New to GS ownership and after some advice please!

[jojomonsta]

Hi

Ok, have been the (sort of) proud owner of a 1200GS for about 8 weeks now. It's a 2004 bought from a private dealer with about 46k on the clock and the engine is sound and it's in great condition. The problem I have is, out of those 8 weeks it's spent 3 of them in with the dealer fixing problems!

It started when I broke down in Cardiff on my first trip back to Wales (from Surrey about a week or so after I bought it) and the garage had it for 2 weeks to replace the gear indicator light switch as this was what was deemed to be the problem (after they consulted with a BMW dealership who advised this plan of action), however a couple of weeks later it's back with them after the same problem occurred.

In the first instance the lights were messing around (neutral showing in when not in neautral and wrong gear displayed on the screen) but the BIG issue occurred when it died at traffic lights.
No warning, just cut out and refused to start. The symptoms were very similar to the fuel running out.
I have seen lots of mentions of the fuel pump connectors/relay and a known problem and the garage have, on recommendation from the BMW dealership, checked this part but it appears clean and dry - should it be that obvious?

So, firstly, this has one more month's warranty left. Do I quit while I am ahead and hand the keys back saying thanks but no thanks after all this hassle or do I persevere with a few caveats such as extended warranty etc?

Does anyone have any idea what could be causing the problem? The bike is stored outside, under a cover. It's not ridden often (weekends - wish it was more!) but this cutting out doesn't seem to have any trigger I can identifiy. The bike hasn't been soaking wet other than when standing. Both times this has happened has been in tick over at lights. I open the throttle ad it just dies as though runnig out of fuel. I can get the engine to turn over but it either won't fire or it fires, ticks over for a few seconds then cuts out again.
Both times it's happened it eventually, after about 10-30 mins fires up and runs as though nothing ever happened!!!
It's frustrating as hard to demonstrate to the dealer as it is so itermittent.

So, any advice appreciated. The logical side of me is saying walk away but the emotional side is saying stick with it. I have unfortunately become a bit attached to it (yes, already!)

I am so fed up about this because I tried the bike (after wanting one for years) and fell in love. It is such a great bike and I love it so much. Just having such a bad experience right now...

Help!

Jo

 

[sdcastle]

cant help much but dont give up. SOmeone will be along soon and you'll wish you never asked!!

Good luck

 

[JohnnyBoxer]

Hi

Ok, have been the (sort of) proud owner of a 1200GS for about 8 weeks now. It's a 2004 bought from a private dealer with about 46k on the clock and the engine is sound and it's in great condition. The problem I have is, out of those 8 weeks it's spent 3 of them in with the dealer fixing problems!

It started when I broke down in Cardiff on my first trip back to Wales (from Surrey about a week or so after I bought it) and the garage had it for 2 weeks to replace the gear indicator light switch as this was what was deemed to be the problem (after they consulted with a BMW dealership who advised this plan of action), however a couple of weeks later it's back with them after the same problem occurred.

In the first instance the lights were messing around (neutral showing in when not in neautral and wrong gear displayed on the screen) but the BIG issue occurred when it died at traffic lights.
No warning, just cut out and refused to start. The symptoms were very similar to the fuel running out.
I have seen lots of mentions of the fuel pump connectors/relay and a known problem and the garage have, on recommendation from the BMW dealership, checked this part but it appears clean and dry - should it be that obvious?

So, firstly, this has one more month's warranty left. Do I quit while I am ahead and hand the keys back saying thanks but no thanks after all this hassle or do I persevere with a few caveats such as extended warranty etc?


Does anyone have any idea what could be causing the problem? The bike is stored outside, under a cover. It's not ridden often (weekends - wish it was more!) but this cutting out doesn't seem to have any trigger I can identifiy. The bike hasn't been soaking wet other than when standing. Both times this has happened has been in tick over at lights. I open the throttle ad it just dies as though runnig out of fuel. I can get the engine to turn over but it either won't fire or it fires, ticks over for a few seconds then cuts out again.
Both times it's happened it eventually, after about 10-30 mins fires up and runs as though nothing ever happened!!!
It's frustrating as hard to demonstrate to the dealer as it is so itermittent.

So, any advice appreciated. The logical side of me is saying walk away but the emotional side is saying stick with it. I have unfortunately become a bit attached to it (yes, already!)

I am so fed up about this because I tried the bike (after wanting one for years) and fell in love. It is such a great bike and I love it so much. Just having such a bad experience right now...

Help!

Jo

That would be my next move

Money back and go buy one from a BMW dealer, with an approved used BMW warranty (even if the bike costs a bit more)

 

[mrjim130]

I'd go with jonnyboxers advice. Too many faults in such a short time.
Good luck, what ever you decide.

 

[gipsymagpie]

Sounds like a duffer. Mine has had a few faults I'll admit but only spread over 6 years. Give it back and choose a different one.

 

[jojomonsta]

Cheers gang
Had a feeling you were going to say that!

Need to build up the courage to ring the garage and tell them. Am I within my rights?
I must admit, I'm rubbish at complaining...

Bit gutted as now have to wait until something else comes along, if they do take it back...

 

[davegs]

1200gs

You will be within your rights obviously not fit for purpose, get one from a BMW dealer they will at least not have to phone elsewhere for an opinion.
You can always phone trading stds and ask their advice, are you in the RAC or AA? they have a leagle service just ask advice. Don't put up with this state of affairs it's YOUR money and YOUR bike so be firm. Good luck. And when you get one always take it to Steptoe of ths parish he's the best around. (cheque will do Neil).
Dave GS

 

[Wapping]

Not so fast, jojomonsta...

The 'Neutral light / gear postion' problem does sound awfully like the potentiometer, as suggested by BMW. Are you sure it was fitted correctly ?

If it goes out of whack the bike will not start as it 'thinks' it is in gear.

=======

When you say, the bike cut out and would not re-start (as if there was no fuel) that would match the effect of a failed fuel pump controller. The FPC being dry is no guarantee that the thing works. Mine was perfectly dry when it failed outside my house. It worked three minutes earlier, too. It's what the electronics are like inside the housing that's important and you can't see those.

What happened next? Did the bike restart? If so, it's unlikely to have been the FPC, mostly they just fail and that's it. For all you know it was the gear position switch playing up again..... or maybe not..... a few more desscriptions of the 'bike didn't start' and 'what happened next', might help.

The bike is now eight years old, which is no great age. But quite possibly it has been through the hands of several 'improvers' (you only need to look at the pages of UKGSer to see what that might mean in reality)... Bods who can do so much better than BMW, building / repairing a bike to what BMW should have built, mate.

Shift it down to a regular BMW dealer or (much cheaper) a good localindependent, not 'Ron's Bikes' or wherever you bought it from. Get them to do a basic health check on the thing.... You will then know what to do.

 

[GS_or_bust]

See this, I am sure it is the same for bikes and cars. Perhaps the warranty you have would pay for it to be looked at by a BMW dealer.

 

[jojomonsta]

Not so fast, jojomonsta...

The 'Neutral light / gear postion' problem does sound awfully like the potentiometer, as suggested by BMW. Are you sure it was fitted correctly ?

If it goes out of whack the bike will not start as it 'thinks' it is in gear.

This was what they thought may have been the problem in the first instance hence the reason it was replaced but the cut out problem has occurred since. The neutral light issue has not happened since they replaced that switch though

=======

When you say, the bike cut out and would not re-start (as if there was no fuel) that would match the effect of a failed fuel pump controller. The FPC being dry is no guarantee that the thing works. Mine was perfectly dry when it failed outside my house. It worked three minutes earlier, too. It's what the electronics are like inside the housing that's important and you can't see those.

What happened next? Did the bike restart? If so, it's unlikely to have been the FPC, mostly they just fail and that's it. For all you know it was the gear position switch playing up again..... or maybe not..... a few more desscriptions of the 'bike didn't start' and 'what happened next', might help.

The bike restarted after several attempts and then just leaving it alone before trying it again. immobiliser was another consideration but then it wouldn't turn over at all would it?

The bike is now eight years old, which is no great age. But quite possibly it has been through the hands of several 'improvers' (you only need to look at the pages of UKGSer to see what that might mean in reality)... Bods who can do so much better than BMW, building / repairing a bike to what BMW should have built, mate.

Shift it down to a regular BMW dealer or (much cheaper) a good localindependent, not 'Ron's Bikes' or wherever you bought it from. Get them to do a basic health check on the thing.... You will then know what to do.
As it stands, the bike is currently with the local independent who are ringing a BMW dealer for advice by the sound of it.

I've just lost confidence and have been fretting about it since the first time it broke down.

I feel a bit stuck and I am really quite fed up about it. I should have heeded advice to buy from BMW dealer and only one with FSH by BMW, just impatient as usual. That will teach me!

My only consolation is whether I can still escape due to the warranty and sale of goods act...

I don't want to be horrible but then don't want to get stuck with a dog. I spent all my savings on this and it's not money I can just dismiss!

 

[topperchallenge]

Not so fast, jojomonsta...

The 'Neutral light / gear postion' problem does sound awfully like the potentiometer, as suggested by BMW. Are you sure it was fitted correctly ?

If it goes out of whack the bike will not start as it 'thinks' it is in gear.

=======

When you say, the bike cut out and would not re-start (as if there was no fuel) that would match the effect of a failed fuel pump controller. The FPC being dry is no guarantee that the thing works. Mine was perfectly dry when it failed outside my house. It worked three minutes earlier, too. It's what the electronics are like inside the housing that's important and you can't see those.

What happened next? Did the bike restart? If so, it's unlikely to have been the FPC, mostly they just fail and that's it. For all you know it was the gear position switch playing up again..... or maybe not..... a few more desscriptions of the 'bike didn't start' and 'what happened next', might help.

The bike is now eight years old, which is no great age. But quite possibly it has been through the hands of several 'improvers' (you only need to look at the pages of UKGSer to see what that might mean in reality)... Bods who can do so much better than BMW, building / repairing a bike to what BMW should have built, mate.

Shift it down to a regular BMW dealer or (much cheaper) a good localindependent, not 'Ron's Bikes' or wherever you bought it from. Get them to do a basic health check on the thing.... You will then know what to do.

It is worth adding that if someone else works on the bike, you can cause yourself a lot more hassle if you do then decide to return/reject the bike to original seller. You have to reject the bike within a 'reasonable' length of time, so keep on top of things. If you are in any doubt, your local Citizen Advice Bureau will give you the exact course of action you need to take.

Nothing worse when all you want to do is ride, hope you get it all sorted soon!

 

[topperchallenge]

I've just lost confidence and have been fretting about it since the first time it broke down.

I feel a bit stuck and I am really quite fed up about it. I should have heeded advice to buy from BMW dealer and only one with FSH by BMW, just impatient as usual. That will teach me!

My only consolation is whether I can still escape due to the warranty and sale of goods act...

I don't want to be horrible but then don't want to get stuck with a dog. I spent all my savings on this and it's not money I can just dismiss!

Speak to your local CSA office (or Trading Standards directly - 08454 04 05 06), they will tell you where you stand & what you need to do. It'll give you confidence to get things sorted ( and you 'will' get them sorted). Stand your ground with dealer, you paid good money to them.

 

[jojomonsta]

It is worth adding that if someone else works on the bike, you can cause yourself a lot more hassle if you do then decide to return/reject the bike to original seller. You have to reject the bike within a 'reasonable' length of time, so keep on top of things. If you are in any doubt, your local Citizen Advice Bureau will give you the exact course of action you need to take.

Nothing worse when all you want to do is ride, hope you get it all sorted soon!

You're so right there! Have been itching to get out!

And yes, all work undertake has been by the seller. The AA were very good when they first rescued me as they knew it was under warranty and refused to 'tinker'

I will contact Trading Standards and get my facts right before I broach the subject of refund/return with the dealers. I need to ring to see what the hell's happening anyway as they took the bike in last Saturday (when I limped it there) and apart from the phone call Tuesday to ask about the conditions under which it's stalling I have heard nothing since..



Meh...

 

[Sgt Bilco]

As you are in Surrey, why don't you pop it round to Steptoe who will give you an honest opinion and appraisal of what the problem is? It won't affect anything and at least you will know what the problem is and it may be something really simple. You have nothing to lose by doing this and may well be armed with good information to use against the dealer.

As you bought it from a private (I presume non BMW?) they may not have a feckin clue what it is so are maiking a right hash of the repairs.

If it is fixable and Steptoe can do it, you may find the dealer or warranty company tell him to go ahead and do it.

 

[jojomonsta]

Ok...
Just phoned the dealer. The guy I spoke to had to speak to the owner and get back to me as didn't know what was happening. He then rang me back and told me (this is interesting) that they have just managed to talk the local BMW dealer into allowing them to send a mechanic up on the bike to get them to plug it in for a diagnostic this afternoon even though they are usually too busy.

How this hasn't been done since I last spoke to them as I was led to believe it would I don't know.
Ok, they may be busier now as the summer (haha) is on its way but you would have thought they would have put some emphasis on this due to the amount of trouble this has caused me?

Supposed to be ringing me back this afternoon so will wait and see what they say but have already said this is getting beyond a joke now...

 

[jojomonsta]

As you are in Surrey, why don't you pop it round to Steptoe who will give you an honest opinion and appraisal of what the problem is? It won't affect anything and at least you will know what the problem is and it may be something really simple. You have nothing to lose by doing this and may well be armed with good information to use against the dealer.

As you bought it from a private (I presume non BMW?) they may not have a feckin clue what it is so are maiking a right hash of the repairs.

If it is fixable and Steptoe can do it, you may find the dealer or warranty company tell him to go ahead and do it.

I would, if I had it! It's currently with the dealers. And they seem to be on the phone to the local BMW dealers for their advice (Vines) when they get stuck. That's where they're taking it now to plug in for a diagnostic, so it's kinda going to an approved garage, 3rd hand!!??
I don't think they have tackled anything without first consulting Vines so fingers crossed no damage has been done in that respect.

 

[Magwych]

As per Wapping post it sounds like your gear position potentiometer went, which is likely the root of teh isseu.

IIRC : When the pot. is replaced, the computer needs to be retaught the positions of the gears. The pot just gives different resistances in dfifferent positons, the computer than needs to know what gear that each resistance ( hence voltage across the potentiometer) means.

I am guessing that is what Vines are saying to the dealer, albeit in more vague terms.

The cutting out does sound like it could be FPC, a visual inspection of teh underside may reveal evidnce of corrosion from within. The lack of this does not mean it is good though, agains the BMUU Dealer's computer should help here and show if any faults have been logged.

These are well known "features" of the bike that can be easily remedied, but the gear position indicator does need computerised help.

Hope this helps alleviate some of your concerns?

 

[Wapping]

So it's off to a regular BMW dealer (as opposed to a good independent) for a check-out on behalf of 'Ron's Bikes'.

Time and unfolding events will now take their course....

You wonder why 'Ron's Bikes' hadn't sent it up there before? Well, if I had to guess, it costs money

 

[jojomonsta]

Ok. BMW looked at it and plugged it in. Faulty fuel connector switch. When they took a look at the area they spotted that it was the original, faulty part. Now ordered the part and will be in and fitted next week.
Have explained that's now 4 weeks it will have been with them and asked if I could have warranty extended by that time.
Should I now rest easy but just take to an approved dealer from here on in or still consider return?

 

[Wapping]

Should I now rest easy but just take to an approved dealer from here on in or still consider return?

So, you now have an eight year old bike, bought from 'Ron's Bikes', that had two unrelated faults, both it seems fixed through the intervention of a BMW dealer.

That may well be the end of it, forever.... or it may not, who can tell? Certainly nobody here who were mostly telling you to take it back and demand a return of your money.

If you have a degree of spare cash, take it to a franchised BMW dealer and pay their service prices. It sounds like Vines are the closest to you. Several UKGSer correspondents support them (and it seems they have fixed your bike twice already) if that means anything.

OR

If you have less spare cash, find yourself a good independent dealer. Several bods engage the services of Steptoe, who is probably not a million miles away.

It really is that simple.

My original advice still stands. Get the bike running properly and reasonably reliably; you seem to be on the way, already. Well done.

Once you are happy that it is reasonably OK, then decide what YOU want to do every 6,000 miles / once a year and/or if it ever plays up again.... which it might, or might not do.