-Ali-
Guest
it's time to start planning a gap year and me and a friend want to do a motorcycle ride, but we need maps for the above places. Our budget is pretty tight so we can't really afford gps
Cole
Registered user
US Dept of Defence
ONCs = Operational Navigational Charts
TPCs = Tactical Pilotage Charts (4 TPCs = 1 ONC)
Highly detailed maps of the whole world are available cheap from the US DoD ... I used them back in 1994 when there was little else covering Russia, China, Mongolia et al. The Mondo Enduro guys used ONCs as well when they went round the world in 1995 / 1996. Do a google search to find the current best place to source them ... you might get them at Stanfords but they probably want 5 times the proper price for them. And you need a lot, cause they are very detailed .. I used about 50 of these huge things.
Both are around 3'x4' in size and cost between US$5 for ONCs to US$7 for TPCs. (£3-£4)
The ONCs are 1:1,000,000 scale (1 cm = 10klms)
The TPCs are 1:500,000 scale (1cm = 5klms) and show loads of detail.
Note tho that they are NOT designed specifically as road maps. They are topographical maps that have roads (and goat tracks) on them as one of the many features on them.
Just googled a site for you here that has will supply all of them at pretty much proper prices.
http://catalog.maplink.com/charts/dmatpc4.html
One final tip ... when travelling through most parts of the world, the wise man would cut the "US Department of Defence" text and logo off the bottom of each map ... lest you look like a spy when you go thru various customs / borders.
ONCs = Operational Navigational Charts
TPCs = Tactical Pilotage Charts (4 TPCs = 1 ONC)
Highly detailed maps of the whole world are available cheap from the US DoD ... I used them back in 1994 when there was little else covering Russia, China, Mongolia et al. The Mondo Enduro guys used ONCs as well when they went round the world in 1995 / 1996. Do a google search to find the current best place to source them ... you might get them at Stanfords but they probably want 5 times the proper price for them. And you need a lot, cause they are very detailed .. I used about 50 of these huge things.
Both are around 3'x4' in size and cost between US$5 for ONCs to US$7 for TPCs. (£3-£4)
The ONCs are 1:1,000,000 scale (1 cm = 10klms)
The TPCs are 1:500,000 scale (1cm = 5klms) and show loads of detail.
Note tho that they are NOT designed specifically as road maps. They are topographical maps that have roads (and goat tracks) on them as one of the many features on them.
Just googled a site for you here that has will supply all of them at pretty much proper prices.
http://catalog.maplink.com/charts/dmatpc4.html
One final tip ... when travelling through most parts of the world, the wise man would cut the "US Department of Defence" text and logo off the bottom of each map ... lest you look like a spy when you go thru various customs / borders.
Hi, Ali,
I'm planning something similar, so it may be interesting to meet up and chat...
On the map and general info front, the site that you need is www.horizonsunlimited.com
You'll find that China is the difficult bit, especially if you're on a budget as you have to hire a guide at $100 a day to be allowed in. The occasional person does get through, but if you try to get in and fail, you'll have to either reroute or wait 2 months for a guide.
Drop me a PM if you're up for a chat.
Charles
I'm planning something similar, so it may be interesting to meet up and chat...
On the map and general info front, the site that you need is www.horizonsunlimited.com
You'll find that China is the difficult bit, especially if you're on a budget as you have to hire a guide at $100 a day to be allowed in. The occasional person does get through, but if you try to get in and fail, you'll have to either reroute or wait 2 months for a guide.
Drop me a PM if you're up for a chat.
Charles
Interesting sounding maps there Colebatch, but when you select an area why does it say "Disc 5" etc which make it sound like they are on CDs not paper maps. 
I must be missing something, but these maps must be very "cluttered" if they are 10 times larger scale than the British OS Landranger series (1:50,000) and still show detail like "goat tracks" etc.
Dotcaf. Sorry but Ali won't be able to PM you (or vice versa) as neither of you are Site Sponsors yet.
I must be missing something, but these maps must be very "cluttered" if they are 10 times larger scale than the British OS Landranger series (1:50,000) and still show detail like "goat tracks" etc.
Dotcaf. Sorry but Ali won't be able to PM you (or vice versa) as neither of you are Site Sponsors yet.
Well, I can help with Russia. I've got the following I'm happy to send to you. Aborted my trip last year, won't get round to it for another couple of years so...
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/E002b/Pe...tails/mapdetails?item_code=136139&loc_id=1791
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/E002b/BW...etails/mapdetails?item_code=96125&loc_id=1791
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/E002b/9w...ails/bookdetails?item_code=139012&loc_id=1791
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/bookdetails/bookdetails?item_code=124038
Should help with the first bit. I've also got a Russian phrasebook and CD if you're interested?
Not sure what I'm doing this weekend but I could pop them over to give me a ride out one weekend.
Edit: You have to become a site sponsor first though despite your tight budget!
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/E002b/Pe...tails/mapdetails?item_code=136139&loc_id=1791
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/E002b/BW...etails/mapdetails?item_code=96125&loc_id=1791
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/E002b/9w...ails/bookdetails?item_code=139012&loc_id=1791
http://www.stanfords.co.uk/bookdetails/bookdetails?item_code=124038
Should help with the first bit. I've also got a Russian phrasebook and CD if you're interested?
Not sure what I'm doing this weekend but I could pop them over to give me a ride out one weekend.
Edit: You have to become a site sponsor first though despite your tight budget!
Last edited:
Cole
Registered user
Taff said:Interesting sounding maps there Colebatch, but when you select an area why does it say "Disc 5" etc which make it sound like they are on CDs not paper maps.
Taff: They are paper maps ... not sure where you are seeing "disc 5" ... I cant replicate that.
If you want to get the TPCs in the UK (and to be honest ONCs are probably fine for most of what you need), the TPCs are available at The Map Shop, Upton on Severn, tel: 0800 085 40 80 for £6 each ... ONCs are there as well and probably cheaper. They deliver.
I would also note that places like China and Russia have perfectly good, inexpensive road atlases available these days. They will probably be easier to use, and will no doubt be a lot less expensive.
As one of the guys above said, China is the hard nut to crack. I rode across China in 1994 and was the first guy to do it legally and without an "escort" ... the reality is it hasnt changed much since ... almost all of the rare China motorcycle travel stories you will find actually have a "guide"/"escort" with them, that they simply don't comment on nor photograph. When I got in, it was luck.
If you want more detail, see www.TokyotoLondon.com
-Ali-
Guest
wow, you guys are really helpful. Much gratitude for you all.
dotcaf- yeah currently doing it with a friend, but would be cool to meet up and discuss
unhinged - that would be wonderful and i'd be more than happy to pay you for them or make a donation to the site. I live in Canterbury,kent so we're not too far away.
To both of you i reckon it would be beneficial to meet up, maybe not now but in a month or two once we have developed a better plan.
If you like to contact me my email address is [email protected]
p.s. colbatch- your website is really inspiring,we've thought about sponsors, but to be honest i think thats not the aim of our trip. If you could drop us a line on how you got through china, i'd be really grateful
dotcaf- yeah currently doing it with a friend, but would be cool to meet up and discuss
unhinged - that would be wonderful and i'd be more than happy to pay you for them or make a donation to the site. I live in Canterbury,kent so we're not too far away.
To both of you i reckon it would be beneficial to meet up, maybe not now but in a month or two once we have developed a better plan.
If you like to contact me my email address is [email protected]
p.s. colbatch- your website is really inspiring,we've thought about sponsors, but to be honest i think thats not the aim of our trip. If you could drop us a line on how you got through china, i'd be really grateful
A friend of mine will be visiting Belarus for 3 weeks in October/November if your interested and it's not too late I'll ask him to see what he can get, in all probability they'll be in Russian but he says it's amazing what you can get on the blackmarket out there and dirt cheap too.
Cole
Registered user
For Starters
Alistair,
I think you could do a lot worse than run with the stuff "unhinged" has put up for sale there ... good starting points.
My advice at this point mate is to forget about riding freely thru China ... its a boat load of work. Sponsorship too is really only going to be worth the effort if you line up a lot of publicity and media interest in the first place.
I would take some russian lessons at university ... just "sit in" on the classes unofficially, so you dont pay for it and dont get examined on it ... its kinda what we did, and you get free lessons that way.
A couple of young english guys travelling around Russia on motorbikes (and speaking some Russian) ... believe me you will have a ball ... and so will the Russian girls you meet.
Getting across China to India will be the hard part for you. There are a couple of options open to you
(1) Fly the bikes from Central Asia to Pakistan ... Tashkent or Almaty to Karachi should be feasible.
(2) Cross China on the bikes, with a guide ... if you keep it short n sweet ... ie. enter at the Torugart pass that connects Kyrghyzstan with Kashgar in western China, and exit at the Khunjerab pass down the Karakorum highway into Pakistan ... your time in China could be kept to as little as 3-4 days. That would minimise the costs significantly. You would have preserved the integrity of the travel by motorcycle concept, and you would have ridden in China.
(3) Cross from Central Asia to Pakistan via either Iran or Afghanistan on the bikes. Iran on paper sounds the easiest ... cross from Turkmenistan to Iran, and then from southern Iran into Pakistan. I havent ridden in Iran, but all the people I know that have report it's people as being infinitely more friendly and hospitiable that they had feared. Alternatively cross from Tadjikistan into Afghanistan would be more interesting, especially if you were trying to keep media and sponsors amused. An old Aussie contact of mine, Peter Forwood, recently (2005) rode into Afghanistan alone, on a Harley. You can read more about that here:
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/forwood/afghani1.shtml
In that way, you could get to Kabul, and from Kabul the Pakistan border is not far away.
Also as I mention on my website mate ... get a copy of the Terra Circa or Mondo Enduro DVDs ... they are made by guys on the cheap riding around the world and will give you some idea what its like... they are great fun to watch and will inspire you and your mates no end.
Alistair,
I think you could do a lot worse than run with the stuff "unhinged" has put up for sale there ... good starting points.
My advice at this point mate is to forget about riding freely thru China ... its a boat load of work. Sponsorship too is really only going to be worth the effort if you line up a lot of publicity and media interest in the first place.
I would take some russian lessons at university ... just "sit in" on the classes unofficially, so you dont pay for it and dont get examined on it ... its kinda what we did, and you get free lessons that way.
A couple of young english guys travelling around Russia on motorbikes (and speaking some Russian) ... believe me you will have a ball ... and so will the Russian girls you meet.
Getting across China to India will be the hard part for you. There are a couple of options open to you
(1) Fly the bikes from Central Asia to Pakistan ... Tashkent or Almaty to Karachi should be feasible.
(2) Cross China on the bikes, with a guide ... if you keep it short n sweet ... ie. enter at the Torugart pass that connects Kyrghyzstan with Kashgar in western China, and exit at the Khunjerab pass down the Karakorum highway into Pakistan ... your time in China could be kept to as little as 3-4 days. That would minimise the costs significantly. You would have preserved the integrity of the travel by motorcycle concept, and you would have ridden in China.
(3) Cross from Central Asia to Pakistan via either Iran or Afghanistan on the bikes. Iran on paper sounds the easiest ... cross from Turkmenistan to Iran, and then from southern Iran into Pakistan. I havent ridden in Iran, but all the people I know that have report it's people as being infinitely more friendly and hospitiable that they had feared. Alternatively cross from Tadjikistan into Afghanistan would be more interesting, especially if you were trying to keep media and sponsors amused. An old Aussie contact of mine, Peter Forwood, recently (2005) rode into Afghanistan alone, on a Harley. You can read more about that here:
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/forwood/afghani1.shtml
In that way, you could get to Kabul, and from Kabul the Pakistan border is not far away.
Also as I mention on my website mate ... get a copy of the Terra Circa or Mondo Enduro DVDs ... they are made by guys on the cheap riding around the world and will give you some idea what its like... they are great fun to watch and will inspire you and your mates no end.
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