Power Commander Question

[Cook1e]

I just fitted a S/H Power Commander USB 3 Wideband thingy that came to me at the right price.

It's done what I wanted and was expecting i.e. increased torque where it matters, smoothed out power delivery and made for better overtaking acceleration.

So I'm happy, but I'm just curious to know if there's any simple gain that I may be missing. If I've understood, the replacement lambda sensor keeps the fuelling correct (standard map 13.8:1) across the range of throttle opening & revs, regardless of German emissions legislation.

The bike's standard apart from silencer removed and stubby fitted (still has cat).

I'm not bothered about maximum power or taking it racing, just getting the best from the bike for normal (OK, sometimes "enthusiastic") road riding.

Any thoughts?

Thanks in anticipation of wisdom

 

[Cook1e]

Bump!

Any Power Commander experts out there?

 

[Blackal]

Ditch the cat, get a K&N type air filter - get it dyno'd.

Then - you can be sure you are burning the max fuel- efficiently.

Al

 

[Schtum]

Ditch the cat,

Yes....

get a K&N type air filter

No - rubbish filtration and offers no performance improvement over a clean OEM filter and in any event, none that you'd ever feel.

get it dyno'd.

Perhaps. It may not be necessary with a PC V if you do the runs and save the fuel trims. I'm saying PC V rather than PC III USB since Cook1e said he had a wideband lamda sensor, ie the Power Commander Autotune module.

 

[Cook1e]

Yes....

No - rubbish filtration and offers no performance improvement over a clean OEM filter and in any event, none that you'd ever feel.

Perhaps. It may not be necessary with a PC V if you do the runs and save the fuel trims. I'm saying PC V rather than PC III USB since Cook1e said he had a wideband lamda sensor, ie the Power Commander Autotune module.

Hi Chaps, thanks for the input. Definitely PCIII also definitely wideband lambda. This one LINKY

Is "autotune" the 13.8:1 air:fuel mapping? "do the runs and save the fuel trims" right over my heed, I'm afraid.

I ran it briefly in the garage with the laptop plugged in and it was running a bit richer than that (about 11.9), but I don't think it had warmed up. Not sure this would tell me anything anyway, unless I had it on a rolling road to put load on the engine.

I considered a Y-piece, but then I'd need a silencer and my panniers wouldn't fit. I tend to agree with Schtum re the K&N, have seen a report showing increased contamination from K&N. What kind of torque/acceleration increase could I expect from from cat removal? Remember I'm not bothered about all-out top-end power.

Cheers,

Ian

 

[Schtum]

Sorry, you're right, I'd forgotten they did a widebandkit for the 1150. I didn't think anyone was still into turd polishing......

From what you say, I think you should get it set up on the dyno for the best performance / fuel efficiency compromise. If the 1150 responds as well to binning the cat' as the 1200 does and it's much cheaper to accomplish with the 1150 because you just have to fit a Y piece, not a complete set of headers, then it's a bit of a no-brainer. Seat of the pants tells me that my '11 twin cam GS is about as quick as standard as my '04 and '07 bikes were with a full Remus system.

 

[Cook1e]

OK, I looked up "Autotune and I see it's an additional module for the PC V. No, can't do that.

I have the stock PC map loaded, it includes "closed loop" set to the 13.8:1 mixture. If I understand correctly, this uses the wide band lambda to maintain the 13.8:1 air:fual at all throttle openings/revs - optimum fuelling, yes?

So, I guess my question's boiling down to "what else would a dyno run give it?"

Map attached:

 

[Cook1e]

I didn't think anyone was still into turd polishing......

Ya can't polish a turd, but you can roll it in glitter to make it sparkle

OK, cat removal looks the next step, I need to figure out how to mound a silencer under the pannier...

 

[Schtum]

So, I guess my question's boiling down to "what else would a dyno run give it?"

All bikes are slightly different and can have slightly different fuelling requirements. So running yours on the dyno under load would enable a skilled operator to optimise your bike's fuelling requirements, regardless of what the figures on the map say. I'd have thought the main issue would be tuning out any flat spots and transitions between on and off throttle.

 

[Cook1e]

All bikes are slightly different and can have slightly different fuelling requirements. So running yours on the dyno under load would enable a skilled operator to optimise your bike's fuelling requirements, regardless of what the figures on the map say. I'd have thought the main issue would be tuning out any flat spots and transitions between on and off throttle.

OK, there's a guy not far from me in Malton who's supposed to be good. If I can ditch the cat, I'll go see him. Here's the reason I don't want to - the panniers are symmetrical and I modified the mounting frame.

 

[Schtum]

On the other hand, ride it and if you're happy with the performance and the fuel consumption, leave it as it is. What's important is how it feels to you when you ride it.....

 

[Cook1e]

On the other hand, ride it and if you're happy with the performance and the fuel consumption, leave it as it is. What's important is how it feels to you when you ride it.....

Agreed - I was just looking for any more easy gains that I might have missed. I'll see how it goes. Thanks for the advice, you've confirmed my understanding of how the thing works at least.

Cheers,

Ian

 

[Cook1e]

B*stard Thing's Coming Back Off!!!

Fitted Saturday, no problems, difficulties or issues, bike started first time, ran sweetly and aforementioned noticeable performance improvement. Came home, switched off, parked in garage exactly as normal.

Went to work in car yesterday for logistical reasons. Got bike out of garage this morning, tried to start.....

Turned over OK, wouldn't even fire

Battery on charge, will have a look tonight. Can't imagine what's wrong though, all connectors clean, firm and tidy, was running (better than) fine 3 days ago.

 

[Paul Young]

My 1150 was the development mule that Dynojet UK used when they started bringing in the PC3 units to the UK. I did a report for them that was posted here on the site & would second the idea of getting the bike dyno'd. They got a 10% increase in power/torque at 40% throttle opening. Perfect for overtaking.

You need to understand that 13.8:1 across the board isn't necessarily what you want. You can have it running economically (lean?) up to say, 75% throttle, but dump loads of fuel/air in when you want acceleration, like at 80% to WOT most of my riding s <30% throttle but I want it to take off when I ask it to. My CBR600RW riding friend can't keep up in the twisty, up/down roads & has to get up to 160 on the straights to catch up (IOM ). However I still average 45mpg most of the time.

YMMV

 

[Blackal]

Fitted Saturday, no problems, difficulties or issues, bike started first time, ran sweetly and aforementioned noticeable performance improvement. Came home, switched off, parked in garage exactly as normal.

Went to work in car yesterday for logistical reasons. Got bike out of garage this morning, tried to start.....

Turned over OK, wouldn't even fire

Battery on charge, will have a look tonight. Can't imagine what's wrong though, all connectors clean, firm and tidy, was running (better than) fine 3 days ago.

There can be an issue with starting on some PC-fitted bikes (do a google or look at Pelicanparts site). It has something to do with drop in voltage during cranking. Mine was only cured by ditching the Odyssey battery and going back to BMW (Odyssey characteristics are different from standard).

It could be that?

Al

 

[Cook1e]

My 1150 was the development mule that Dynojet UK used when they started bringing in the PC3 units to the UK. I did a report for them that was posted here on the site & would second the idea of getting the bike dyno'd. They got a 10% increase in power/torque at 40% throttle opening. Perfect for overtaking.

You need to understand that 13.8:1 across the board isn't necessarily what you want. You can have it running economically (lean?) up to say, 75% throttle, but dump loads of fuel/air in when you want acceleration, like at 80% to WOT most of my riding s <30% throttle but I want it to take off when I ask it to. My CBR600RW riding friend can't keep up in the twisty, up/down roads & has to get up to 160 on the straights to catch up (IOM ). However I still average 45mpg most of the time.
YMMV

Thanks Paul - yes, I saw your IoM video
You have started to answer my next question, which was the seeming conflict between the map and the 13.8:1 mixture setting - surely it can't do both at the same time, so there must somehow be a choice/balance.

So, I'll go & see the chap in Malton and talk to him:
http://dynobike.co.uk/

There can be an issue with starting on some PC-fitted bikes (do a google or look at Pelicanparts site). It has something to do with drop in voltage during cranking. Mine was only cured by ditching the Odyssey battery and going back to BMW (Odyssey characteristics are different from standard).

It could be that?

Al

Thanks Al, you're right it seems - after it had been charging while I was at work ,it started first time when I came home. I had suspected battery was dodgy, despite being new last year