New jacket time

[paganman]

My 13 year old Halvarsons jacket is looking decidedly tired and due for retirement.
I'm drawn to the BMW Enduro Guard jacket (great price on Bohling website) or the Klim Carlsbad.
I like the idea of laminate over drop liner, seems a lot less faff than removing a waterproof liner on the rare hot days.
My chest is 50" and I'm normally EU60 but the BMW sizing seems to indicate I'd need an EU62?
I've tried a 2xl Klim which fits well.
Any advice greatfully recieved.

 

[Johnnydrama]

I have a Carlsbad, excellent jacket but a good mid layer is needed as its light. I use a gerbing.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

 

[DJ123]

I have a Carlsbad, excellent jacket but a good mid layer is needed as its light. I use a gerbing.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

I've also got the Carlsbad suit. Excellent in wet weather, and keeping the cold out. I wear a windproof midlayer (either Rukka Aldrich fleece lined, or thin layered windproof ABR jacket) and a t-shirt.

Also, it is good to have the Kidneybelt too. This helps keep the jacket tight on you, and add/remove adjustment with lower layers.

The Klim stuff is more form fitting (being an American Brand). I'm a 40" chest and went for a Large (42") so i can add layers beneath it.

 

[Sneldog]

Another vote for a Carlsbad from me. It’s the best jacket I’ve ever had. Absolutely fantastic. Never let me down in any weather and is really well designed for all seasons. Highly recommended.

I have the large size and I’m a 44 chest. It fits perfectly.

 

[ymfb]

I cannot comment on the Carlsbad, but my EnduroGuard suit has been great

 

[GS2022]

EN 17092

At this price point, I'd get a Hideout Metropole jacket. The off-the-peg cost is similar to the BMW and Klim options, but the Hideout jacket will be even better built and considerably more protective too. Plus, it can be made bespoke (your choice of ventilation, pockets, made-to-measure size, etc.).

Unfortunately, I believe the Enduroguard only has a CE A rating (i.e. the lowest protection level!). IMO, an A rating is inadequate protection for touring and road riding. But it’s worth double-checking with your local dealer if BMW makes any AA rated textiles (perhaps I’m mistaken, and the Enduroguard is AA rated after all?).

Klim doesn’t sell anything with less than CE AA rated protection. It’s what I’d hope for textiles at this price (albeit not as protective as BKS 100SX or Hideout Hi-Pro textiles). BKS and Hideout's textiles are in another league and surpass AAA by a considerable margin.

 

[DJ123]

At this price point, I'd get a Hideout Metropole jacket. The off-the-peg cost is similar to the BMW and Klim options, but the Hideout jacket will be even better built and considerably more protective too. Plus, it can be made bespoke (your choice of ventilation, pockets, made-to-measure size, etc.).

Unfortunately, I believe the Enduroguard only has a CE A rating (i.e. the lowest protection level!). IMO, an A rating is inadequate protection for touring and road riding. But it’s worth double-checking with your local dealer if BMW makes any AA rated textiles (perhaps I’m mistaken, and the Enduroguard is AA rated after all?).

Klim doesn’t sell anything with less than CE AA rated protection. It’s what I’d hope for textiles at this price (albeit not as protective as BKS 100SX or Hideout Hi-Pro textiles). BKS and Hideout's textiles are in another league and surpass AAA by a considerable margin.

Do the other jackets line up with Klim- Do they have a product lifetime warranty? What is the armour that comes as standard?

If you want an AAA rated Klim you go for the Badlands, which puts you in 3 layer laminated Gore-tex territory, and a larger price bracket. Probably inline with the custom made garments you've referenced.

 

[craigholt]

Do the other jackets line up with Klim- Do they have a product lifetime warranty? What is the armour that comes as standard?

If you want an AAA rated Klim you go for the Badlands, which puts you in 3 layer laminated Gore-tex territory, and a larger price bracket. Probably inline with the custom made garments you've referenced.

Klim don't provide a lifetime warranty per se, but Gortex do on issues of waterproof failure. That's from a claim, noit he said, she said.

I scaled 'back' from Badlands to Carlsbad to get a lighter suit. Sold my five year old Badlands for strong money, which funded the Carlsbad.

 

[DJ123]

note my/their wording; product lifetime warranty - as to a reasonable time period the product should last and perform.

 

[GS2022]

Do the other jackets line up with Klim- Do they have a product lifetime warranty? What is the armour that comes as standard?

Yes, I believe they have a similar product warranty, and from what I've seen, their build quality is even higher than Klim, Rukka, etc. Both BKS and Hideout use level 2 D30 armour as standard, but BKS also offers an upgrade to its proprietary armour. The latter surpasses the "level 3" standard. (Cambridge University devised a CE level 3 armour standard, but overseas manufacturers got the EU to drop it.) Also, there's an airbag option for BKS (Tech-Air) and Hideout (In&Motion).

If you want an AAA rated Klim you go for the Badlands, which puts you in 3 layer laminated Gore-tex territory, and a larger price bracket. Probably inline with the custom made garments you've referenced.

Price-wise, BKS 100SX textiles and most of Hideout's Hi-Pro range are in line with Klim's Badlands Pro A3. However, the Hideout Metropole jacket is £650 if you buy an off-the-peg size, and it feels much softer and comfier than the stiff Badlands Pro A3. And the BKS 100SX and Hideout Hi-Pro gear surpass the highest CE rating (the EN 13595 level 2 test, which requires garments to be significantly more protective than even AAA).

 

[Mongolian Explorer]

RUKKA

 

[bowser]

Klim don't provide a lifetime warranty per se, but Gortex do on issues of waterproof failure. That's from a claim, noit he said, she said.

I scaled 'back' from Badlands to Carlsbad to get a lighter suit. Sold my five year old Badlands for strong money, which funded the Carlsbad.

I had the adventure suit, kept it in good nick, regularly washed and reproofed with nikwax wash in stuff, finally stopped being waterproof, 11 years old and they replaced with new Badlands, no argument.
On the price basis cant argue, however I personaly think the Badlands design is shite but that's a different matter.

If you want another option, I have an adventure spec linesman jacket which is one of the best I have ever had, room for warm something underneath in winter and waterproof over jacket in wet.
and smart enough to wear off the bike so only take one jacket. Riding to faro this year and will wear that

 

[GS2022]

RUKKA

While Rukka makes wonderfully waterproof gear that’s nice to wear, it’s fallen a long way behind the competition on protection. Virtually all Rukka’s clothing fails to get a CE AA rating, which is more than disappointing considering the price. In contrast, practically every Rukka competitor in its price range achieves an AA rating or higher.

The only exception is the Rukka Kingsley suit, which uses a double-layer of abrasion-resistant material (Keprotec and Armacor) in the high-risk zones. But every other Rukka garment – even the new £2.1k Nivala 2 suit – only has a single layer of material to protect the areas at highest risk of holing in a crash. The Nivala 2 is the world’s most expensive suit to possess the lowest possible protection rating! Sadly, Rukka is behind the safety curve

 

[DJ123]

While Rukka makes wonderfully waterproof gear that’s nice to wear, it’s fallen a long way behind the competition on protection. Virtually all Rukka’s clothing fails to get a CE AA rating, which is more than disappointing considering the price. In contrast, practically every Rukka competitor in its price range achieves an AA rating or higher.

The only exception is the Rukka Kingsley suit, which uses a double-layer of abrasion-resistant material (Keprotec and Armacor) in the high-risk zones. But every other Rukka garment – even the new £2.1k Nivala 2 suit – only has a single layer of material to protect the areas at highest risk of holing in a crash. The Nivala 2 is the world’s most expensive suit to possess the lowest possible protection rating! Sadly, Rukka is behind the safety curve

The issue with the current safety test and the stretch material Rukka are incorporating into their jackets is the giving the low 'A' result. The test apparently does not work in the same manner/abrasion you would have happen during a real world accident. And apparently their previous jackets were given safety certificates based off drawings, materials and details of how they were made, and not actually put through a test . . . .

If that's the case i think they should run their products by the 'Cambridge' test they use for riding jeans to give a slide team?

 

[GS2022]

Rukka's AA rating clothing – the Kingsley jacket and trousers – uses a double layer of Kevlar and Armacor for abrasion resistance in the high-risk zones. Unfortunately, the new Nivala 2 only uses a single layer (Armacor alone) in the shoulders, elbows, knees, etc. So, it appears Rukka's using cheaper protection in the expensive Nivala 2. It matters because independent research by MotoCAP found that a single layer generally provides inadequate abrasion resistance for high-risk areas.

The issue with the current safety test and the stretch material Rukka are incorporating into their jackets is the giving the low 'A' result.

Indeed, Motolegends argues that the Nivala 2's low protection rating is an issue with the test, not the Nivala 2. But I'm sceptical because Motolegends sells a lot of Rukka gear and, by its own admission, the Nivala is their biggest seller.

Moreover, the clothing manufacturers asked for the CE test to change from the original (Cambridge) abrasion test to the new Darmstadt test. They argued that the new test was more realistic of what happens in a real-world accident. So, Rukka can't have it both ways!

 

[DJ123]

Rukka's AA rating clothing – the Kingsley jacket and trousers – uses a double layer of Kevlar and Armacor for abrasion resistance in the high-risk zones. Unfortunately, the new Nivala 2 only uses a single layer (Armacor alone) in the shoulders, elbows, knees, etc. So, it appears Rukka's using cheaper protection in the expensive Nivala 2. It matters because independent research by MotoCAP found that a single layer generally provides inadequate abrasion resistance for high-risk areas.


Indeed, Motolegends argues that the Nivala 2's low protection rating is an issue with the test, not the Nivala 2. But I'm sceptical because Motolegends sells a lot of Rukka gear and, by its own admission, the Nivala is their biggest seller.

Moreover, the clothing manufacturers asked for the CE test to change from the original (Cambridge) abrasion test to the new Darmstadt test. They argued that the new test was more realistic of what happens in a real-world accident. So, Rukka can't have it both ways!

Indeed, they want their cake and to eat it . . . . And being a market leader, you would expect their products to be reflective of this. They've ample experience of building good gear, so to bet against them might not be the winning side

 

[adventuredon]

One of my main considerations when buying a jacket is waterproofness and then can it be used in all seasons. Yes protection is important and a close second. But it must keep me dry. Prefer a laminate as it doesnt soak in. I have a 1 year old £125 jacket that has adequate protection, but is not laminate so it gets soaked and if I need to travel/commute 2 days in a row its of no real use to me. Saying that, if its dry, its fine. Cost me £100 and has more features and pockets and is more comfortable than a £600 jacket. I often wonder why such a cheap jacket can be so comfortable and full of features for so little money. It worked wonders for first 2 years. So maybe its cost effective to buy less branded equipment but buy often, if that makes sense

 

[sanqhar]

I have a Dane jacket, never got wet.

They are sometimes discounted e.g. https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_rev/397258

tom