Is there something different about this bike that makes it less visible???

Two little things that help me pay attention are
1. the knowledge that if i do feck it up - research has shown (i hate that phrase! - but it's true here)
it's 3 seconds maximum from thinking "oh shit" to impact.
2. Giles notes the 'Frightened rabbit' freeze effect - i think twice about using the horn as this can cause the driver to freeze right in the worst possible place - directly in your path, limiting escape routes. :blast

Giles,
i hoped you post - great, clear and useful. :thumb2
 
Great post Giles.

Another issue is it's very difficult for a driver/pedestrian to judge the speed of a single oncoming headlight. We partly judge speed by how fast the size of something increases over time. It can be hard to do this with a bright oncoming light that has no distinct shape.

IMO this a good reason to fit a pair of driving lights either side of the bike. They don't need to be bright, just visible. As the bike approaches the driver/pedestrian so the lights diverge and the driver/pedestrian is able to get a sense of the bike's approaching speed.

There's a sound reason for bling after all :)

Andres
 
Tony's genius government outlawed twin headlights on bikes (prompting the cyclops look) as they claimed that twin lights, close together, might look like a car far away.

There is well documented evidence that there are few natural symmetrical triangles in nature. The theory goes that a triangular set-up of central dip beam and two running lights should stand out / trigger a response in the viewer's cerebral cortex sufficient to snap a synapse or two. That Tossers translate this simple hypothesis into installing and firing up three nuclear powered suns, rendering the viewer blinded, bleaching out the bike, the rider and all around is a pity. Rather like the 'must have' 900db horn, it's done nothing to help them one jot.
 
Excellent post Giles, thanks,

G
+1 totally concur with A post effect. Had a guy I know locally do it to me. We chatted about it after wards as I shook out my trousers and it is amazing how much an A post, even in a Ford Focus, can hide you.
 
Wapping makes some good points too. Why some bikers insist on riding with main beam on is beyond me too.

Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk
 
An interesting discussion.

I know this is a little bit of a tangent to the thread but I have always thought that the sound of the bike plays a part in road presence.

Quieter bikes just don't get noticed as much. But an after market exhaust, baffles out does draw attention. Sometimes a bike can be heard before it is seen acting as a reminder to 'think bike'.

Obviously this could and sometimes is taken to far by angry 16 year olds on mega wasp 50s but the point is still valid dispute this.

So if your having problems it's a good argument for an Akrapovic. :thumb
 
i have two sets of spots and ALWAYS ride with them on, even on a bright summer day.
People even give way when i'm behind them. never have this when the spots are off.

Spots ON.....people see you

Spots Off ..... no-one cares
 
Wapping makes some good points too. Why some bikers insist on riding with main beam on is beyond me too.

Simple. In South Africa, at least, there is simply no other way to make yourself visible enough from the front.
This is why using every light my bike has during daylight hours is policy for me. And that will not change until legislation specifically prohibiting it is introduced.

Anti-social, you might say. Debatable, say I.
But with an institutionalized culture of the three 'I's (ignorance, incompetence and indifference) so prevalent among the drivers of the rusty third-world wrecks I encounter, my reasoning is that while the oncoming driver drifting over the solid line into my road space may suffer a few seconds' discomfort, that's an acceptable trade-off against the possibility of my death or mutilation.
 
An interesting discussion.

I know this is a little bit of a tangent to the thread but I have always thought that the sound of the bike plays a part in road presence.

Quieter bikes just don't get noticed as much. But an after market exhaust, baffles out does draw attention. Sometimes a bike can be heard before it is seen acting as a reminder to 'think bike'.

Obviously this could and sometimes is taken to far by angry 16 year olds on mega wasp 50s but the point is still valid dispute this.

So if your having problems it's a good argument for an Akrapovic. :thumb

When I first got my Fireblade some 6 years ago it came with the stock compliant exhaust and in the first week I had three cars pull out on me whilst I was overtaking them. I then fitted an Akropovic exhaust and lost the baffle and it has never happened again. Personally I think this is beyond coincidence so agree with you. And no it is not anti socially loud before I get jumped on and anyway I don't care. It sounds great and keeps me safe(r)!
 
If Giles is who I think he is, then I know he knows what he's talking about.
 
Personally ..... I don't agree with the lights and loud exhaust argument.

The lights ... they're just feckin' annoying! And ... they are!! Why do people move over when you come up behind them with yer unobtainium fuelled nitrous bulbed flood lights??? Cos there in their car saying 'Feck me, I've got some bloody idiot in my mirrors that's being incredibly annoying, I'll pull over and let the twat past and hope he buggers off .... ' :rob :D

And the noisy can argument?? (my Remus still has the baffle in and is bloody noisy!) Pedestrians and all that, yep - I get that - they'll hear you coming, but think about your bog standard bike v car crash. Yer trying to tell me that it wouldn't have happened if he had a noisy pipe? Remember the video somebody posted on the training threads;
<iframe width="640" height="390" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/xjCqGm3Gd_E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Noisy pipes won't stop this sort of (classic car pulling out) thing, windows up, radio on? talking to passenger in car? The majority of the bikes sound actually being behind the bike and not infront of it .. ?


Nah .... fly under the radar, and use yer head to avoid accidents not stupid bloody lights and baffles out ... :rob
 
If Giles is who I think he is, then I know he knows what he's talking about.



Clouseau: How could a blind man be a lookout?
Dreyfus: How can an idiot be a policeman? Answer me that!
Clouseau: Well, it's very simple...all you do is enlist and.....
Dreyfus: Shut up!




Clouseau (on the telephone): And who am I speaking to?
Drefyus: This is the person that wants you killed more than anything in the world!
Clouseau: Are you the head waiter at the leetle Beestro on the Roudy Bouzzare?


:beerjug:
 
It really is a highly debatable argument (or series thereof). There are no absolutes - just different people with different methods they've evolved over time... and different opinions.

The lights ... they're just feckin' annoying! And ... they are!! Why do people move over when you come up behind them with yer unobtainium fuelled nitrous bulbed flood lights??? Cos there in their car saying 'Feck me, I've got some bloody idiot in my mirrors that's being incredibly annoying, I'll pull over and let the twat past and hope he buggers off .... ' :rob :D

In this context, I would say that that's rather the point.
Again, I can't speak for the rest of the world, but in SA we have legislation which dictates that people in the right-hand lane of a regional or national freeway pull over to the lane immediately to the left when approached from the rear by a faster-moving vehicle.

A couple of problems are immediately apparent. Corruption is so blatant in our system that according to some governmental stats, up to 40% of drivers in SA are not actually 'drivers' by strict letter of law - they have purchased their licences from officials with the means to bang them out and sell them for a couple of hundred Rand each. Then there are those who simply take to the roads without. These people are ignorant of the law because the system hasn't been able to make them reasonably aware of it.

And we have no system of compulsory vehicle insurance here. Prior to our so-called democracy, we had a system of compulsory third-party insurance, but that was quietly scrapped in order to facilitate the poorest of the poor getting mobile.
According to other stats, we are currently the most illiterate nation in Africa - despite spending up to 6% of our substantial GDP on 'education'. So you can forget about the average rural shack-dweller in his 40-year-old Datsun being able to read the road signs - or even knowing what they signify. Read? Hell, he never even took a learners' licence test!

So what we have is a road-transport system in which a hell of a lot of drivers take to the roads with nothing to lose. The fact that their ignorance might cost lives, and destroy vehicles costing more than many of them will earn in ten years' wages, is totally alien. So is the concept of 'Defensive driving'. Spatial co-ordination and situational awareness are far beyond them.

The only way to communicate effectively with such people as a fellow road user is on a primal, visceral level.
Very bright headlights in your rearviews are an unsettling sight. (And hopefully, the blue tinge from high-Kelvin LED or HID light might get you momentarily mistaken for a cop - which will assure even quicker co-operation. :thumb)
The sound of a race pipe can be heard from some distance away. Again, this works on 'caveman' level - the average uneduque who hears such a sound is more likely to look for it, see the lights, and NOT blunder into the gap between two lines of stationary traffic.

And the noisy can argument?? (my Remus still has the baffle in and is bloody noisy!) Pedestrians and all that, yep - I get that - they'll hear you coming, but think about your bog standard bike v car crash. Yer trying to tell me that it wouldn't have happened if he had a noisy pipe? Remember the video somebody posted on the training threads

The logic here is a bit convoluted.
You can't provide proof against every single danger on the roads. There are simply too many variables in the total equation. Road safety is not a straight Win/lose situation. It's a game of odds.
Bright lights, loud pipes and loud horns are not magic talismans which insure against every instance of un-situationally-aware drivers and pedestrians. But they do have audible and visual effect which can raise the odds in the rider's favour by reaching and influencing more of the fellow human beings we encounter.

My own experience over the last fifteen years has proven this to me more times than I can mention.
All else being equal, every time I'm on a bike with an EU exhaust, pedestrians step into the gaps between traffic in front of me. (I usually spot them, because I've been accustomed to watching for them for a very long time.)
Every time I'm on a bike with a race pipe, the number of pedestrians stepping out without looking plummets.

Noisy pipes won't stop this sort of (classic car pulling out) thing, windows up, radio on? talking to passenger in car? The majority of the bikes sound actually being behind the bike and not infront of it .. ?

I mentioned in another post that there is also a large element of luck involved.
Sometimes, no matter how conscientious you are, the universe will still screw with you for it's own amusement. You could be wearing day-glo pink Cordura and a reflective white helmet, sporting an exhaust that plays 'Making Love Out Of Nothing At All' at 110 dB, and some people STILL wouldn't know you're there.
Then, there are those on ground-hugging sports bikes in matt black, with black leathers and helmet, standard pipe, and because the bike is an American grey import, they've forgotten to switch on the headlights. Filtering between gaps, they can (and mostly do) stay in one piece.

In a way, it's like tornadoes. They touch down here - but not there. They can wipe out three houses in a row, then suddenly veer away and miss the fourth house.
The guy whose house has been wiped out says: "...No, no, NO!!! Why me?!"
The guy whose house has been spared says "Thank God".

Nah .... fly under the radar, and use yer head to avoid accidents...

One out of two ain't bad. ;)
Peace, my man.
 
You could be wearing day-glo pink Cordura and a reflective white helmet, sporting an exhaust that plays 'Making Love Out Of Nothing At All' at 110 dB, and some people STILL wouldn't know you're there.

SO TRUE. My daughter in law is a Paramedic and drives all their gear except the bikes. She never ceases to be amazed at the constant stupidity and blind ignorance of fellow road users. Other morning outside Cheltenham, Police Bike, BMW car and the Ambulance held up by a 'person' in a 14 plate Black BMW estate, outside lane, 75mph on the phone, as the person in the "box" was dying they all (very unusually) went up the inside in the end... Her common denominator as is mine "They haven't seen me!"
 
Other morning outside Cheltenham, Police Bike, BMW car and the Ambulance held up by a 'person' in a 14 plate Black BMW estate, outside lane, 75mph on the phone, as the person in the "box" was dying they all (very unusually) went up the inside in the end... Her common denominator as is mine "They haven't seen me!"

Goes to prove my point. And also leads me to my usual retort:

Driver: "...But I didn't see you!"
Me: "No, you didn't. And why is that?"
Driver: "........."
Me: "Let me help you. You didn't see me because you weren't LOOKING."
 
Is there a way to DEFAULT to LOW BEAM and DRL meaning both automatically come on once bike is started?
 
Is there a way to DEFAULT to LOW BEAM and DRL meaning both automatically come on once bike is started?

I'm not sure at the moment if this is the way all bikes are configured, or if a running software change might have come into play, but from playing with the settings on my bike, I can tell you this:

DRL activation at 'Manual':
Ignition 'On': DRL illuminates at full brightness. Dipped beam inactive.
Engine started: DRL illuminates at half-brightness. Dipped beam active.
Pressing the DRL button, it is possible to switch between the above settings at any time.

DRL activation at 'Auto':
Ignition 'On': DRL illuminates at full brightness. Dipped beam inactive.
Engine started (daytime): DRL illuminates at full brightness. Dipped beam inactive.
Engine started (night time): DRL illuminates at half-brightness. Dipped beam active.
In 'Auto', it is not possible to switch between the above settings by pressing the DRL button. Which operating mode the bike chooses is dependent on what light level is being detected by the ambient light sensor on the dash.

We probably stand no chance of getting BMW to change the presets so that the DRL illuminates at full brightness with the dipped beam active at the same time. They would consider it a safety issue for oncoming traffic (at night, the DRL at full brightness is like staring into a welding arc).
 
I'm not sure DRL is the issue, I covered over 300 miles today with the system set to auto, and not a problem... main difference I think was this journey I wasn't running into and out of shade, plus I was anticipating the "problem" so approached cars at junctions differently... I'm wondering if I hit a patches or shade on the first trip dark and short enough to make the low beam flash on and back off... the impression I got was that these drivers/riders thought I was allowing them out...
 


Back
Top Bottom