front wheel shimmy steering damper ?

[Riko]

During a recent trip to Europe, I was getting front wheel shimmy on braking into bends, (R1200 GS 2016). I have had this on other bikes over the years and its usually the front tyres need replacing and or balancing the weight of the bike, and I was fully laden with luggage/camping gear back seat so not too concerned. I have Avon trail riders on the front with about 4/5k but still some wear left. however when I got home I checked the steering damper and it appears to be easily moved up and down on the centre pivot rubber by about an inch either way, I know there should be some movement by design but it does seem to be a bit too loose when I rock it up and down is this normal ?

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Seems totally normally mine does that also, however you might want to read the thread below, could be the thing some are experiencing, but fully loaded up I suspect you just lightened the front so should be fine.

https://advrider.com/f/threads/2018-r1200gsa-issue-at-highway-speed-or-while-decelerating.1317858/

 

[Riko]

Seems totally normally mine does that also, however you might want to read the thread below, could be the thing some are experiencing, but fully loaded up I suspect you just lightened the front so should be fine.

https://advrider.com/f/threads/2018-r1200gsa-issue-at-highway-speed-or-while-decelerating.1317858/

Thanks Smogbob. An interesting read especially about loose spokes! and a few other possibilities I need to check out. Just noticed your loc as Black Forest, spent a day there last week, when will they re-surface the Baden Baden side of the L76b ? its like a patchwork quilt of minor repairs and pot holes, the other end is lovely smooth tarmac.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Thanks Smogbob. An interesting read especially about loose spokes! and a few other possibilities I need to check out. Just noticed your loc as Black Forest, spent a day there last week, when will they re-surface the Baden Baden side of the L76b ? its like a patchwork quilt of minor repairs and pot holes, the other end is lovely smooth tarmac.

Your welcome, they will do it eventually, as diffent parts have different priorities and budgets, to political for me, but on your subject go try your bike solo with no luggage and see if you get the same feeling, if that is the case then something is wrong, otherwise just a tad heavy will cause the front to raise a tad, and well you know what happens then.

 

[malcopopolo]

A few weeks ago I accelerated quite hard with a vario top box fully extended with no pillion. Bike went into a mild tank slapper, never had one before. Arse twitched but my instinct was to roll off the throttle which calmed it down. Cleaning the bike today and the steering damper did not appear to offer any resistance?

 

[beaver]

A few weeks ago I accelerated quite hard with a vario top box fully extended with no pillion. Bike went into a mild tank slapper, never had one before. Arse twitched but my instinct was to roll off the throttle which calmed it down. Cleaning the bike today and the steering damper did not appear to offer any resistance?

they are a bit poor me thinks.. on my other bike I had the front wheel bouncing quite a few times and thought to myself the damper could be better... you can get adjustable ones to fit but quite expensive..

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

A few weeks ago I accelerated quite hard with a vario top box fully extended with no pillion. Bike went into a mild tank slapper, never had one before. Arse twitched but my instinct was to roll off the throttle which calmed it down. Cleaning the bike today and the steering damper did not appear to offer any resistance?

Well resistance wise I would not say it is massive, even mine is just strong enough to stop the front wheel if you give it a light push, obviously topboxes hanging off the back of our bikes are supposed to be for touring reasons, if we push a bit to hard its like a leadball at the back...

 

[Warlord]

A while back setting up my Ohlins suspension, I noticed a weave at motorway speeds.

Just a slight oscillation left and right in a straight line. Never had it before.

I increased the rear shock pre-load raising the rear up more and this weave completely disappeared.

As the rear rises, the angles change on the front wheel. It solved my temporary weave issue.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

A while back setting up my Ohlins suspension, I noticed a weave at motorway speeds.

Just a slight oscillation left and right in a straight line. Never had it before.

I increased the rear shock pre-load raising the rear up more and this weave completely disappeared.

As the rear rises, the angles change on the front wheel. It solved my temporary weave issue.

Yep agree with you on that, many tend to forget these OEM shocks are set for riders weight and gear at 80 kgs not many tossers out there that weigh 80kgs, hence why I prefer Dynamic mode, it just hardens up the suspension that little more, and helps, as with these new bikes you can only go Auto, Max and Min, so Dynamic and Auto on Esa seems to do it for me, however come wintertime, shocks are off to Luke DenzO of this parish for heavier springs.

 

[Riko]

All luggage removed, quick spin today, handling back to normal no shimmy even when I tried to induce it. Although with panniers top box and a bag of camping gear strapped on the back seat I would have thought the ESA setting of one helmet and one luggage would have compensated ?

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

All luggage removed, quick spin today, handling back to normal no shimmy even when I tried to induce it. Although with panniers top box and a bag of camping gear strapped on the back seat I would have thought the ESA setting of one helmet and one luggage would have compensated ?

Going to be some Orange jumping in when back from the Spanish holiday, get ready............ however it is quite simple, it is all about the wind, I remember my harley with panniers bike was all over the place, naked solid as a rock, after that many things can affect the bike, tyres, screens and obviously quite large tossers grabbing more wind.

 

[CPJS]

Yep agree with you on that, many tend to forget these OEM shocks are set for riders weight and gear at 80 kgs not many tossers out there that weigh 80kgs, hence why I prefer Dynamic mode, it just hardens up the suspension that little more, and helps, as with these new bikes you can only go Auto, Max and Min, so Dynamic and Auto on Esa seems to do it for me, however come wintertime, shocks are off to Luke DenzO of this parish for heavier springs.

Be careful with messing with D-ESA, you can't just bung in a new spring as the preload setting will be wrong as the ride height will be different and the dampin will be out of range.
As you add more spring the bike will sit higher, the ESA thinks there is less load and gives less damping.
These problems are the reason Ohlins dropped the ESA shocks only touratech offer a replacement D-ESA. You can still manually alter the damping to fine tune the ESA to get a good base setting.
Ask around a few suspension experts and see what they say, I found as soon as you mention dynamic ESA you get an ah, right, some did not know what it was, those that did said they could not help me.
Make your own enquiries, you may do better than me, but be carefiul.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Be careful with messing with D-ESA, you can't just bung in a new spring as the preload setting will be wrong as the ride height will be different and the dampin will be out of range.
As you add more spring the bike will sit higher, the ESA thinks there is less load and gives less damping.
These problems are the reason Ohlins dropped the ESA shocks only touratech offer a replacement D-ESA. You can still manually alter the damping to fine tune the ESA to get a good base setting.
Ask around a few suspension experts and see what they say, I found as soon as you mention dynamic ESA you get an ah, right, some did not know what it was, those that did said they could not help me.
Make your own enquiries, you may do better than me, but be carefiul.

Cheers for the heads up, that is one of the reasons, I still have not done it, I still do not have 100% answers, Luke is still looking into it, the Touratechs are simple rebranded Tractive suspension, and the guys at Tractive in Holland change the damper and the spring at the same time, so school is still out for me, but eventually would like a heavier spring rate and damping, then the cost.... I was in the thinking that if the spring was changed out, and then a ESA calibration it might have been OK, however I still do not have the proof that will work, or is their more hidden wizardy in the bike that must be changed, so complicated.

 

[CPJS]

I did look on the Tractive site, they come without the electronic preload adjustment you have to use the one from your existing shock, the Touratech one comes with EPA fitted, part of the reason it is more expensive. I wanted to keep the stock shock as is and bung it back on when I sell, I can then put the touratech shock on the next bike with it already to go with my settings.
Yes it is expensive but if I keep riding GS's I can move to the next bike, get it rebuilt etc and eventually resell if need be. Riding solo the stock shock is ok for me, two up it just gets overwhelmed.
As I am a short arse not many bikes fit, especially ADV bikes, the GS low chassis fits me quite nicely so I will be sticking with them, most importantly the Boss approves of the spend as she gets to benefit from the ride quality as well.
The TT shock arrives soon and my dealer with fit it during service on the 30th, this will give me a month to play with it before setting off on a 24 day tour of Spain, Portugal and France. I will be able to give a debrief when I get back before going to Wales on the 8th Oct for a quick whizz round.
It's tough out there you know.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

I did look on the Tractive site, they come without the electronic preload adjustment you have to use the one from your existing shock, the Touratech one comes with EPA fitted, part of the reason it is more expensive. I wanted to keep the stock shock as is and bung it back on when I sell, I can then put the touratech shock on the next bike with it already to go with my settings.
Yes it is expensive but if I keep riding GS's I can move to the next bike, get it rebuilt etc and eventually resell if need be. Riding solo the stock shock is ok for me, two up it just gets overwhelmed.
As I am a short arse not many bikes fit, especially ADV bikes, the GS low chassis fits me quite nicely so I will be sticking with them, most importantly the Boss approves of the spend as she gets to benefit from the ride quality as well.
The TT shock arrives soon and my dealer with fit it during service on the 30th, this will give me a month to play with it before setting off on a 24 day tour of Spain, Portugal and France. I will be able to give a debrief when I get back before going to Wales on the 8th Oct for a quick whizz round.
It's tough out there you know.

Looking forward to that, and I can highly see the benefit on a low chassis 2 up and towing a caravan as we do...........