Makes sense,a few years ago a customer of mine had 20 old batteries nicked off 10 artics.3 nights later after we had replaced them for him they came back and nicked the new ones which were far more valuable than the old worn ones taken initially.
insurance help need
- Thread starter agent2494
- Start date
Makes sense,a few years ago a customer of mine had 20 old batteries nicked off 10 artics.3 nights later after we had replaced them for him they came back and nicked the new ones which were far more valuable than the old worn ones taken initially.
Some years ago had a Yamaha XT350 stolen, replaced it with another 6 weeks later. Within 2 days of it being parked up at home scrotes back in and took out 2 abus D locks, an abus padlock and chain anchored to wall and ground anchor. Insurance paid out but refused to insure other than third party. This went on to affect all premiums on bikes and my car for a few years. I bought a tlr200 which was also well secured. The scrotes never returned. My guess the feckers had probably been locked up for other crimes.
Horrible feeling, not easily forgotten. Hope you manage to get a decent re-quote . Otherwise that Range Rover calls...
Horrible feeling, not easily forgotten. Hope you manage to get a decent re-quote . Otherwise that Range Rover calls...
GSWizz
Registered user
Still feel there must be more to this
I am still of the opinion that it is highly unusual for the original insurer not to offer to offer cover to their policyholder in this situation. You will often find that many insurers will look to even replace the stolen vehicle themselves when a new vehicle is stolen within the first 12 months of the life of the policy. Trust me I have no time for insurance fraudsters. A vast sum of money leaves these shores every year that has been obtained by insurance scams to fund all sorts of organised crime and even terrorism. My feelings are still that we are not getting all the facts.
I am still of the opinion that it is highly unusual for the original insurer not to offer to offer cover to their policyholder in this situation. You will often find that many insurers will look to even replace the stolen vehicle themselves when a new vehicle is stolen within the first 12 months of the life of the policy. Trust me I have no time for insurance fraudsters. A vast sum of money leaves these shores every year that has been obtained by insurance scams to fund all sorts of organised crime and even terrorism. My feelings are still that we are not getting all the facts.
Bendy toy
Registered user
Get the new bike but DO NOT insure it for commuting. Then get a Yamaha Diversion 900 for the commute. It will cost about £1000 and be of minimal interest to professional thieves and its a great tool for such jobs. Reasonable fairing, simple engineering, shaft drive, reliable for well over 100K miles and not too ugly to live with.
At the prices the BMW insurance is coming at this will still be cheaper. Also the old bike suffers the salt and minor prang risks rather than the lovely new BMW.
At the prices the BMW insurance is coming at this will still be cheaper. Also the old bike suffers the salt and minor prang risks rather than the lovely new BMW.
morty
Registered user
or use the £1000 to,
A)get your gun licence & shoot the c*nts when they pop back to nick your new bike.
B)hire some thugs built like brick shit houses & maim the fuckers.
C)get your missus to insure & have you as a named rider.
A)get your gun licence & shoot the c*nts when they pop back to nick your new bike.
B)hire some thugs built like brick shit houses & maim the fuckers.
C)get your missus to insure & have you as a named rider.
Bendy toy
Registered user
1 and 2 are the most sensible. The insurer will take your money for 3 then claim the policy was fraudulent and refuse to pay out.
agent2494
Registered user
Good news
RAC have now insured me at the cost of £970 after talking with them and explained what had gone on with BMW/Allance, they said no problem we don't see you as a high risk great so paid up in full today.
1, Yes it was to do with the price of the new bike(£15.500) that's one reason why I could not get insured.
2, Yes business also to blame but I that's what the bike is for,and talking to Allance I have been paid out more and faster due to having business insurance!!!! final payout from them £9000. not bad for an 08 plate?
so now looking forward to picking new bike up this weekend.
Cheers all
RAC have now insured me at the cost of £970 after talking with them and explained what had gone on with BMW/Allance, they said no problem we don't see you as a high risk great so paid up in full today.
1, Yes it was to do with the price of the new bike(£15.500) that's one reason why I could not get insured.
2, Yes business also to blame but I that's what the bike is for,and talking to Allance I have been paid out more and faster due to having business insurance!!!! final payout from them £9000. not bad for an 08 plate?
so now looking forward to picking new bike up this weekend.
Cheers all
Jolly good.
Ringing around and around pays dividends in the end. It really is the only answer to the question "Who is best to help me, please".
For what it's worth, Allianz have become very wary of the theft risk just of late. I suspect this can only be because of a very poor loss record on their books over the past three to five years. They got very uppity over my (no claims, touch wood, past 15 or more years) renewal in early September. I had to call at least eight alternative insurers / underwriters over a two to three day period, to obtain alternative offers sufficiently credible enough (ie. I wasn't just bluffing) to threaten to remove the business from them unless they softened their stance a bit.
Theft claims always increase in a recession. Mix this in with the increasing value of new motorcycles (most particularly the ever rising value of spare parts * ) and the comparative ease of stealing a motorcycle and it all makes sense. The penalty if caught (which is rare) is comparatively mild, cars are definitely more difficult to steal these days, so thieves switch to bikes. Why wouldn't they, I would.
* Another feature of a recession, where more owners switch to do-it-yourself servicing and repairs, sourcing parts from wherever they can find them cheapest, rather than pay a registered dealership. The internet and EBay has made the disposal of illicit spare parts very easy and very difficult to trace, with few punters really questioning quite how or why unknown bod XYZ is capable of selling that oil cooler so cheap. Lots of stolen parts used to end up in amateur racing (they still do, anything to reduce the cost of an expensive hobby) more and more are now finding their way into 'innocent' bods' garages or shipped overseas.
Ringing around and around pays dividends in the end. It really is the only answer to the question "Who is best to help me, please".
For what it's worth, Allianz have become very wary of the theft risk just of late. I suspect this can only be because of a very poor loss record on their books over the past three to five years. They got very uppity over my (no claims, touch wood, past 15 or more years) renewal in early September. I had to call at least eight alternative insurers / underwriters over a two to three day period, to obtain alternative offers sufficiently credible enough (ie. I wasn't just bluffing) to threaten to remove the business from them unless they softened their stance a bit.
Theft claims always increase in a recession. Mix this in with the increasing value of new motorcycles (most particularly the ever rising value of spare parts * ) and the comparative ease of stealing a motorcycle and it all makes sense. The penalty if caught (which is rare) is comparatively mild, cars are definitely more difficult to steal these days, so thieves switch to bikes. Why wouldn't they, I would.
* Another feature of a recession, where more owners switch to do-it-yourself servicing and repairs, sourcing parts from wherever they can find them cheapest, rather than pay a registered dealership. The internet and EBay has made the disposal of illicit spare parts very easy and very difficult to trace, with few punters really questioning quite how or why unknown bod XYZ is capable of selling that oil cooler so cheap. Lots of stolen parts used to end up in amateur racing (they still do, anything to reduce the cost of an expensive hobby) more and more are now finding their way into 'innocent' bods' garages or shipped overseas.
GSWizz
Registered user
Are you in the insurance industry? I deal with lots of insurance claims and I am still of the opinion that BMW Insurance/Allianz would struggle in refusing to offer cover to the innocent policyholder who is the victim of theft.
I am but a humble insurance clerk.
OK, so let's see what we do know....
(A) Allianz have already discharged their contractual duty under the OP's former policy, treating him (by his own admission) very fairly. That policy is now dead, the subject matter (one motorcycle) no longer being in the possession of the policy holder and him having indemnified fairly and in full.
(B) Allianz are at liberty not to invite new business or solicit renewal for any individual (or whole classes of business) as and if they see fit. How else did, for instance, NIG withdraw from underwriting the former BMW Motorrad and Honda schemes?
(C) When the OP sought a quote from Allianz for his new motorcycle they (and other insurers, so the OP tells us) now view him as:
He then went on to tell us:
So that is Allianz and fifteen other insurance providers (16 in all) who are all telling the OP the same thing, that he is a high risk. He does however have one quote from Mac (whoever they are) for apparently an annual premium payable in full of three thousand pounds, so somebody was a least prepared to offer terms.
If we follow your chain of logic and assume, just for one moment, that Allianz are somehow under some sort of legal, moral, ethical or consumer lead obligation to insure a motorcycle just because they once insured another bike for a policy holder and paid him a total loss in the same year, or if they do just want to be even slightly helpful to their former customer... All they need to do is, like mac, quote northwards of £3000 right up to or higher than the value of the motorcycle. The third party liability section of the policy is unlimited, so they really can price it how they like. Of course the OP won't accept it. Or they can just refuse to quote and save wasting any more of their and their former customer's time, which is what the OP implies they did.
(D) Having drawn a blank with Allianz (who either refused to offer terms, or simply offered an annual premium too high, it matters not) and 15 other insurance providers and the combined might of UKGSer's 1200 GS section... The OP pressed on calling round and BINGO! One (out of 17 or maybe more companies) came up with a quote a shade under a grand, which the OP bought. Like the Lone Ranger riding over the bluff, the RAC (much maligned on these pages) saved the day.
Why did he buy it? We can only guess:
(i) He has bought and paid for his new motorcycle, which us sitting in someone's showroom. It can't sit there forever and he wants to ride it
(ii) He's run out of time and / or options
(iii) There is possibly a whole lot more to the story yet to be revealed.
OK, so let's see what we do know....
(A) Allianz have already discharged their contractual duty under the OP's former policy, treating him (by his own admission) very fairly. That policy is now dead, the subject matter (one motorcycle) no longer being in the possession of the policy holder and him having indemnified fairly and in full.
(B) Allianz are at liberty not to invite new business or solicit renewal for any individual (or whole classes of business) as and if they see fit. How else did, for instance, NIG withdraw from underwriting the former BMW Motorrad and Honda schemes?
(C) When the OP sought a quote from Allianz for his new motorcycle they (and other insurers, so the OP tells us) now view him as:
He then went on to tell us:
So that is Allianz and fifteen other insurance providers (16 in all) who are all telling the OP the same thing, that he is a high risk. He does however have one quote from Mac (whoever they are) for apparently an annual premium payable in full of three thousand pounds, so somebody was a least prepared to offer terms.
If we follow your chain of logic and assume, just for one moment, that Allianz are somehow under some sort of legal, moral, ethical or consumer lead obligation to insure a motorcycle just because they once insured another bike for a policy holder and paid him a total loss in the same year, or if they do just want to be even slightly helpful to their former customer... All they need to do is, like mac, quote northwards of £3000 right up to or higher than the value of the motorcycle. The third party liability section of the policy is unlimited, so they really can price it how they like. Of course the OP won't accept it. Or they can just refuse to quote and save wasting any more of their and their former customer's time, which is what the OP implies they did.
(D) Having drawn a blank with Allianz (who either refused to offer terms, or simply offered an annual premium too high, it matters not) and 15 other insurance providers and the combined might of UKGSer's 1200 GS section... The OP pressed on calling round and BINGO! One (out of 17 or maybe more companies) came up with a quote a shade under a grand, which the OP bought. Like the Lone Ranger riding over the bluff, the RAC (much maligned on these pages) saved the day.
Why did he buy it? We can only guess:
(i) He has bought and paid for his new motorcycle, which us sitting in someone's showroom. It can't sit there forever and he wants to ride it
(ii) He's run out of time and / or options
(iii) There is possibly a whole lot more to the story yet to be revealed.
WindyChuffer
Registered user
Not sure what your issue is, but I keep 2 bikes in car park in view of public, have had 2 stolen (including GSA), have 6 speeding points and also a claim on my camper van (my fault). Also live in London and both bikes insured for commuting. Whereas you are in sleepy Hereford. I had no problem getting reasonably priced insurance. Went through e-bike in the end.
What is it about your circumstances you are not telling us? Points for Dangerous Driving? Drinking?
What is it about your circumstances you are not telling us? Points for Dangerous Driving? Drinking?
Sounds feasible to me
Insurance companies are not required to sell insurance to anyone, it's up to them who they do business with
It's always been my understanding that your existing insurer is legally obliged to offer you cover. 
Whether they choose to make that prohibitively expensive is, of course, up to them.
Whether they choose to make that prohibitively expensive is, of course, up to them.
That is a very good question.
And for every fellow like you, there is old grey beard living in the outer Hebrides, who does three miles a year (if it's not raining) who has never claimed. His premium has, in the great scheme of things, gone towards paying for your misfortune. In the mix there is me with x bikes and cars, also living in a London, but with a clean loss and driving record, touch wood. I too have probably contributed towards your claims and the OP's to some tiny degree, as has everyone who has ever bought Motor insurance.
The earliest strap line for the basic principle of insurance was that 'The misfortune of the few, should fall lightly upon the many'; it probably still holds fairly true today.
It's always been my understanding that your existing insurer is legally obliged to offer you cover.
Whether they choose to make that prohibitively expensive is, of course, up to them.
That is indeed sort of the case in Eire:
Irish Motor insurance is different to the UK's, not least as they had for many years, jury awards for liability damages. It doesn't take much to imagine that these ran into millions of pounds, far in excess of their true 'worth' and resulting in a huge drain on Ireland's comparatively small pool of drivers and insurers.
There are several specialist insurance brokers in the UK who task themselves with finding insurance for people who have had their proposal for Motor insurance declined, say due to past convictions.
Here's an example:
http://www.saleinsurance.co.uk/refused-insurance-faqs.aspx
=====
What you might be innocently confusing is Uk Motor insurers' obligation to invite renewal (or express declinature) of their insured within good time for the insured person to seek alternatives, if possible. I think the reasonable period is 14 days prior to expiry, or summat like that.
Many insurance policies now auto-renew, the premium being debited from the insured automatically. This provision is made plain to the insured when the policy is first bought and will in any case be proceeded by a written offer, which the insured is at liberty to decline or haggle about if they can be bothered. Silence will be taken as tacit acceptance.
You do wonder
WindyChuffer
Registered user
Makes me smile.
On a more serious note, you are indeed correct. Just like I am paying back an element of my misfortune(s). The risk / pricing models these insurance companies operate are fascinating, as are the folks that drive them (having worked in insurance and know folks that work in this area).
I've donned my dirty mac, fedora and gone into P.I.mode.
Trawling through the OP past posts is THIS small clue.
The devil is in the detail. Business use, lives in herefordshire but perhaps works all over ( secret missions and all that).
Which means he could be parked up anywhere, and perhaps he isn't familier with the areas where he's parked the bike (unlike your good self who knows only too well the dangers of leaving an unattended 1200 parked near paddington station, well know for it's thefts from top boxes and of the instrument cluster of 1200GS models).
Seems the OP had his bike extracted from a dodgy part of south london while on business and parked on the street with all his worldly chattels attached.
So, being as he now has a new shiney bike and an even finer selection of worldly chattels, and next week could well find himself parked near paddington station on business with all his worldlies in his top box and a "hey look at me, i'm brand new instrument cluster" , this would make the OP a very high risk in the insurance companies eyes.
Tis true.
If you could pay a bit more (or suffer misfortune less) I - and millions of other of motorists - would be much obliged.
You have cracked the code but unwittingly possibly exposed one of our brave fighting men, putting him in mortal danger and the country at risk.
Good luck in front of the Select Committee, I'll have the speedboat waiting.
Similar threads
