LED tail and indicators

[techno]

Not got a 1200, but people have asked on my 1150 LED thread here if I was going to do the same for the 1200.

I have got an indicator and tail light cluster now and will probably start to make them soon.

The indicator insert will have amber LEDs for the turning and red(rear) or white(front) LEDs down the sides or on the tips as running/marker/rear fog lights.

The new indicator insert will be a little problematic to make because of the way the reflector locks the indicator housing on the stalk.
There are three options for this as I see it;

1. Get you the end user to cut it off your reflector locking bit when fitting my inserts and reuse it. Rendering your reflectors useless.
2. I make a plastic locking tab and provide it with the board.
3. I buy a load of indicator reflectors and cut the tab off for you and provide it.

2 incurs a higher start up cost and 3 is costly and wasteful! Any other ideas?


The tail light isn't a problem as it will be basically the same as my 11xx one with maybe some enhancements. BUT - on the new 1200 the rear light is effectively 2 rows of LEDs of the same brightness. Top for tail and bottom for brake. Is this the prefered design or is a full panel of dim/bright better (IMO it is)?

So some questions before I start.


* Would you buy them?!
* For the tail light, what is the prefered pattern of light? Two rows or dim/bright.
* For the tail light, what colour PCB? Red or White?
* For the tail light, do all 1200's have clear lenses?

* For the indicators, amber LEDs a given, but would red/white markers be popular?
* For the indicators, as above but using the markers as rear brake too? Can be fogs too.


Any other suggestions/comments?

 

[Peter Reilly]

I would like to have amber LED indicator inserts for my 1200. Less keen on red/white running lights. I had Nippy Norman LED indicators on my 1150 but did not like the colour, very pale.

When I ordered my 1200 in early 2007, LED indicators were an official option. I duly ordered them, but the bike came with ordinary indicators and then the option.....vanished.

BTW have you noticed that some new Aprilias have very smart and bright LED indicators?

 

[colinw]

HI,

I would say for the rear light
1 white pcb
2 full coverage dim / bright
3 reliable as the nn ones are crap and keep losing rows of light intermitantly

As for the indicators, NN does them with a brake lighter repeater
BUT I would check this out because the law states that they can only show yellow light!!

 

[JohnP]

Led Tail Light and Indicators

In answer to your questions:

* Would you buy them?! - Yes!

* For the tail light, what is the prefered pattern of light? Two rows or dim/bright. - Dim/Bright! or Bright / Very Bright!

* For the tail light, what colour PCB? Red or White? - White!

* For the tail light, do all 1200's have clear lenses? - Mine has red, they still work OK with red lenses, but that's not a problem I can get a clear lens. I bought clear indicator lenses from this site recently.

* For the indicators, amber LEDs a given, but would red/white markers be popular? - Probably, but might be better to keep it simple.

* For the indicators, as above but using the markers as rear brake too? Can be fogs too. - Keep it simple!


I make a plastic locking tab and provide it with the board. - I think this is the best solution. I'm sure your products will be popular so you should be able to absorb the cost in your overall sales. I, personally don't mind paying a little extra for a quality product.

Hope this helps.

 

['Nuffsaid]

And another idea .........

Techno,

Your idea is a good one, however as all new (From '08) GS/GSA's come with LED's as standard, and His Nips does the conversion (And as you mentioned the indicator / Break light splitter) - is there really much of a market left for this? I don't want to dampen your innovative spirit

As an alternative - there are no products that I can see for rear , powerful LED fog lights - The GS rear lights simply do not cut it even in mild fog and I for one as a high mileage commuter feel really vulnerable at the first sign of mist...

Could you knock up a clip / bolt on fog light accessory to the bottom, side of the number plate (or elsewhere) that I/we could buy of you. I am guessing LED's do not need a relay and would need a straight switch to the Bars?

Just a thought!

 

[shugie]

Techno,

Your idea is a good one, however as all new (From '08) GS/GSA's come with LED's as standard, and His Nips does the conversion (And as you mentioned the indicator / Break light splitter) - is there really much of a market left for this? I don't want to dampen your innovative spirit

As an alternative - there are no products that I can see for rear , powerful LED fog lights - The GS rear lights simply do not cut it even in mild fog and I for one as a high mileage commuter feel really vulnerable at the first sign of mist...

Could you knock up a clip / bolt on fog light accessory to the bottom, side of the number plate (or elsewhere) that I/we could buy of you. I am guessing LED's do not need a relay and would need a straight switch to the Bars?

Just a thought!

Quite a lot of pre 08 bikes about, the BMW LED stuff is well pricey, the NN one could do with some improvement.

But agree on the foglamp idea, just the job in heavy spray. Or fog.

 

[techno]

08 bikes..

Thanks for the feedback so far...

The new 1200's come with LED tail and indicators and they do look cool. My mate just picked his up from Ocean this morning and the slinky 2 LED indicators look really nice.

Now that BMW have caught up, there is no need to make any LED stuff for 08> bikes, but as said here there are a lot of <08 bikes that might want a better/cheaper solution to NN/A.N.Other.

For now I will wait and see if any more feedback comes this way about the 1200 before embarking on a time consuming task...but I have the rear assembly from a pre 08 bike and with the co-operation from another member I should come up with the tail light pretty quickly.

The indicators are complex and they may not happen, especially as £19.99+ buys some aftermarket ones that do the job just as well and might look better. The main reason for doing the indicators as I have done for the 1150's is to have the RED strip to act as 'extra' tail and stop light and under poor viz, use it/them as a fog light. As they sit behind a clear lens, there should be no problems as they are the biking equivalent to 3rd brake light. Maybe behind an orange lens there might be some issue.

As for the separate Fog light, it is the plastic housing and mounting that is the problem. Using the indicator as an existing mount box makes them cheaper and easier to make. There is/was an LED cluster at Maplins that would probably do the job, and no a relay would not be required.

A few 1150 riders (including me) have used my indicator inserts for fog lights and they produce excellent results in mist/fog - the same as a car, the main brake light functions as normal.

My LED brake light on my 1150 GSA is far superior in brightness to the new 1200 LED version as I tested it the other night.

Anyway, I am at Touratech on Sat on my 1150 GSA so if you are there find me and see my current product and compare the brightness to the new 1200

 

[AndyW]

...Now that BMW have caught up, there is no need to make any LED stuff for 08> bikes, but as said here there are a lot of <08 bikes that might want a better/cheaper solution to NN/A.N.Other.

....more than 100,000!! BMW R 1200 GS - The most successful BMW of all time

As you know Rob I already have an LED tail/brake light unit but the indicator units sound interesting, will keep an eye on this thread

(your post reminds me - will email you re the photos we were talking about now that you're back from your hols)

 

[Davy F]

the BMW LED stuff is well pricey.

I was quoted a price of £90 for the LED indicators from BMW which I think is ok. My concern is will they retro-fit earlier than '08 bikes without a bulb fail indicator coming on...

 

[techno]

A bit tricky..

Just a heads up really,
I have got hold of a rear light unit and lens for some research and it looks like the replacement tail light board will be a bit complicated to make.

The shape or circuit is no problem it is just that the reflector sticks out further than the lens mountings so a bracket needs to be made and fixed to the board (or I replicate the NN style with the white cone on the bulb connector and screw it to that which is crap IMO. If you have one you know what I mean.)

If anyone knows anyone who makes stainless brackets that is prepared to make a small run then it might be possible....let me know.

Seems like the 1200 is just so much more complicated...

 

[Humbug]

Would definately be interested in a replacement led unit. I have a red lens though and would prefer to keep this as I don't like the clear ones.

 

[mr badger]

Techno,


As an alternative - there are no products that I can see for rear , powerful LED fog lights - The GS rear lights simply do not cut it even in mild fog and I for one as a high mileage commuter feel really vulnerable at the first sign of mist...

Yes please

 

[Mr K]

Just a heads up really,
the board (or I replicate the NN style with the white cone on the bulb connector and screw it to that which is crap IMO. If you have one you know what I mean.)

QUOTE]

Got a Nippy Norman one and it's been fine for tens of thousands of miles thanks.

Good luck with your venture, but don't slag competitors - It's not pretty.

 

[techno]

Just a heads up really,
the board (or I replicate the NN style with the white cone on the bulb connector and screw it to that which is crap IMO. If you have one you know what I mean.)

QUOTE]

Got a Nippy Norman one and it's been fine for tens of thousands of miles thanks.

Good luck with your venture, but don't slag competitors - It's not pretty.

I said 'In My Opinion', and I can express that if I like.

I am glad you are happy with yours and that is what choice is about. (though I doubt that method of fixing would last tens of thousands of 'off road' miles).

I am not competing with NN - but it seems he is competing with my 11XX one as he strangely dropped his prices to match mine after I showed him mine at Princetown. Now that's not pretty.

Maybe if I make one for the 1200 he will drop his ridiculously high price for the 1200 one (currently £65 and £69) like he did for the 11XX.

Let's leave it at that and see what happens

 

[Mr K]

I said 'In My Opinion', and I can express that if I like.

I am glad you are happy with yours and that is what choice is about. (though I doubt that method of fixing would last tens of thousands of 'off road' miles).

I am not competing with NN - but it seems he is competing with my 11XX one as he strangely dropped his prices to match mine after I showed him mine at Princetown. Now that's not pretty.

Maybe if I make one for the 1200 he will drop his ridiculously high price for the 1200 one (currently £65 and £69) like he did for the 11XX.

Let's leave it at that and see what happens

Done 43,000 all over Europe, but all on what were described as roads..

 

[davedyer]

I was quoted a price of £90 for the LED indicators from BMW which I think is ok. My concern is will they retro-fit earlier than '08 bikes without a bulb fail indicator coming on...

They may be pricey but I think they're the best option. After VAT and 4 extra leads for splicing into the loom, they came to about £120 (£30 per indicator - not bad for genuine BMW bits. NN are £60 a pair and so work out the same.) They are literally plug 'n' play with no bulb failure warning at the dash.

They are very stylish, match the bike (they're standard on the HP2 Sport) and fiendishly bright. The LEDs themselves produce the orange light and so in the off state they are completely clear. As you can see from the numberplate (yes I know, missing a numberplate bolt!) mines an 07 bike.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/davedyer/2924942720/" title="08/10/2008 bmw led by Dave Dyer, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3255/2924942720_4045a27371_b.jpg" width="1024" height="768" alt="08/10/2008 bmw led" /></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/davedyer/2924942220/" title="08/10/2008 bmw led by Dave Dyer, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3104/2924942220_97cf6acfbf_b.jpg" width="1024" height="768" alt="08/10/2008 bmw led" /></a>

 

[techno]

They are very stylish, match the bike

Agree, they are very cool, a mate has them on his 1200 and I think they just look so right.

 

[Peter Reilly]

Just want to say thank you to davedyer. I had ordered a set of LED indicators from Vines and was advised that the bike needed to be reprogrammed by a dealer. I read dave's post and decided to fit them myself rather than pay the dealer to do it. As he says, they are plug and play and worked immediately. As a test, I disconnected one LED indicator and turned the ignition on. The dash immediately showed bulb failure. I then reconnected the LED and the bulb failure warning went out. They are obviously designed to mimic the standard indicators.

The job is fairly straightforward but you need a small hot air gun to shrink the adhesive-lined tubing over the splice. I used Duraseal waterproof splices rather than the rather crude connectors and separate tubing supplied with the kit. There is also quite a lot of extra cable to tidy up.

 

[Davy F]

They are literally plug 'n' play with no bulb failure warning at the dash.

Well that's a bit different to what I've been told.
Or am I just being cynical that the dealer wanted to fit me up for a un-neccessary bit of workshop time ?

I take it the other leads are a seperate part number ?

 

[davedyer]

Well that's a bit different to what I've been told.
Or am I just being cynical that the dealer wanted to fit me up for a un-neccessary bit of workshop time ?

I take it the other leads are a seperate part number ?

Definitely no need for a dealer visit after the indicators are fitted - although you'll have to if you fit the BMW LED tail light. Perhaps that's what the dealer was on about if you have the lot done together.

Part numbers:
Adapter leads (4): C71.60.7.711.284
Front LED indicator (2): C63.13.7.708.048
Rear LED indicator: C63.23.7.710.575
Rear LED indicator: C63.23.7.710.576

Total came to £122.21 inc VAT. (as of May 2008)