Old-new BMW RT owner

[robvanelst]

Hello there all,
I am new around here.
I owned Beemers between 1982 (started at 17 years of age.... ) and 2000, mostly naked airheads, RTs and G/S - GS.
The last two models I owned ('93 R1100RS, '96 R1100RT, both owned from new) were great rides but so incredibly fragile that I reluctantly moved to other brands, including (ironically - I know) Ducati and Buell. The Buell is brilliant (they ARE, provided you leave them standard and keep them away from HD dealers), it has covered 72,000 miles and running well but with my new long commute needed a working-buddy in the garage.

As a blood-bike volunteer, I know the R1200RT really well and I learned to love these things to bits: a lovely blend of old-fashioned character from the choppy twin, a joy to throw around corners, and yet still sensible and very comfortable. Also, unlike my early 1100's, drives, cylinder-heads, clutches, big-ends and gearboxes no longer seem to explode every second ride: the 1200s are doing well as bloodbikes with few problems (mainly corrosion and drive leaks, typically only at high mileage though).

Perfect it isn't - but that just seems to make it even more enjoyable - well, I am a Buell owner too after all.

I had been planning to buy new but I suspect a new watercooled model will be with us soon so trade-in value-wise buying an early 1200RT for now seemed a better idea and move on later. I ended up with an '06 model in great nick and good service history plus warranty. I noticed some differences with the police-versions we use as bloodbikes (apart from the obvious seat and panniers - not to mention colour-scheme and blues): the gearing is taller (which is probably good, but slightly less fun), the suspension is a bit firmer which is definitely a plus. My model has the servo brakes. Those are a little odd, there is a high pitch noise when just engaging the lever, I assume it's normal? They work well, but oddly not quite as impressive and precise as the non-servo ones we run on the (newer) bloodbikes. Less is more: That is progress I suppose

My bike has standard Bridgestone 023 fitted, not the recommended GT version - would you say that is a problem? I may want to change them anyway, Bridgestones always seem a bit harsh with the Telever front suspension when running over sharp ramps and potholes.

Anyway - I will stop rambling on for now and annoy you a little more later

 

[sven]

I have BT-023GT's on mine and it has a very stiff carcass on the rear, so the ride quality is very harsh one-up, but fine two-up.

 

[robvanelst]

I have BT-023GT's on mine and it has a very stiff carcass on the rear, so the ride quality is very harsh one-up, but fine two-up.

Thank you for that. I mostly ride solo with not too much luggage, and given that the RT is actually not that heavy (compared to a Pan European for example) I will probably just leave them on for now.

 

[JKW]

Welcome to the madhouse - well the civilised side of it anyway, which is reserved for the enlightened who have graduated to the comfort and style of the RT and no longer feel the need to don full desert gear for the odd trip to .

On the tyres - I have recently removed BT-021s (by all accounts the 023s are much better - they couldn't be any worse!) from my '12 RT and fitted Michelin PR3s - without doubt the best bike/tyre combination I've ever experienced. If you do decide to change they are worth a look.

 

[Kritou]

I have a 1200RTP and always thought 1st gear (like the GSA) and the FD drive differed from he vanilla RT - now I'm not so sure. A US based RTP website suggests that it is only the 900cc Authority bike that has these features...... ?

 

[Martyn H]

I have a 1200RTP and always thought 1st gear (like the GSA) and the FD drive differed from he vanilla RT - now I'm not so sure. A US based RTP website suggests that it is only the 900cc Authority bike that has these features...... ?

They - the 1200 - have a lower 1st gear, which I suspect may be the GSA Enduro lower first. I am 99% sure the final drive ratio on the 1200 is as per the "civvie" model. I do have the official BMW specs. somewhere, but can't put my hand on them just at this moment.
As to tyres, BMW GB recommends for police use two tyre types only; the Bridgestone 021 & the Dunlop Roadmart 1 or 2. No brainer in my opinion, as the Dunlops are a great tyre.

 

[sven]

On the tyres - I have recently removed BT-021s (by all accounts the 023s are much better - they couldn't be any worse!) from my '12 RT and fitted Michelin PR3s - without doubt the best bike/tyre combination I've ever experienced. If you do decide to change they are worth a look.

Yep, the 023's are 10x better than the awful 021's. I like to make progress and the grip and handling of the 023's is pretty good.

 

[GSTourer]

I have a 2010RT and up until recently had Bridgestone BT023's.

Changed them for Michelin PR3's..........amazing difference in the suppleness of the ride and have noticed no difference in handling other than that.

I would never go back to the Bridgestones.

 

[busy builder]

I'm finding the 021's on my new RT are reluctant to tip into corners. Feels quite strange really as it is deffo the tyres not the bike.

 

[JKW]

I'm finding the 021's on my new RT are reluctant to tip into corners. Feels quite strange really as it is deffo the tyres not the bike.

Absolutely - and it'll just get worse as they age - it got so bad on mine I was even contemplating changing the bike Get 'em changed and make your life better.

 

[Kritou]

They - the 1200 - have a lower 1st gear, which I suspect may be the GSA Enduro lower first. I am 99% sure the final drive ratio on the 1200 is as per the "civvie" model. I do have the official BMW specs. somewhere, but can't put my hand on them just at this moment.
As to tyres, BMW GB recommends for police use two tyre types only; the Bridgestone 021 & the Dunlop Roadmart 1 or 2. No brainer in my opinion, as the Dunlops are a great tyre.

If you do find those 1st gear figures I would be most interested to see them

 

[khunpaul]

I have a 2010RT and up until recently had Bridgestone BT023's.

Changed them for Michelin PR3's..........amazing difference in the suppleness of the ride and have noticed no difference in handling other than that.

I would never go back to the Bridgestones.

I am not someone unlike in the 'princess and the pea story' who would claim to feel every slight difference about a tyre quality but Michelin RP3's are, even for me, a step change that mean I would never want to have anything else. I even got a £25 fuel voucher recently for buying two new tyres and claiming through their online form (maybe the offer is over now?)

 

[Riktus]

I ran Bridgestone BT023GT's last season and they were great - only started to let me down after 8000 miles and only in very wet conditions would the front let go over overbanding etc. The rear was close to limit and wore well in a nice profile similar to new shape. The front had plenty left but just seemed to loose its grip potential over time. Still great tyres with great mileage characteristics.

Just fitted a pair of Michelin PR3's (cos everyone raves about them) and they are very stable (only done about 800 miles on them) and secure. Feel safe cranked over in dry and damp conditions (not yet tries very wet conditions). Cant say I have noticed much difference in ride quality (maybe its me??) but the bike does feel planted when you hit a white line or overbanding at speed.
If I am honest I think the front tread pattern and pliable cleat design is what makes these tyres feel so confident (the cleat seems to be so pliable it opens up on grips the road surface).

The £25.00 fuel voucher was a good idea and made them within a few pounds of the Bridgestone tyres - cant give the full report until I find mileage and fuel efficiency over the period of time they are fitted.

For now I am impressed but no more than the Bridgestones if they last as well and give as good economy on fuel then they will get a positive vote - also be keen to see how the tyre profile wears because the Bridgestones allowed me to wring every last mile out of the rear......

Rik

 

[sven]

I'm finding the 021's on my new RT are reluctant to tip into corners. Feels quite strange really as it is deffo the tyres not the bike.

Mine was the same one-up - changing the tyres transformed the grip and handling

 

[sven]

I ran Bridgestone BT023GT's last season and they were great - only started to let me down after 8000 miles and only in very wet conditions would the front let go over overbanding etc. The rear was close to limit and wore well in a nice profile similar to new shape. The front had plenty left but just seemed to loose its grip potential over time. Still great tyres with great mileage characteristics.

My rear BT-023GT is almost worn out at 3400 miles (thrashing around the Lakes and Dales + a trip to Scotland last September) and will be changed before we go to Spain in July. I guess it'll be another 023 as the front is still OK and then I'll fit a pair of something different later in the summer.

 

[GSTourer]

I am not someone unlike in the 'princess and the pea story' who would claim to feel every slight difference about a tyre quality but Michelin RP3's are, even for me, a step change that mean I would never want to have anything else. I even got a £25 fuel voucher recently for buying two new tyres and claiming through their online form (maybe the offer is over now?)

Paul, I am the same as you re suspension/tyres etc but there is definitely a more pleasant ride with the PR3's as you say. I had always thought the suspension harsh but having had it checked and double checked by 2 dealers who found it OK have now concluded it was the tyres.

Put my £25 worth in at the weekend.

 

[robvanelst]

They - the 1200 - have a lower 1st gear, which I suspect may be the GSA Enduro lower first. I am 99% sure the final drive ratio on the 1200 is as per the "civvie" model. I do have the official BMW specs. somewhere, but can't put my hand on them just at this moment.
As to tyres, BMW GB recommends for police use two tyre types only; the Bridgestone 021 & the Dunlop Roadmart 1 or 2. No brainer in my opinion, as the Dunlops are a great tyre.

The 1st gear must be shorter, the police version pulls noticeably quicker from a stand-still. The final drive might be the same indeed; there is no clear difference in high speed acceleration. The rev-counter on the civil version in top gear shows fewer revs at the same speed, but then the police version has a calibrated speedo so that could well be the difference.
I suspect the shorter 1st gear will help slow riding, there seems no sensible reason to shorten the overall gearing?

Tyres: When I started riding bikes, the difference in brand could mean going happily through corners without giving it much thought or a guaranteed trip to hospital; nowadays, all modern sport-tour tyres from the big brands are "boringly" brilliant with relatively subtle differences. But yes - I never liked the ride of the Bridgestones on Telelever Beemers on bad roads and going over edgy ramps. Metzeler always used to work nicely from a comfort and (even) wear point of view, are they still outspokenly BMW-friendly? I have used Avon Storms on most of my recent bikes - they seem as good as anything but are made in our lovely country so one might as well go for those. Any known BMW-specific issues with Avon Storms?

 

[robvanelst]

Hmm - 3 weeks in and the first road-side breakdown
Fuel-pump module issue, earth (!?) gone missing to the fuel-pump.
Got the pump's earth hard-wired to get me home, it seems OK.
I convinced myself that the pump really doesn't work when ignition is off and when using the kill-switch. Given the countless number of fuel-pump module failures reported on the GS-hexhead forum I wonder if it's worth replacing the module?

It's a little traumatic - my last road-side failure since 2001, which was a BMW as well. Even my 72k-miles Buell always got me home. Anyway, I still love the RT's ride so I decide to stay positive about it all

 

[Martyn H]

The 1st gear must be shorter, the police version pulls noticeably quicker from a stand-still. The final drive might be the same indeed; there is no clear difference in high speed acceleration. The rev-counter on the civil version in top gear shows fewer revs at the same speed, but then the police version has a calibrated speedo so that could well be the difference.
I suspect the shorter 1st gear will help slow riding, there seems no sensible reason to shorten the overall gearing?

As I said above, the 1st gear is indeed shorter. The rationale is for in-town work, escorting slow loads etc. The top five are as per usual. To be honest, I think it would be a boon on the non-Authority bikes; when laden with a pillion rider & 2 weeks of luggage, it would be more than useful when moving off from a stand still.
Over the years Authorities bikes have often had different overall gearing. The first Met. 75/6's had the same gearing as the 50/6. The thinking was that in inner city traffic overall top speed was less important than acceleration. The first Police R80RT's likewise.
I think with the modern range's overall performance the need is less, & it does make production easier.