Intermittent starter problem?

[Stewart H]

dunno if this is of any use, when my Guzzis have starter issues I just short them across the solenoid to starter with a screwdriver,at least you know the starter is ok, Valeo in BMW is the same as Guzzis just different orientation, might ferk the electronics though.

I have used that test on numerous vehicles

 

[Pekkavee]

Will do



Good points Martin - I'll investigate. Didn't think about the actual contactor in the solenoid - I'll strip it and clean it up.



Thanks Rudie - I'll find it and check it out.

Buy a new starter from here. 58 € + delivery.
New starter

Then you know at least the starter is OK.
I still believe the Bendix is slipping.

Pekka

 

[MattW]

Buy a new starter from here. 58 € + delivery.
New starter

Then you know at least the starter is OK.
I still believe the Bendix is slipping.

Pekka

Thanks Pekka but I honestly don't think it's the starter.

There are two 'failure modes' with my starting problem - it's one or the other - these never happen together:

1. When I press the button, there is just a clunk from the solenoid (not the 'click' that you get from a flat battery, a proper heavy clunk) and the sound of the starter gear throwing into engagement but the starter doesn't spin at all. If it were a slipping bendix, surely the starter would spin but it wouldn't turn the engine over?

2. When I press the button, the fuel pump re-primes, the fuel fuel level indicator zero's and there is no activity from the starter solenoid (not even a click). I can't think a bad starter could explain this?

Or it just turns over quickly and healthily and starts normally

I didn't get the chance to try the things that were suggested yesterday - spent the weekend mixing and pouring 2 cubic metres of concrete

 

[MattW]

Good points Martin

Why did I call you Martin? - you're Phil ...
Sorry

 

[(RIP) Kaister]

1. When I press the button, there is just a clunk from the solenoid (not the 'click' that you get from a flat battery, a proper heavy clunk) and the sound of the starter gear throwing into engagement but the starter doesn't spin at all.

solenoid internals

2. When I press the button, the fuel pump re-primes, the fuel fuel level indicator zero's and there is no activity from the starter solenoid (not even a click).

poor voltage at the battery

 

[MattW]

poor voltage at the battery

Makes good sense.
However, the battery voltage at the terminals is good (2 year old EOM gel, lives on a trickle charger) and when the fault doesn't manifest, spins the engine over fine. The battery connections themselves are good, as is the battery to starter lead. So I guess I'll have to look for bad earth's starting with the main earth under the battery box as recommended by Rudie.

thanks Phil(!)

 

[robc]

Matt,
When I had my first starter fault my dash/RID went dead when I pressed the starter button. I was told that it was caused by the started pulling as much power from the battery as possible to get the starter turning.

When I got home I removed my starter and it looked the same as yours did. I cleaned up the whole lot and all was well.

Are you sure there is nothing fouling the operation of the starter?

Regards

Rob C

 

[Uncle Crumpet]

have you got access to a proper battery tester, one that will confirm a bad cell etc..? I've scratched my head over a lot of problems and bought a lot of parts that all could have been fixed with a replacement battery even though it wasnt that old.

 

[MattW]

Are you sure there is nothing fouling the operation of the starter?

As sure as I can be Rob - it's been stripped three times now and everything seems fine. I've measured the voltage across the battery while starting (and not starting due to the intermittent fault).

At rest the battery shows 12.9v, during a normal start, it drops to 10.5 ish but when I get the not-starting fault (either of the two failure 'modes' noted above) the battery voltage doesn't drop at all. This says to me that there's no load across the starter during the faults or I'd see a volt drop due to the stalled motor...

have you got access to a proper battery tester, one that will confirm a bad cell etc..? I've scratched my head over a lot of problems and bought a lot of parts that all could have been fixed with a replacement battery even though it wasnt that old.

I've not got a proper battery tester but my feeling is that the fault lies outside the battery / starter but no harm in checking.

However I'm off on holiday (in the car) for a couple of weeks soon so it'll be when I get back.

cheers
Matt

 

[darrenptalbot]

Bit of a curve ball, but have you checked your sidestand switch? If thats acting up, sounds like it could be behind the empty RID display ....