Problem with BMW dealer work today- left bike very low on oil or empty - What thoughts?

_Jameswarren

_Jameswarren

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So today my bike went in for new tyres , valve clearance check and gearbox oil.
at BMW main dealer.
I was later told bike ready, so went and collected. Halfway home (4 miles away) oil light flashed at low revs, then went out when revs increased and when pulled up at home at tickover oil light and service light came on and flashing.
On checking there is no oil level visible in the sight glass and still isn't 2 hours later. I immediately rang the dealer who said really sorry bring it back and they will top up oil which should have been done when covers removed . they also said will reset service light. it wasn't even due a service as was done not so long ago but clearances and gearbox oil not done.
No way I'm driving it 8 miles without knowing oil level.
Wy thoughts are that its probably not very low and only registering at tickover when pressure low. Could any damage have been caused?
Also my worry is if that not done properly what else might not be.
They also didn't read their job card properly and changed the final drive oil. I didnt pay for that of course.
I do have a litre of the same oil I changed it with 6 months and 3000 miles ago.
Any thoughts?
 
I would email them and ask for them to collect the bike and check the work billed has been completed correctly. I would also make a formal complaint and ask them to underwrite any future problems caused by their malpractice. If the dealer is part of a group then escalate the matter to head office if the local branch fobs you off. Check to see if they are part of a trade body you can escalate matters to. BMW are unlikely to be interested as this a matter for the dealership but you could try. Do everything in writing, email best as they are time stamped. Stay calm and measured.
Best not to name the dealer until such time as the matter is resolved.
 
wessie said:
I would email them and ask for them to collect the bike and check the work billed has been completed correctly. I would also make a formal complaint and ask them to underwrite any future problems caused by their malpractice. If the dealer is part of a group then escalate the matter to head office if the local branch fobs you off. Check to see if they are part of a trade body you can escalate matters to. BMW are unlikely to be interested as this a matter for the dealership but you could try. Do everything in writing, email best as they are time stamped. Stay calm and measured.
Best not to name the dealer until such time as the matter is resolved.
Click to expand...
Do not be so sure that BMW Customer Service will not be interested in the matter , they were very interested when a certain dealership sold me a bike via the Approved Used Scheme that they forgot to take out the Approved Used Warranty on, then serviced it 1000 miles later and failed to notice the engine was f*cked with scored Nikasil bores . Said dealership consistently lied about the warranty being in place and the servicing ,however , on getting BMW UK involved they made the dealership fit a new crate engine at a total cost of over £7500.
Any shoddy workmanship during servicing or dodgy dealings by a franchised dealer that lead to bad publicity ultimately reflect badly on the UK franchise as a whole
 
Not a BMW, or a bike, but my dad drove home after a service on his car, and the same thing happened. He rang the dealer and they came out and topped it up to the right level and made sure nothing else was obviously wrong.
 
_Jameswarren said:
So today my bike went in for new tyres , valve clearance check and gearbox oil.
at BMW main dealer.
I was later told bike ready, so went and collected. Halfway home (4 miles away) oil light flashed at low revs, then went out when revs increased and when pulled up at home at tickover oil light and service light came on and flashing.
On checking there is no oil level visible in the sight glass and still isn't 2 hours later. I immediately rang the dealer who said really sorry bring it back and they will top up oil which should have been done when covers removed . they also said will reset service light. it wasn't even due a service as was done not so long ago but clearances and gearbox oil not done.
No way I'm driving it 8 miles without knowing oil level.
Wy thoughts are that its probably not very low and only registering at tickover when pressure low. Could any damage have been caused?
Also my worry is if that not done properly what else might not be.
They also didn't read their job card properly and changed the final drive oil. I didnt pay for that of course.
I do have a litre of the same oil I changed it with 6 months and 3000 miles ago.
Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
Thank god I had mecano kit as a kid and learnt lefty loose ,righty tightly .
And never never let these numpty,s loose on my hard fort machines.
How hard can an oil and filter change be?
The old Haynes manuals suggested very basic level of competency?
 
_Jameswarren said:
So today my bike went in for new tyres , valve clearance check and gearbox oil.
at BMW main dealer.
Click to expand...

if its an air cooled bike the gearbox is a separate component and does not share its oil with the engine
and the valve clearance check will not allow enough engine oil to escape that you can measure the difference - unless some moron had it on the side stand when left valve cover came off...

so a low oil level would more likely be a result of your usage ? however after doing the valve clearances they had a duty to check the engine oil before handing back the bike

letting them clear up the situation will mean you will never know how low the oil level is - I would top it up to the correct level noting how much its takes... if its less than 1 litre and you where driving gently before the dealer work and the ride home - I would do an oil and filter change, check to see the colour of what comes out and likely and not care....

if it needs more than 2 litres and you have been ragging the bike about and now its a nasty colour and smell I'd worry - perhaps the guy was on autopilot and drained the engine oil - the light coming on is concerning
 
they should replace your entire engine and maybe just give you a new for old bike.

Shocking.
 
why are there 2 threads for this ?
ring the dealer , get the bike collected , go with the bike , never let it out of your sight , get them to fill it to the correct level . how short was it ?
 
botus said:
if its an air cooled bike the gearbox is a separate component and does not share its oil with the engine
and the valve clearance check will not allow enough engine oil to escape that you can measure the difference - unless some moron had it on the side stand when left valve cover came off...

so a low oil level would more likely be a result of your usage ? however after doing the valve clearances they had a duty to check the engine oil before handing back the bike

letting them clear up the situation will mean you will never know how low the oil level is - I would top it up to the correct level noting how much its takes... if its less than 1 litre and you where driving gently before the dealer work and the ride home - I would do an oil and filter change, check to see the colour of what comes out and likely and not care....

if it needs more than 2 litres and you have been ragging the bike about and now its a nasty colour and smell I'd worry - perhaps the guy was on autopilot and drained the engine oil - the light coming on is concerning
Click to expand...
Only 8 miles travelled on new tyres so like on egg shells. Wasn’t an oil change just valve clearances. Covers off which is only way oil lost. Oil check done on week preceding mid glass spot on.
Filling up in morning in small stages and if not up after a litre I will be on phone and they can collect.
Bike is 2012 Rallye TC. GS. 28,000
 
Oil might just be slightly under the sight glass, so no damage is done.
Get someone to help you tip the bike a little to the side while you check the level too.

The lost oil when removing the covers is minimal.

For the rest, what wessie said.
 
As a BMW tech at a main dealer, may I chirp in with an opinion...

Even the best technicians at the best dealers make mistakes. It's not a reason for anyone to loose their mind and make a huge fuss about it if the dealer is prepared to correct their mistakes and rectify the situation.

It happens !! Very rarely, but it does happen.

There is no one on this forum who in their professional life hasn't made an error at work due to a lapse of concentration. It doesn't mean they're an awful person or bad at their job. But I absolutely agree that you paid a premium price for what should be a premium service. And you have been let down.

If your bike didn't have enough oil in it, you would certainly know about it. I know what a bike sounds like with no oil in it. It's not something you could ride through without noticing. Your oil pressure light went out which means that you certainly had enough oil in it to prevent any kind of damage. Have you checked the level on the center stand ? There is only about 500ml difference between an empty sight glass and a full one. It sounds like you have an older hex head. So I'd be even less worried again.

The process to replace oil is to 90% fill it up, run the bike for a minute to prime the pump and tensioners and then top it up. My guess is that the tech forgot the second stage for some reason. Or maybe he used a measured amount with an inaccurate oil jug. Or perhaps the autofill feature on their oil pump was set incorrectly. It happens !! Although it should have been checked before handover.

I do believe you're within your rights to ask for the bike to be collected and the service to be checked over thoroughly. That's what we would do if it happened at our place.

The chances are that the tech will be mortified at the error. But your bike will be just fine.
 
MotoRevive said:
As a BMW tech at a main dealer, may I chirp in with an opinion...

Even the best technicians at the best dealers make mistakes. It's not a reason for anyone to loose their mind and make a huge fuss about it if the dealer is prepared to correct their mistakes and rectify the situation.

It happens !! Very rarely, but it does happen.

There is no one on this forum who in their professional life hasn't made an error at work due to a lapse of concentration. It doesn't mean they're an awful person or bad at their job. But I absolutely agree that you paid a premium price for what should be a premium service. And you have been let down.

If your bike didn't have enough oil in it, you would certainly know about it. I know what a bike sounds like with no oil in it. It's not something you could ride through without noticing. Your oil pressure light went out which means that you certainly had enough oil in it to prevent any kind of damage. Have you checked the level on the center stand ? There is only about 500ml difference between an empty sight glass and a full one. It sounds like you have an older hex head. So I'd be even less worried again.

The process to replace oil is to 90% fill it up, run the bike for a minute to prime the pump and tensioners and then top it up. My guess is that the tech forgot the second stage for some reason. Or maybe he used a measured amount with an inaccurate oil jug. Or perhaps the autofill feature on their oil pump was set incorrectly. It happens !! Although it should have been checked before handover.

I do believe you're within your rights to ask for the bike to be collected and the service to be checked over thoroughly. That's what we would do if it happened at our place.

The chances are that the tech will be mortified at the error. But your bike will be just fine.
Click to expand...
NIce one and pretty much my thoughts as well as I was just going to post

As a By the By

James When did you last check your bikes oil level ?

Was the bike booked for an oil / filter change or just check the valve clearances ??

As above, He's absolutely right, there are 3.8 litres of oil inc filter on a Oil head / Hex head service

Plus the Oil pressure switches are notorious for giving up the ghost

It will be fine (y)
 
MotoRevive said:
As a BMW tech at a main dealer, may I chirp in with an opinion...


If your bike didn't have enough oil in it, you would certainly know about it. I know what a bike sounds like with no oil in it. It's not something you could ride through without noticing. Your oil pressure light went out which means that you certainly had enough oil in it to prevent any kind of damage.
Click to expand...

I'm uncomfortable with the words you have chosen - any manu courses on engines you can ask to go on ?

the oil pressure light is a dim witted joke - it can extinguish with a vaguely intermittent 5 to 6 psi of oil pressure - which we can get with less than 1/2 ltr of hideously overheated and totally destroyed engine oil almost circulating - (in such a situation it of course means almost certainly it would have severe engine damage)

one of the main purposes of having the quanitiy of oil the manu recommends in there, is to allow engine and its own oil to cool down sufficently - old world oils would rapidly self destruct at 200C, posh synthetics can survive up to 320C for short periods... When we can have the botton of the piston crown at 600C easily, it takes very little for an engine under high stress to overheat oil when there is dramatically too little in there... (it is after all why engines always go bang on motorways... about 30 seconds after the first glimpse of an oil light)

as for the OP I think he suggested it took 1 ltr - in which case its likley fine if he was going gently for the last few hundred miles... I also hate the idea (and the posts here advising to hand it back) asking a dealership to cover over the mess - the correct solution as I posted last night, is for the owner to understand what's happened and make informed chocies not for a dealer to throw 3 litres of oil in a trashed engine and jetwash the bike

The oil level check should be done on the main stand, 30 seconds to 90 seconds after turning the bike off - or the oil cooler and its pipes volume may be in the incorrect place - hot or cold makes little difference - but the idea is to have the correct level at normal operating temps - so there's a clue for pedantic types !
 
Last edited:
botus said:
I'm uncomfortable with the words you have chosen - any manu courses on engines you can ask to go on ?

the oil pressure light is a dim witted joke - it can extinguish with a vaguely intermittent 5 to 6 psi of oil pressure - which we can get with less than 1/2 ltr of hideously overheated and totally destroyed engine oil almost circulating - (in such a situation it of course means almost certainly it would have severe engine damage)

one of the main purposes of having the quanitiy of oil the manu recommends in there, is to allow engine and its own oil to cool down sufficently - old world oils would rapidly self destruct at 200C, posh synthetics can survive up to 320C for short periods... When we can have the botton of the piston crown at 600C easily, it takes very little for an engine under high stress to overheat oil when there is dramatically too little in there... (it is after all why engines always go bang on motorways... about 30 seconds after the first glimpse of an oil light)

as for the OP I think he suggested it took 1 ltr - in which case its likley fine if he was going gently for the last few hundred miles... I also hate the idea (and the posts here advising to hand it back) asking a dealership to cover over the mess - the correct solution as I posted last night, is for the owner to understand what's happened and make informed chocies not for a dealer to throw 3 litres of oil in a trashed engine and jetwash the bike

The oil level check should be done on the main stand, 30 seconds to 90 seconds after turning the bike off - or the oil cooler and its pipes volume may be in the incorrect place - hot or cold makes little difference - but the idea is to have the correct level at normal operating temps - so there's a clue for pedantic types !
Click to expand...
I've done many engine courses thank you. For BMW, Suzuki , Kawasaki etc. I've rebuild, tuned and modified thousands of engines over the last 25 years.

You're obviously the pedantic tyre. No doubt you'll come back and say "I'm an engineer". Or I used to do this or that. Or you're another expert of some other type. But you just sound like a forum troll. With a workshop manual open in front of you so you can quote numbers and try to look intelligent. I've met plenty of people like you. Bore off !!

But by your reply I already know you're talking out of your arse and have very little real world experience. You'd literally be laughed out of any workshop.

I admit I didn't fully read his post and assumed he'd had an oil and filter service too. But you didn't either because he hasn't said he's put any oil in it yet. Or even checked it properly.

He's had his valves done. So the covers removed. A job i've done literally THOUSANDS of times. You may loose half a liter from both the cases if they're removed when the oil is hot. Far less if the engine was cold.

I didn't say his bike was fine. I said it was likely to be. I've seen his generation of bike run for thousands of miles with far less oil in it. The pump scavenge draws from far less than full fill.

What do you suggest ? The dealer buys him a new engine because it's half a litre down ? Maybe he should write to his MP. Oprah might want to do an interview...

Get a grip...
 
botus said:
I'm uncomfortable with the words you have chosen - any manu courses on engines you can ask to go on ?

the oil pressure light is a dim witted joke - it can extinguish with a vaguely intermittent 5 to 6 psi of oil pressure - which we can get with less than 1/2 ltr of hideously overheated and totally destroyed engine oil almost circulating - (in such a situation it of course means almost certainly it would have severe engine damage)

one of the main purposes of having the quanitiy of oil the manu recommends in there, is to allow engine and its own oil to cool down sufficently - old world oils would rapidly self destruct at 200C, posh synthetics can survive up to 320C for short periods... When we can have the botton of the piston crown at 600C easily, it takes very little for an engine under high stress to overheat oil when there is dramatically too little in there... (it is after all why engines always go bang on motorways... about 30 seconds after the first glimpse of an oil light)

as for the OP I think he suggested it took 1 ltr - in which case its likley fine if he was going gently for the last few hundred miles... I also hate the idea (and the posts here advising to hand it back) asking a dealership to cover over the mess - the correct solution as I posted last night, is for the owner to understand what's happened and make informed chocies not for a dealer to throw 3 litres of oil in a trashed engine and jetwash the bike

The oil level check should be done on the main stand, 30 seconds to 90 seconds after turning the bike off - or the oil cooler and its pipes volume may be in the incorrect place - hot or cold makes little difference - but the idea is to have the correct level at normal operating temps - so there's a clue for pedantic types !
Click to expand...
Seriously?? Do you actually Do vehicle maintenance Daily as a job ??

OR are you a Book Mechanic ?? You quote the manual!! There are so many of those type of people out there

Whereas Moto and myself could look at something and say Hmm Not Good! Yup thats on spec for torque etc etc

Owners Manuals are written as GUIDES not absolute Procedure!

AND I think the original Owners manual for an F650GS does not even tell you the proper procedure to check the engine oil level!!
 
Why not simply try the ZEN approach to peace of mind and personally do an oil and filter change at home :nenau ?

If you actually KNOW the correct volume of oil you need for an oil and filter change AND you've put in the correct volume, surely that should put your mind at rest, no? Just saying!
 
Me personally i would have rang the dealer and complained, then topped the oil up myself.
it takes seconds.

If you choose to then ride it to the dealer for a check up, its up to you.
you could argue for a full oil change i suppose, and reimbursing for the oil you bought?
 
MotoRevive said:
As a BMW tech at a main dealer, may I chirp in with an opinion...

Even the best technicians at the best dealers make mistakes. It's not a reason for anyone to loose their mind and make a huge fuss about it if the dealer is prepared to correct their mistakes and rectify the situation.

It happens !! Very rarely, but it does happen.

There is no one on this forum who in their professional life hasn't made an error at work due to a lapse of concentration. It doesn't mean they're an awful person or bad at their job. But I absolutely agree that you paid a premium price for what should be a premium service. And you have been let down.

If your bike didn't have enough oil in it, you would certainly know about it. I know what a bike sounds like with no oil in it. It's not something you could ride through without noticing. Your oil pressure light went out which means that you certainly had enough oil in it to prevent any kind of damage. Have you checked the level on the center stand ? There is only about 500ml difference between an empty sight glass and a full one. It sounds like you have an older hex head. So I'd be even less worried again.

The process to replace oil is to 90% fill it up, run the bike for a minute to prime the pump and tensioners and then top it up. My guess is that the tech forgot the second stage for some reason. Or maybe he used a measured amount with an inaccurate oil jug. Or perhaps the autofill feature on their oil pump was set incorrectly. It happens !! Although it should have been checked before handover.

I do believe you're within your rights to ask for the bike to be collected and the service to be checked over thoroughly. That's what we would do if it happened at our place.

The chances are that the tech will be mortified at the error. But your bike will be just fine.
Click to expand...
Err….I thought the dealer HADN’T changed the oil? I’m getting well confused on these threads..
 
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