Reassurance needed following a scare

[AberdeenAngus]

Had an interesting chat with the bobby responsible for RTA stats for Grampian.
Asked him about the main contributing causes of motorcycle RTAs.
He said excess speed, poor positioning especially at junctions and inappropriate overtaking.
If you remove those totally avoidable causes, the stats come right down.
Conclusion....don't ride like a twat and you'll (probably) be ok.

 

[Packer]

...................... yesterday in my 3 and a half tonne van some dame just pulled out of the side road with nary a glance my way ....................

Shame you couldn't have T-boned her, she may have been a more careful driver in the future and you may have saved some other poor sod on a bike from a lot of pain.

 

[Schtum]

He said excess speed,

Well he would, wouldn't he. That's the easy mantra for the uninformed and it wasn't borne out by the last TRL/DETR survey which concluded that excessive speed was a major causal factor in only 6 to 7% of serious accidents. That was then talked up and spun by the Government of the day to be a cause of one third of serious accidents.

 

[Timolgra]

Well he would, wouldn't he. That's the easy mantra for the uninformed and it wasn't borne out by the last TRL/DETR survey which concluded that excessive speed was a major causal factor in only 6 to 7% of serious accidents. That was then talked up and spun by the Government of the day to be a cause of one third of serious accidents.

Yes that may be true, but what if you asked a random 100 riders who'd had a variety of accidents....

"With hindsight, would you still have been travelling at the same speed or slightly less in the few seconds before your accident?"

And that then raises the question, why were you still travelling too quickly?

 

[Schtum]

Yes that may be true, but what if you asked a random 100 riders who'd had a variety of accidents....

"With hindsight, would you still have been travelling at the same speed or slightly less in the few seconds before your accident?"

And that then raises the question, why were you still travelling too quickly?

Retrospective misattribution of causation.

 

[PhaedrusMC]

Don't most folk speed cos it's fun?

Speed alone is probably rarely a causal factor in accidents. Of course it compounds things once they go wrong, but only when they go wrong. And isn't it usually someone else's gobshitery that causes the accident? Where a bike is traveling 10mph over the limit when the gobshite pulls out into his path, yes - speed was a factor, but it wasn't causal. The causal factor was gobshitery. Speeding yourself into a bush is different - that's your own gobshitery.

Too easy to label speed as causal and create support for slapping fines on speeders, but the real - actual - causes of accidents are just let slide...

IMO, time with an instructor will help - they'll see to it that you're back on track as a confident rider. You'll come away confident, having been certified by a professional as competent, skilled, observant, etc. Treat yourself.

 

[ymfb]

To the OP, if you carry on get some advanced training with the IAM or RoSPA. Bike safe is better than nothing but it's a snapshot. Advanced training takes time, in terms of cost it's very little compared with what you get out.

You might even find yourself getting out more as most local groups do regular ride outs.

 

[Reggie P]

Affair, some pretty stupid and vile responses on here (sadly).

Apart from Mr K... jeez, what a sad event . So sorry for you and your buddy ( RIP). Words fail me.


OP ..You made an interesting post and it deserves a sensible dialogue. ( just ignore the crap?)

I think, after seeing your injured work colleague, its natural to feel the way you do.

Stick with the bike though. If you are well trained, the risks are conterbalanced by "feeling good" and to be honest, motorcycling is a good way of reducing stress.

I dont know how old you are but , there was even a respeceted Japanese study that showed how motorcycling helps you retain conitive and motor skills till later years in life.
It can be good for you ! I know both motorcycling and cycling ( I do quite a few 100 mile cycle events) are considered bloody dangerous, but both in different ways are good for me! I'm most worried about being hit on my cycle though , when compared to the GS.

Most motorcycle accidents are single vehicle. In other words most riders actually get themeselves into hot water through errors or excessive speed.
Have a look at the way some riders ride and see why the statistics are so poor?

When you ride , you can make the judgements. You can mitigate.

As to your wife and the new counter tops; ... Only you can figure this. Do you have kids? How much does your wife earn? How much do you earn ? Are you paying stupid amounts in interest on the bike? How much do you actually spend on yourself? How stressful is your job? Is a GS going to depreciate much? Do you spend a lot on Beer/fags? Has your family had a decent holiday in the last year? All these factors come into play! Most of us keep things in balance. You have to be careful not to let your wife chose how ALL the money is spent otherwise resentment builds up and before you know it the marriage is over. The same is true that if you spend all the spare cash on yourself while she scrimps/scrapes and spends little on herself then that is also bad !

Well done for verbalising your anxiety, its only human. I hope you are able to get some sunny days on the GS with your friends.

 

[Afmuir]

Right folks, have thought about this quite a bit since I posted, and thanks again for all the comments.
It was hellish what happened to the colleague I saw, but I don't know the real circumstances, and so many unexpected things could happen to us every day of the week. You add a bit more risk being on a bike, and a bit more if you drive stupidly. I am quite aware of that and I am ok accepting that slight increased risk for the benefits I get out of it. I believe I am a safe biker but I am going to take up the suggestions made by many of additional training. That's a good idea for anyone and something I have been meaning to do.
Bike was due to be delivered yesterday but because of snow has been postponed, and I am realising that I would really miss not having one. It makes me feel a bit different from the masses trudging through their day-day, it gives me freedom and a feeling of being alive. That's a benefit well worth that slight risk, which I will manage to the best of my abilities.
Thanks again folks. Normal service resumed.

 

[columbus]

It takes a fall from 3 feet to crack the human skull. How tall are you?

 

[Davel]

Had an eye operation about 14 months ago which took a bit of getting used to and lost some confidence because of it, so much so that I toyed with giving up biking.

Like you. I'd miss it too much so I've booked to do the Rospa course soon to boost my skills.

Generally I'm fine but it has slowed me down.

 

[ianboydsnr]

I had a mate die last March, riding up to a weekend event organised by me, spoke to him on the phone not more than 20 minutes before, there were two other mates following and it was a head on collision, he lost a leg, but was dead before he hit the ground, the car he hit was completely innocent, and no one can explain him crossing the road, he was a safe rider and the conditions were perfect,

It did put a dampener on the weekend, but it still went ahead, minus the people directly involved,

I did discus it with my wife, but my decision was that if I died or was seriously injured, then so be it, I have to die sometime and that I would continue as I always have,

This year we are doing a run in memory of my friend around his area, and involving his family!

 

[Engineer]

Hi
I have just bought an 800GS after a lot of looking around and because I just got the bug about wanting one. I sold my f650gs thumper to help finance but still needed to put a few thou to. It's money I could do other things with, like new kitchen counters according to my wife. It's getting delivered on Sat.
Today I met a guy through work who I had heard had had a nasty bike accident, and I'd only ever spoken to him on phone before. Today I met him. He had one leg, left arm in sling with no future use. Broke neck, hip,pelvis, had a stroke. He was doing 35 and taken out by an overtaking car that didn't see him. I was shocked seeing him.
I know it's risky and we still do it, but it did make me wonder what I'm doing. I didn't tell my wife.
So, please make me feel better!

Motorcycles are dangerous give up now on the other hand I have been riding since I was 18 and haven't broken anything, had a sprained wrist when I went into the back of a car because I was looking at a girl instead of the road, I was 20 years old at the time and a bruise on my hip because an American tourist in a hire car forgot what side of the road he was supposed to be driving on, that was about 3 years ago - I am 60 next birthday

 

[B Murr]

Life really is for living but there are sensible precautions as mentioned earlier. If you ride with caution in such a way that you will be able to deal with the unexpected such as a pile of horse shit on road around that bend, or someone pulling out in front of you I think you will have nailed down the risk levels. I still exercise some of those little hints I was given during motorycle lessons 30 years ago, things such as watching the front wheel of a car waiting on sideroad and the drivers eyes to judge whether he is after seeing me or whether his wheels have started moving( you'll distinguish the wheels turning better than the whole car moving). You could get maimed or killed doing the simplest of things while out and about and if you just sat in your armchair something else will slowly kill you. We have evolved as hunters with a hunters instincts so can at times revert back into primitive brain mode and go off speeding through the world ( giving chase) which of course feels great, just keep the thinking brain on and you should be having a better experience. I think age does open your eyes to the danger that is around you and I remember getting spooked a few times riding around londons A406 with realisation that one slip of the wheel and I'd be under the wheels of the lorry I was overtaking in which case it would be all over.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[G&T]

Hi Afmuir, good comments already made, but let me leave you with this nugget.

"If you think adventure is dangerous, you should try boredom; it's a killer." Enjoy what you do and tell others of your adventures.

Get the extra training if you can. In simple terms it will raise your awareness. As we inevitably get older our responses slow, so that improvement will raise your game and reduce your risk.

 

[RedRick Esq.]

Well he would, wouldn't he. That's the easy mantra for the uninformed and it wasn't borne out by the last TRL/DETR survey which concluded that excessive speed was a major causal factor in only 6 to 7% of serious accidents. That was then talked up and spun by the Government of the day to be a cause of one third of serious accidents.

Yes that may be true, but what if you asked a random 100 riders who'd had a variety of accidents....

"With hindsight, would you still have been travelling at the same speed or slightly less in the few seconds before your accident?"

And that then raises the question, why were you still travelling too quickly?

To raise the bar a little here

Speed will always be causal when it is greater than the cognition of the driver or rider. F1 drivers and Moro GP riders work on a level incomprehensible to the everyday fast driver.

It will be casual when the rider is operating well within his speed cognition even though above the posted speed limit.

The hard part of course is staying within your own limits and even harder to know where they are


Does that make any sense

 

[GreatScot]

To raise the bar a little here

Speed will always be causal when it is greater than the cognition of the driver or rider. F1 drivers and Moro GP riders work on a level incomprehensible to the everyday fast driver.

It will be casual when the rider is operating well within his speed cognition even though above the posted speed limit.

The hard part of course is staying within your own limits and even harder to know where they are


Does that make any sense

Possibly in Doncaster

 

[Timolgra]

The hard part of course is staying within your own limits and even harder to know where they are


Does that make any sense

Sure does "And that then raises the question, why were you still travelling too quickly?", what I'm suggesting is, a rider should improve whilst constantly asking this question...... and of course having the skills to react to the answer.

Anyway, where's f'kin Doncaster?

 

[RedRick Esq.]

Sure does "And that then raises the question, why were you still travelling too quickly?", what I'm suggesting is, a rider should improve whilst constantly asking this question...... and of course having the skills to react to the answer.

Anyway, where's f'kin Doncaster?

I agree with that its just the argument of speed is the cause or not as the case may be will rage on for ever. Sense of speed or lack of it does not always help either.
I for example never ever feel that i am going fast until i am going very fast or possibly too fast and is something i constantly have to keep in check ( that would be my learning and adapting bit)

Doncaster is in a dark and dangerous part of England and you wouldn't like it.

Have you done the XT firmware update ?

 

[Schtum]

Speed will always be causal when it is greater than the cognition of the driver or rider.

No it won't. It will only be causal when it's a primary cause in some kind of incident. You can only stretch your level of ability by continually pushing the envelope.

There's far too many slow people on the bloody roads and it's getting worse. The arts of riding a bike and driving a car have been dumbed down so much that there are quite literally millions of vehicle operators who wouldn't know what to do if their vehicles accidentally "skidded", let alone have the ability to induce a controlled slide, tighten their line with a bit of left foot braking or similarly on a bike, tighten the line in a corner with a bit of judicious rear brake. Far too many people who are petrified of overtaking and sit in crocodiles of cars pottering along at 45 mph.

The world's a better place in the sweet spot that starts at 60 mph on a twisty, bumpy goat track and reaches to c. 130 mph on a flowing A road.