Intermittently Not Starting in First Gear...4 Months left on Warranty

[freelancer2011]

Hi Guys,

She's my first bike, a 2008 F650 GS Twin. I got her earlier, this year. Approved Used Bike. 2 previous owners with about 8000 miles on the clock.

There's this on-going issue where when I stall the bike, say, at a junction, sometimes, I can't start the bike in first. I have to hitch up the gear to Neutral and then start it. Most the time, there's no attempt/clicks heard when I press the ignition button. Sometimes there's a click or two and it starts.

I rode it into the forecourt at Battersea-Park Lane Motorrad's on Saturday. Managed to replicate the issue. Left the engine running on Neutral ...But then, sod's law, when the tech' eventually came out, I couldn't reproduce the prob. It started EVERY time. When it happens to me during my rides, I've usually run the bike for about 45 minutes. I *think* (but am not sure) can start the bike in first gear, cold, every time.

There's one good guy there and between me and him we're trying to think of options in order to reproduce the issue consistently enough so that "they can hook it up to their test beds in order to find the cause (words to the similar effect)", apparently. I'm extremely frustrated as I feel time is running out to fix this one problem and it seems their framework in order to prove/know what to claim for is a little rigid, maybe, a bit unfair in my mind.

I even shot a video of me out in London when this happened and that doesn't still seem to be enough.

Prior to her 12k service, the same guy mentioned it could be a side-stand switch(?) issue. Another different rep' during the service mentioned it could be a temperature issue. At the moment, with my consent, one of their techs is commuting with her in order to try to replicate the issue for the remainder of this week. -I've had to buy a Travelcard and so I figured they might as well have it for the whole week.

Has anybody got any advice?

 

[Dave Ett]

There's only a couple of things involved here: the gear position / neutral indicator & the clutch switch.

I'd opt for squirting a bit of WD40 into the clutch switch first. If that fails, try taking it apart and cleaning, or simply replacing it.

If that fails, then I'd suspect the connection to the brains of the bike from the clutch switch - you may be able to trace the cable back to a junction and check it's fully fitted.

 

[Packer]

As you have already raised the issue whist under warranty you may find that even though it takes a while, (perhaps the problem will get progressively worse to the point that they will finally identify the issue), it will still be covered by the warranty.

Whilst BMW certainly treat their customers as beta testers they are usually very good with warranty claims. Make sure that you raise the issue with the service manager as an ongoing problem before the warranty expires.

 

[Smythson]

Sounds a bit like what happened to me when the gear indicator (aka potentiometer) failed. Have them look inside the housing on the engine casing for little shreds of plastic which could be getting caught up in the brushes inside the unit itself (an area that is not serviceable or even accessable).

I did a post with pics a little while back. Don't unplug wiring for inspection otherwise it'll reset and you'll have to take it in for the sole purpose of recalibration which costs about £30.

Best,

S

 

[CuzGS]

Is it possible to arrange for a Tech to meet you as you arrive so youre in the problem zone as it were ??

I had a brake drama years ago which only happened when hot, had to arrange for a Tech to meet me outside dealers at appointed time........sorted.

Persevere and dont carry a snag past the warrantee point, or at least get it formally investigated as an ongoing issue so at least there is a moral obligation to fix a fault as it was reported whilst within warrantee.

Good luck with it either way

 

[MBronskill]

I had the clutch switch fail recently on the same year and model. I could hear it click if I listened close by but the electrical contact was not being made. It is an easy replacement (one screw), especially under warranty.

Mike

 

[Bem]

I had the clutch switch fail recently on the same year and model. I could hear it click if I listened close by but the electrical contact was not being made. It is an easy replacement (one screw), especially under warranty.

Mike

Same prob on my 05 1200 - clutch switc is v.likely source, but as you have reported the problem I assume you will be covered by the Warranty. If not then its a relatively cheap fix as a DIY.

 

[kingsol007]

I have just encountered the same problem after changing the clutch lever to a vario lever. Bike will only start in neutral. Very inconvenient.

Is the clutch switch at the lever of clutch.

Do you think adjusting the bite point on the clutch would help?

Cheers

Kings

 

[Bendy toy]

Interesting thread.

My 08 GSA has been strange starting since the very heavy rain last week. It just looks at me and does nothing unless gears in neutral. I'll check out the clutch switch.

 

[nig5]

Used to have an 800s and if I stalled in gear would not start until I put it in neutral where as on my 800gs I just pull the clutch in and it starts!

 

[freelancer2011]

Hey guys,

Thanks for all your replies. It's comforting to know I'm not the only one experiencing this (but I feel like I'm a problem to them).

I'm terribly gutted. I've not really had a pleasant time with BMW/representatives (SOS Auto-Recovery Services, for example). I don't want to get into too much details but the person who caused me that grievance has been fired and the MD gave a written apology. I've had a simple rear splash guard replacement take several months to arrive and fix after the incorrect part was ordered and fitted. The below is exacerbating my bad experience, this year. I'm only in my 8th month of ownership It's not even brand new.

Here's the progress so far (have obviously cut out the email addresses and full names):-

---
Hi Lab

Person Y and I think that if it is convenient for you we should have another try this Saturday. We don’t have a great deal booked in but if need be then we can try and get you to replicate the fault for us.
I understand your frustration, however from a warranty stand point, we need to experience the fault in some way otherwise we would simply be replacing parts without proof of fault and would therefore have to pay for them ourselves.
We have already spent a lot of time attempting to replicate the fault and we are unable to do any more, free of charge. However we will extend this courtesy for the weekend. If we are unable to detect the fault on Saturday, then we will have to wait until the fault is occurring more frequently.
Let me know if this is convenient for you.

Kind regards

BMW

---
From: LAB
Sent: 05 December 2012 11:32
To: BMW
Subject: Re: Got Proof of Engine Not Starting in First

Apologies, the first question should have read:

'Tell me what I can do (or HAVE to do) in order for this to get remedied under warranty with no costs to me?'

---
From: LAB
To: BMW
Sent: Wednesday, 5 December 2012, 11:30
Subject: Re: Got Proof of Engine Not Starting in First

Hi BMW,

I didn't mean to come across like that towards your Tech'. I was just highlighting the uncanny coincidence (and fustration) of this being an intermittent issue. As a customer, I do feel extremely let down (and not by you or your Techs) but by this seemingly frustrating process to prove I've got a fault. Also as a customer who has this warranty cover, I feel like I shouldn't be incurred charges to have an issue resolved. E.g. the manual says the bike can start in first gear. It should be so, new or 'Approved Used'. If BMW/Services Manager can show me that an Approved Used Bike may have quirks like this, then I will have to accept that, though I don't morally agree.

I DO appreciate you guys looking into this for me when Williams Motorrad should be bearing this post-purchase responsibility and perhaps, should have looked into this before classing it as 'Approved Used'. I DO and always will appreciate your co-operation in helping me out. In fairness, between yourself and Person Y, you have been the most effective and fairest guys I've worked with at Battersea.


Tell me what I can do (or HAVE to do) in order for this to get remedied under warranty with no choices?
E.g. I can ride about on it in London on future Saturdays right up to 7th April 2013 (when the warranty cover expires) and bring it right to the forecourt in time to meet with a Tech and hopefully replicate the fault. Also, was my understanding correct: do you have to literally and immediately hook it up to your diagnostics kit/test bed to determine exact cause?

Thanks,
Lab.

---
From: BMW
To: LAB
Sent: Wednesday, 5 December 2012, 11:12
Subject: RE: Got Proof of Engine Not Starting in First

Hi Lab

Thank you for the forum link, it does seem a little negative towards my tech and appears it might reflect badly on us, maybe it’s just the way I read it?

We have been unable to replicate the fault with the technician taking it home for 2 nights. We have tried to physically force the failure and we have checked the component actuation for the items pertaining to the fault.
Any other investigation would incur costs unfortunately.

Let me know your thoughts.

Kind regards

BMW

 

[Tim Cullis]

Side stand switch or fuel pump would be where I concentrate my time, see
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162512
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229399