Oils and more oils

[bernardofeio]

Hello

I have an 1990 r100gs for some time and now I’ve done the first oil change.

It never happened before but now after the bike is hot the oil light starts to become visible. Not only in low revs. It starts to come out at around 1100 rpm.

Questions:

-Can I put the oil filter wrong? I’ve change it together with the oil but I’m now afraid that I had put it the wrong way. Is it possible? How many o-rings should come with the filter for this bike? In the box only came one. (mahle filter)

-I have filled the engine with nonograde SAE 30 oil. Where in Portugal, even in the morning, the days are now hot and since I already had the oil in the garage I decided to try. In the manual they say it’s ok but I want your opinion. This should not be the reason for the light to come out…

-I have also changed the oil in the gear box and in the rear hub (EP 90 or 80w 95). Is there any particular secret or it’s just removing the old oil and put new one till the level. I didn’t confirm the exact oil volumes in the manual but instead filled until it starts to come out. (I’m probably dreaming but it seems hat the gearbox is making more noise when I release the clutch with no gear engaged)


Thanks!

Bernardo Feio

 

[John Armstrong]

Don't know about the seals, but I do you if you get it wrong it can be expensive

But when my oil temp gauge in the dipstick was showing about 160 deg C, the oil light didn't even flicker at all at idle. That was with 20w / 50 Castrol mineral oil that was over 3000 miles old.

IIWY I'd not run the engine again until you confirm the correct seal number and type is fitted.

This link might help: http://www.motorworks.co.uk/bmw/pro..._15_20_XA_15&header_text=&header_text_image=0

 

[(RIP) maverick]

-I have also changed the oil in the gear box and in the rear hub (EP 90 or 80w 95). Is there any particular secret or it’s just removing the old oil and put new one till the level. I didn’t confirm the exact oil volumes in the manual but instead filled until it starts to come out. (I’m probably dreaming but it seems hat the gearbox is making more noise when I release the clutch with no gear engaged)


Thanks!

Bernardo Feio

The bevel drive and gearbox oil I normally fill on level ground just until it reaches the first thread on the filler holes. If you fill it to much it will probably start blowing at the breathers when getting hot and under pressure and you might blow a seal eek imagine that )

On the rear of the gearbox if I recall there is a small bearing on the clutch arm assembly which will make a noise if it is old and run dry ......will need to check the manual

Not sure why the oil light is coming on but double check the oil level before riding it again as a start.

 

[BegesRus]

Alarm Bells are Ringing - step away from the Moto

Sounds very much like you have incorrectly installed the Oil filter and the washer and rings that go around it.

Do not run the engine - remove the filter and do it properly otherwise you will ruin your engine.

If you don't know how then get a manual or ask.

Good luck

 

[bernardofeio]

Concerning the oil filter.

It eventually can only go 2 ways.  No doubt about this

Since the shaft inside the oil filter house has different diameters and the filter has a metallic plate one on top I presume that the metallic plate should be faced outside…

Can any one confirm this? It seems that it couldn’t go the other way around but now I have doubts…

I’ve cheeked the manual while I was installing the filter but I didn’t make a conclusion

thanks

 

[BegesRus]

Mine is a R100GSPD with Oil Cooler

When you take out the old filter make sure that the rubber end is not left inside the oil chamber - if so dig it out.

Replace the filter inserting the rubber end first so this goes to be bottom of the chamber.

The Rubber ring goes on the triangle cover plate and the metal ring goes on top of the rubber one.

You should have a little pressure / resistance pushing the filter into final position when doing up the cover studs - this ensures that you get oil pressure.

It's crap design really but if done correctly it all works fine.

If in doubt fit an oil pressure guauge into the oil pressure switch to check - I do this each time I change the filter - just to be sure.

 

[bernardofeio]

Thanks… I think that I’ve putted it the wrong way. I’ve probably should have forced the filter a bit.

The metal ring should come with the filter? Mine didn’t…

Just to confirm. Please see the photo bellow(it's the filter that I've boght)

http://www.motobins.co.uk/thumbnail.php?img=02300

The rubber collar that is attached to the filter should face the triangle cover or the inside of the engine?

Any trick to put it the correct way with out taking all the oil out?

 

[John Armstrong]

Google brings up: http://www.airheads.org/content/view/302/98/

And ADVrider thread: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42011

If you take the filter out with the bike on the sidestand, that would save some of the oil from coming out. As long as the stand doesn't self retract half way through and cause more problems

 

[Mike Wilkins]

Mine is an '89 R100GS with cooler
When I recently did this the black O ring that comes with the filter goes in the cover plate.
The rest came with the Motobins service kit and consists of - white O ring, metal shim and paper gasket.
The filter goes in rubber end first (as you say this is the only way)
Next, white O ring in the end of the canister folowed by metal shim.
The cover (with black O ring) is then fitted with the paper gasket.
This is how mine was when I dismantled it first time.
Regards
Mike

 

[Steptoe]

Be very careful -
Some bikes need a gasket, some don't.

Some bikes need a metal shim, some don't.

Very difficult to tell what bike needs what. I get bikes from the same year with different oil filter set ups, I just replace everything in the same way i found it.

 

[bernardofeio]

I’ve putted all the parts that came in the filter box but I’m getting low oil pressure. In the box it only come the filter and one square profile oil ring

I think that when I disassemble the old filter 2 o-rings come out but I must cheek it in the oil can.

 

[Rob Farmer]

Whatever you do don't ride the bike until it's sorted otherwise you will trash the engine. You don't need all of the parts that came with the filter. you measure down from the oil seal cover face to the oil tube in the engine, the measurement should be between 3.2 and 3.8 mm if it isn't then use a shim so that it is. Your bike just needs an o ring after that. The parts that came in the box cover the older machines as well as yours so most parts need to be discarded.

Have a read here Link Anton Largiadier has put an excellent site toghether explaining the issues. If it doesn't make sense then pay somebody to service the bike for you.

The gearbox and final drive oil must be at least GL5 specification. The more common GL4 spec just isn't up to the job.

 

[BillN]

What did you originally remove?

THE GENERAL RULE IS (now) TO ALWAYS REPLACE WHAT YOU HAVE REMOVED as far as the O ring, (White or Black - both the same - the white ones are more nasty for the environment), and metal shim are concerned.

As I understand it, originally, the bits that come in the filter kit are for both types of Bikes:

a). The GS WITHOUT the oil filter, and
b). The GS WITH the Oil filter

Depending which you have you either needed the metal shim or not, but this is now disputed and in particular Anton Largiadier "went to town" on the US$2,000 oil ring problem, but I have never felt the need to go that far.

The Manual can also be confusing as it refers to the R80 and R100....rather than, in my opinion, to the with oil cooler and without oil cooler situation

 

[BegesRus]

So in short - nobody really knows the answer

Leave it in? - no leave it out? - Best get a Honda

 

[BillN]

Leave it in? - no leave it out? - Best get a Honda

To drain the oil from my HONDA Lawn Mower you tip it upside down and "drain" the oil back through the filler - there isn't even an oil drain plug -

 

[BillN]

What did you originally remove?

THE GENERAL RULE IS (now) TO ALWAYS REPLACE WHAT YOU HAVE REMOVED as far as the O ring, (White or Black - both the same - the white ones are more nasty for the environment), and metal shim are concerned.

As I understand it, originally, the bits that come in the filter kit are for both types of Bikes:

a). The GS WITHOUT the oil filter, and
b). The GS WITH the Oil filter

Depending which you have you either needed the metal shim or not, but this is now disputed and in particular Anton Largiadier "went to town" on the US$2,000 oil ring problem, but I have never felt the need to go that far.

The Manual can also be confusing as it refers to the R80 and R100....rather than, in my opinion, to the with oil cooler and without oil cooler situation

EDIT - I should have said:

a). The GS WITHOUT the oil cooler, and
b). The GS WITH the Oil cooler

must be the heat out here

 

[shafted]

Hello

I have an 1990 r100gs for some time and now I’ve done the first oil change.

It never happened before but now after the bike is hot the oil light starts to become visible. Not only in low revs. It starts to come out at around 1100 rpm.


You're not looking at the alternator light?

 

[bernardofeio]

“You're not looking at the alternator light?”

No!!

The problem was solved by reading this excellent site:

http://www.largiader.com/tech/filters/

It’s very well explained. Now I know the reason for all bits and parts (it’s a pity that the original manual doesn’t explain it in the oil change chapter.

Now I know that I have to buy a similar o-ring to the “white 0-ring” (52mm diam x 4mm). Is this o-ring from any special material?

I drove the bike aprox 80kms with out this O-ring. The oil pressure light only started to shine after the oil has hot and in low revs.
(I only send the email to the forum after making 60kms so I was not counselled before)

The pressure sensor is connected to the oil system after or before the oil filter? If it’s after the oil filter I always had some pressure in the oil system so probably I didn’t make any big damage to the engine … but if it’s before I could have some pressure in the sensor but not in the oil system.

 

[Beemerboff]

The problem with the filters is that the later , lipped canisters are now starting to move further into the block, and this can result in no or low compression on the white O ring, and low or no oil pressure.

This movement can happen between oil changes , so shims might need to be added where there was no need previously.

As per the previews poster Antons site has all you need to know - if you dont understand the advice it is going to be cheaper to get someone else to change the filter for you, before you have a $3000- O ring.

 

[(RIP) pastyman]

As one who has trashed his engine in just this fashion, DO NOT RIDE IT UNTIL IT IS FIXED. My O ring was faulty and it allows the oil in the filter to by pass the system and go straight back into the sump. No leaks visible on the outside and the oil light only came on when hot or at low speed. apparantly this is because bmw set the point where the light comes on at a very low figure by which time the damage has been done. I now work on the principle that the oil light should go out even before the engine fires