maybe this forum skews the figures quite badly, maybe the bikes are better now - but if so why don't BMW offer a 5 year drive train warranty?

Regardless of how reliable the bikes really are there is a perception they are unreliable and a fair amount of evidence to support that (compared to other models that do not have 400 or 500 reports of the same failure on one forum)

It would take a lot of miles under my GS to convince me otherwise and I do not want to take the gamble and end up having to replace the FD a few times to prove they are crap.

I will definately replace the GS next year, I am hoping it can struggle to about 20k without exploding at which point I will trade it in for a BMW / Guzzi / Triumph / Honda / Yamaha - all of which I trust to be more reliable, cheaper to service and repair, and if they go wrong and better supported by the dealer / manufacturer.

I still have not got my warranty through from BMW 8 months after buying the bike despite many calls to the dealer and calls / E-Mails to BMW, it seems to me they just do not give a f*** and that is as big a problem as the perceived reliability issue, as I know if it does go wrong the dealer and manufacturer just do not want to know.

 

[st247]

I will definately replace the GS next year, I am hoping it can struggle to about 20k without exploding at which point I will trade it in for a BMW / Guzzi / Triumph / Honda / Yamaha - all of which I trust to be more reliable, cheaper to service and repair, and if they go wrong and better supported by the dealer / manufacturer.

 

[Rasher]

Ooops, that should read anything but a BMW!

I really like riding the GS and at first I considered trying my 2008 GS for a year or so and then maybe trading up to an almost new DOHC model, or even a GSA
but the "question mark" over reliability coupled with maintenance / repair costs and general dealer / manufacturer attitude put BMW out of the running.

For now I will carry the FPC (can always sell it if the original survives) check the rear wheel for free play every journey and renew my RAC membership, hopefully I can get 12 months from the bike without major cost or hassle.

 

[BBB61]

Has your GS actually broken down? Have you had a FD or FPC replaced on your own bike?

 

[autogs]

Has your GS actually broken down? Have you had a FD or FPC replaced on your own bike?

give up bob,the guy just does not want to listen,we just get the same old drivel the whole time.

 

[MGJ]

Has your GS actually broken down? Have you had a FD or FPC replaced on your own bike?

6 1200s and about 150'000 miles = 6 FDs and 1 fire and loads bits that can't deal with british winters. Plus loads of other stuff.

 

[BBB61]

6 1200s and about 150'000 miles = 6 FDs and 1 fire and loads bits that can't deal with british winters. Plus loads of other stuff.

Loads of bits that can't deal with a British winter? Sounds like a Triumph!