IAM / Rospa or an advanced rider training day
- Thread starter adventuredon
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Having ridden with Giles, I can certainly endorse his offer Don.....just leave Hugo @ home
However, please ensure Giles is not wearing black tie and reciting classical tunes......
Deleted account 200502001
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You've just missed out on Hopp Rider Training track tuition day at Cadwell, all 100 places sold out in 2 days
. The user, Robb and myself are going. Bill (bbb) usually rides up from London for this day, but not this year. Next year will be my 3rd year attending. But Martin Hopp is doing another date later in the year, I (and others on here) highly recommend them. They don't necessarily train you how to speed around a track, rather they teach how to gain better road skills, it just happens to be on a track where its nice and safe - one way traffic, no kerbs, no street furniture etc etc. They put you into groups of 6 according to your ability - beginner/speed demon etc and their instructors are second to none. Its a full day of track riding, half hour on track followed by half hour off track. In the time off the track your in the classroom learning how to negotiate each bit of the track in a better way.
thumperbob2002
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I am an observer with the IAM and have been doing trackdays for 20 years, both in the UK and europe.
I think going on a trackday is pretty essential for most motorcyclists- the reason being you will very quickly get the feeling of how far you can lean and the amount of grip modern tyres have. This is very useful for that time when you simply get that corner wrong and will give you the confidence to get that bike round that corner, or to avoid that hazard.
Joining the iAM or ROSPA will give you the skills to read the road properly so you dont get into that situation in the first place.
See if you can speak to your observer before you go out with them- then you will be able to suss them out- I make no bones of it there are some pretty pedantic people in these groups- but if you find a good one it is great value.
Most groups will allow you to join them for a couple of taster sessions with no cost.
I think going on a trackday is pretty essential for most motorcyclists- the reason being you will very quickly get the feeling of how far you can lean and the amount of grip modern tyres have. This is very useful for that time when you simply get that corner wrong and will give you the confidence to get that bike round that corner, or to avoid that hazard.
Joining the iAM or ROSPA will give you the skills to read the road properly so you dont get into that situation in the first place.
See if you can speak to your observer before you go out with them- then you will be able to suss them out- I make no bones of it there are some pretty pedantic people in these groups- but if you find a good one it is great value.
Most groups will allow you to join them for a couple of taster sessions with no cost.
What a track doesn't offer is grids, poor road surfaces, potholes and all the other lovely things that road riding offers. Learning how to crank a bike over is only a very small part of riding a bike, but a large proportion of accidents occur through people bottling a corner rather than spanking it over on to it's ear.
The issue for me is trackdays may help you lean a bike on a perfect surface designed to offer grip, but this doesn't mean you can attack your local B road honking the bike over at maximum lean.
Real tuition is the best imho, and can only really be given by someone who is interested, interesting and who has lived it daily. Someone who is realistic in their assesment of the everyday challenges.
How fast do you want to go? Good road riding tuition will better inform you to decide what speed is appropriate, how to get the safest view by better positioning and how to be smooth and plan your riding. A trackday can help the likes of Giles who is already at an excellent level of riding, but it can also cause a whole heap of issues when people do a trackday and then try and apply the same speeds to the public highway or ride without the planning and knowledge that people like Micky and Giles have.
Getting a great instructor is the hardest bit, but good road tuition beats any trackday until you are fully proficient in road riding imho.
Trackdays are a whole heap of fun though if you like that sort of thing.
The issue for me is trackdays may help you lean a bike on a perfect surface designed to offer grip, but this doesn't mean you can attack your local B road honking the bike over at maximum lean.
Real tuition is the best imho, and can only really be given by someone who is interested, interesting and who has lived it daily. Someone who is realistic in their assesment of the everyday challenges.
How fast do you want to go? Good road riding tuition will better inform you to decide what speed is appropriate, how to get the safest view by better positioning and how to be smooth and plan your riding. A trackday can help the likes of Giles who is already at an excellent level of riding, but it can also cause a whole heap of issues when people do a trackday and then try and apply the same speeds to the public highway or ride without the planning and knowledge that people like Micky and Giles have.
Getting a great instructor is the hardest bit, but good road tuition beats any trackday until you are fully proficient in road riding imho.
Trackdays are a whole heap of fun though if you like that sort of thing.
Deleted account 200502001
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My theory is to do it all. I've done IAM, track days and next I want to do off-roading. Hopefully I'll be able to crank it over onto its ears whilst in the mud
I want to do off-roading. Hopefully I'll be able to crank it over onto its ears whilst in the mud
Did you not cover that crossing the mountain at Cadwell
Whilst one day training can be useful for specific skills, what it doesn't do is cover all the skills needed and ensure you have learnt what you were taught and trainers who think they can are kidding themselves. To make sure the techniques and skills are second nature takes a time.
Police motorcyclists do not learn their skills in a day or even a week.
IAM and RoSPA train riders over many weeks or months and put associates forward for a test when they are ready they also don't charge more if you need more training.
Police motorcyclists do not learn their skills in a day or even a week.
IAM and RoSPA train riders over many weeks or months and put associates forward for a test when they are ready they also don't charge more if you need more training.
Do all three over a period of time! No rush. As Giles says you never stop learning. I've done IAM and do observing for them. It's good value for money and the majority of observers know what they're talking about. If you get one you don't like most, if not all groups will let you change. Nowt worse than an observer and 'associate' at each other's throats. Don't work.
Never ridden with Giles but by all accounts he's very good. I have ridden with current and ex police bikers. Their standard of riding is very high and those who in addition have the communication skills to go with that can open your eyes in a very short time. They do tend to have the emergency services humour gene which can shock the uninitiated.
Hopp rider training is difficult to get on unless you're the Bear apparently. California Superbike School is an alternative. We sent an old colleague of mine , police biker, some years ago to check if what they did would be of benefit. He was pretty positive about them. I would also recommend British Superbike School at Blyton, run by Mike Abbott. Maximum of 3 to 1 rider to trainer ratio, max. Of 9 bikes on track at any one time. Good trainers (Dan Linfoot is one) and a road skills based level 1 course. Plus they do a very good deal for IAM members.
See what you did there Flip
Otherwise, wise words indeed
I fear you are being too modest Micky.
Just to further add to the "do both" camp, or better still, do them all. And when you've done them all, go back and do them again!
All the experience you can get, from whatever source.
I've done a few track days at Oulton Park (5 mins away from where I live) which gave me more confidence in the bike's ability, in ideal conditions ( yes Phil). At least I now know what it can do. They have instructors who, on an informal basis, follow you round and suggest what you can do to go faster, or smoother, or pick better lines etc, but of course these are geared to track riding. Immense fun though.
My local IAM had a taster session, which put me off somewhat. I realise this could be down to the individual observer, especially as one of my mates is currently doing the full Monty with them, and is loving it. I must re-visit, if only to see if the argument still stands.
Do you have the Police "Bikesafe" courses near you? I found that to be outstanding.
Good luck with your choice!
Mark
All the experience you can get, from whatever source.
I've done a few track days at Oulton Park (5 mins away from where I live) which gave me more confidence in the bike's ability, in ideal conditions ( yes Phil). At least I now know what it can do. They have instructors who, on an informal basis, follow you round and suggest what you can do to go faster, or smoother, or pick better lines etc, but of course these are geared to track riding. Immense fun though.
My local IAM had a taster session, which put me off somewhat. I realise this could be down to the individual observer, especially as one of my mates is currently doing the full Monty with them, and is loving it. I must re-visit, if only to see if the argument still stands.
Do you have the Police "Bikesafe" courses near you? I found that to be outstanding.
Good luck with your choice!
Mark
Did one day with Rapid Training about 5 years ago and was mightily impressed at the new stuff I learnt even after 25 years bike riding.
I still remember the tips and tricks and put the knowledge into action consciously every time I ride out now.
I have done track days and various advanced courses but nothing has came close to the Rapid Training experience in terms of the step change in my riding ability.
I still remember the tips and tricks and put the knowledge into action consciously every time I ride out now.
I have done track days and various advanced courses but nothing has came close to the Rapid Training experience in terms of the step change in my riding ability.
Tomcat
Registered user
Come over to Ripley, 1st Sunday of the month. Check us out - you don't have to join to have an assessed ride. Aim to be at Ripley Village Hall about 9.30 and look out for the people wearing meet 'n' greet T-shirts, as they'll show you around. We've got a cafe serving butties and drinks if you need some breakfast. You will usually have a different Observer for each monthly Sunday ride but you can also get mid month runs with specific Observers if you wish. There's also a very active social scene which you can join in with straight away - you don't need to have taken the IAM test, you just need to be a WVAM member.
BTW, Rapid are very good too, and I've been on several brisk (
) rides with them (though not with Giles.....). Do both IAM and Rapid if you've got the time, you'll learn a lot with each one. Almost forgot that the IAM do their own track skills days too, with some very talented instructors.
Couldn't agree more. One day courses, including Bikesafe, which can be very good, can show you where your road skills may need improving. Actually making the improvement is down to the individual, and that is where IAM/ROSPA (other brands also exist) come in, because you have regular sessions, with the opportunity to practice and improve in between. Some IAM groups offer allocated Observer guidance throughout (which can be helpful or not, depending on how well you get on with the individual Observer) - others give you a different Observer for each successive ride - they all guide you on the fundamentals in the same way, but may have a different perspective, which can be useful.
Every which way, none of the groups will put you forward for the relative test under you are WELL ready - "failures" are bad for their rep!
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Been to Ripley already, had the assessment ride and it wasn't too bad. My trial ride was with an observer and another newbie who kinda held us up (very new to biking and no real boots on a cbr 600. Poor chap was so nervous on the bends, the observer was rather stuck with him!). Its becoming apparent that road riding skills are to be learned. And track days are great fun. I would love to do all and train all week if money and time allowed! Haqve done a bike safe and loved it but you don't get to see progression other than that what you take away and practise. I like tickets, so am leaning towards IAM/Rospa as it might give me more feedback over a period of time. But I also know that Giles would be invaluable. still pondering!
Giles is ya man. He is a Police rider and they really don't come much better.
I was fortunate to have a police rider as a father, so I got the best training possible. I'm still shit though, so you have to have some kind of natural talent, or wind down the pace, be safe and enjoy ya biking.
I've given up trying to be the fastest, I dictate the pace I'm happy with and that way I enjoy rather than scaring myself silly.
I was fortunate to have a police rider as a father, so I got the best training possible. I'm still shit though, so you have to have some kind of natural talent, or wind down the pace, be safe and enjoy ya biking.
I've given up trying to be the fastest, I dictate the pace I'm happy with and that way I enjoy rather than scaring myself silly.
Your not shit your still alive.
Agreed, you could be a riding god and set the back roads on fire, but no matter how indestructible you are or how quick you are,
better to ride at a pace which is recoverable from a meeting with
and not gamble what's round the next bend.....then live to ride and enjoy another day
Anyway what's the feckin rush
Do as much as you can of everything - you can never have too much experience or tuition.
I've was very lucky to have been coached early on by motorcycle traffic officers, have been an Observer with the IAM for 25 years, an ACU instructor, worked alongside Rapid (not Giles, but I hear he is Ok
) and instructed on loads of Skills days, track days and race schools.
In my experience the more you seek out coaching and help the better you will become. If you know how to critique your own riding then you learn stuff everytime you swing your leg over a bike. Everytime I go out I reckon I learn something, maybe I didn't get a line quite right, or missed an opportunity for an overtake. Perhaps bit too quick through that last section and missed my exit point. That bloke who just pulled out in front of me, could I have positioned better etc etc etc.
People think nothing of spending a fortune on a bike, or some farkles when a much smaller investment in further training would reap far bigger rewards
Whatever you do ride safe and enjoy
I've was very lucky to have been coached early on by motorcycle traffic officers, have been an Observer with the IAM for 25 years, an ACU instructor, worked alongside Rapid (not Giles, but I hear he is Ok
) and instructed on loads of Skills days, track days and race schools. In my experience the more you seek out coaching and help the better you will become. If you know how to critique your own riding then you learn stuff everytime you swing your leg over a bike. Everytime I go out I reckon I learn something, maybe I didn't get a line quite right, or missed an opportunity for an overtake. Perhaps bit too quick through that last section and missed my exit point. That bloke who just pulled out in front of me, could I have positioned better etc etc etc.
People think nothing of spending a fortune on a bike, or some farkles when a much smaller investment in further training would reap far bigger rewards
Whatever you do ride safe and enjoy
