Hilltop Group Buy

[Roger 04 RT]

...
I am very happy with my bike how it runs (I have a 2011 triple black) and my main reason for going to Geoff would be the lean fuelling issue any performance gain or economy gain would just be a bonus.
Also WHY would you expect Geoff to give all his tuning secrets away ?

You could also just add AF-XIEDs. The bike stays in factory tune, the O2 sensors stay connected but baseline fueling is several percent richer (user settable). There is tons of documented measurement on how lambda-shifting (with Innovate Motorsports LC-2s or AF-XIEDs works.

 

[Sgt Bilco]

Would it be possible to have just ONE hilltop thread without this barrage of information which quite frankly no-one understands or cares about?

The facts are, the remap works and 99.9% of people are very happy.

Either get it done or don't but FFS can we just move on.

 

[Blackal]

Ok guys here goes with my reply to papasquelch
1. I was there when you took the bike back

[abridged]
.
Also WHY would you expect Geoff to give all his tuning secrets away ?

Cos "Wifey-poo" has told him to !

(Thanks for the clarification - it's making a lot more sense, now)

Al

 

[Engineer]

Would it be possible to have just ONE hilltop thread without this barrage of information which quite frankly no-one understands or cares about?

The facts are, the remap works and 99.9% of people are very happy.

Either get it done or don't but FFS can we just move on.

Some people do understand (to some extent) and are interested so these threads are good, its all about learning and gaining knowledge. When you say it works what you mean is that you are happy with the outcome for your bike and the way you use it. All engineering is a compromise and re-mapping is no different, BMW's engineers are not idiots but they are constrained by compromise and rules, perhaps Hilltop don't have the same constraints so are free to adjust things the way they like them to be.

I would like Hilltop to explain the compromises that they make here on the site so that we all get the same information - those that are interested in the technical stuff will be satisfied and those who want to make an informed decision whether or not to buy Hilltop's services get the information they need.

Hilltop have no obligation to say anything, but I think it would great publicity for them to do so.

That is a perfectly reasonable thing to ask - so why the animosity and ranting and insults?

 

[Deleted account 190920002]

Engineer did you go to the fishy school of experience because what you said is right on marra.

 

[Mr Bean]

Some people do understand (to some extent) and are interested so these threads are good, its all about learning and gaining knowledge. When you say it works what you mean is that you are happy with the outcome for your bike and the way you use it. All engineering is a compromise and re-mapping is no different, BMW's engineers are not idiots but they are constrained by compromise and rules, perhaps Hilltop don't have the same constraints so are free to adjust things the way they like them to be.

I would like Hilltop to explain the compromises that they make here on the site so that we all get the same information - those that are interested in the technical stuff will be satisfied and those who want to make an informed decision whether or not to buy Hilltop's services get the information they need.

Hilltop have no obligation to say anything, but I think it would great publicity for them to do so.

That is a perfectly reasonable thing to ask - so why the animosity and ranting and insults?

Didn't Geoff say that he was having an open day, or something like? Have you booked, after all it would be an ideal opportunity to get the answers first hand, particularly as you are much closer than a lot on here?

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

Didn't Geoff say that he was having an open day, or something like? Have you booked, after all it would be an ideal opportunity to get the answers first hand, particularly as you are much closer than a lot on here?

Indeed he is. He also asked Engineer to ring him to discuss or if he preferred he'd run nag Engineer if he gave him his phone number.

Andres

 

[Engineer]

Engineer did you go to the fishy school of experience because what you said is right on marra.

I didn't understand a word of that

 

[papasquelch]

Ok guys here goes with my reply to papasquelch
1. I was there....

Dear lawvar
Thanks for your input and may I congratulate you on your powers of recollection, given that I was some bloke you met in a workshop almost 4 weeks ago and who, presumably, you never thought you would have anything to do with again. Thanks also for agreeing with what I wrote regarding the lack of success of the “remap” in the last line of my original post (http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/404957-Hilltop-Group-Buy).

I am flattered that you think I am such an expert after only a couple of minutes of conversation. You are correct that I remapped the ECU of a previous bike, with significant immediate improvement to the way it rode. Prior to that (in a previous life) the only tuning I knew of involved Bing carburettors on the R80s maintained at the Enderby Transport Division workshops.

With regards to the Hilltop workshop, this is, of course, a subjective matter and we can both have an opinion on this, although you can only comment on the day I was having my bike “unmapped”. In my post, I actually only commented on the workshop when my bike was being “mapped” and you weren't there.

As this is a forum, then I am entitled to write about my experience, in the same way as those who are happy with the outcome can write about theirs.

At no time have I ever written that Geoff had been rude or had not honoured the refund and I find it somewhat bizarre that you are commenting on my interaction with him. If you are the guy I think you are, then with all due respect you were only there for 20'ish minutes. For most of that time, Geoff was talking to you, given that you had come in as a potential customer but I have no idea what you were talking about because you were out of earshot. During that period I had NO interaction with Geoff. You were not there when I arrived and had gone long before I left. I don't intend on suggesting that you are what you have accused me of being because I don't know you. However, it's a bit rich for you to comment on MY EXPERIENCE of Hilltop and the success or otherwise of the “remap” on MY XT1200Z. And lets be honest here, if you were waiting for a refund and were convinced that nothing had actually been done to your bike in the first place, would you pipe up in the workshop with the bloke who owed you £350 standing behind you?

Ah well, given your statement of our few minutes conversation (I didn't realise you were taking notes), I'm clearly busted though!!!!!

 

[Deleted account 190920002]

Sorry engineer I meant we learn and impart our knowledge by looking at the broader picture in my case by growing up with engineers in my fishy environment. Marra is a coloqual for mate up here in the North.

 

[Engineer]

Sorry engineer I meant we learn and impart our knowledge by looking at the broader picture in my case by growing up with engineers in my fishy environment. Marra is a coloqual for mate up here in the North.

Ahhhhh makes sense now, thanks I should re subscribe to Viz so that I can keep up with colloquialisms - not sure I spelled that correctly.

 

[papasquelch]

Sorry to be repeating this here but it seems that's is what has to be done with two threads running. Sgt Bilko is right about moving on.....
Having looked at lots of other Hilltop related threads since I went, I can see why somebody said “Make it Stop” at the outset. Clearly there are two camps: you're either a believer or you are trying to understand “it”, whatever “it” is, although being the latter clearly gets you slaughtered. Not sure why, given forums are for “sharing views”, good or bad. Like some others, I want to understand the in's and out's of what is being done to my motorcycle and yes I do have a good understanding of both computers and bikes. I went, I got, I paid, I wasn't happy with the experience or outcome, I got refunded. IN EACH POST I HAVE ALWAYS ACKNOWLEDGED THAT WHATEVER IS DONE WORKS FOR BMW RIDERS (GIVEN THEIR POSTS). I have ridden motorcycles (including BMWs) for over 40 years and been a member of a number of other forums. I have never seen such aggressive and nasty responses like I have seen across all these Hilltop threads. I am all for a bit of banter but intimidating posts seems to be the way a “Hilltop” thread works (if you are not a believer) - IMHO.

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

Mind you, if nothing else, this is one of the more entertaining Hilltop threads and I've never seen a wholesale complaint made by one person against such a large number of members to the mods before, that was pure class

Andres

 

[thebuyer]

your reply neoviper says a lot about your professionalism its certainly put me off

As lots of other people... Mine is fantastic after a visit... Would highly recommend, my 2013 GSA is the the smoothest GSA I've owned...

 

[Deleted account 190920002]

Thing is guys if it rings your bell then so what it's for you. Like bro and I had a good fishy year in 1976 I bought a vdub caravanette he a Rolex. Last year the past came up (as it does) at a family get together, well he rolled up his sleeve goldie Rolex popped out and he said where is your camper van? Ahh I said but we had fun.

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

Interesting that the Re-Mapping thread in the pub, which was actually developing into a vaguely interesting discussion about fuelung and how it's controlled got closed by the OP, but only after he made one final thinly veiled dig at Hilltop.

Some people are just never happy.

Andres

 

[Blackal]

Interesting that the Re-Mapping thread in the pub, which was actually developing into a vaguely interesting discussion about fuelung and how it's controlled got closed by the OP, but only after he made one final thinly veiled dig at Hilltop.

Some people are just never happy.

Andres

If you have a trawl through Engineer's posts for months now, and the number of times he has been advised by many (including Geoff at Hilltop) - to call Hilltop .............. you realise he is nothing more than a troll with an agenda. Whenever someone challenges him on it - he plays the wounded soul, to gain support from the gormless.


Al

 

[cookie]

.............. you realise he is nothing more than a troll with an agenda. Whenever someone challenges him on it - he plays the wounded soul, to gain support from the gormless.


Al

hmmm. that sounds familiar

 

[Deleted account 211025001]

hmmm. that sounds familiar

That thought has crossed my mind a few times, I wonder.....................

Andres

 

[GB.]

This is an interesting thread, for me anyway. I had my XChallenge done a few weeks back and I was sceptical like most people when you are laying out that kind of money for something you can't see. I've had bikes dyno'd and remapped before, and remapped my own Buell using ECMspy but no way am I an expert. There are some points in the first posts where I can see where he is coming from; the amount time on the dyno itself is minimal and "seemingly" little amount of part throttle runs. I did kind of ask Geoff how he does it but he was undstandably reluctent to tell me, and with good reason, I wouldnt give my livelihood secrets away either. I gained no maximum power at all between runs but on an xchallenge I didnt want that, I want better low down fuelling which I got in abundence, and overall I'm very pleased with the results. I also got a 5% improvement in fuel economy as well and bike what is much nicer to ride. My inquisitive nature wants to know how he does it but its the results that counts.

As for Tea and biscuits I had to make my own!!