Rough starting this evening. Battery or other issue?

[mr_magicfingers]

Hi,

Yesterday I had the battery on charge all day via the optimate. Started on the button this morning. This evening it just didn't want to start, eventually running the battery down. Managed to get a jump start but even with that it was tough getting it started and rough running once it was, seemed like it was just running on one cylinder for a while then with much revving it started running properly. I gave it a good blatt up the motorway on the way home and it seems to be running fine.

Bike is recently serviced, I've kept the heated stuff off on the way home. I'm planning to replace the battery as I think it's near the end of it's life but the rough running when it started worried me.

Bike had the alarm immobiliser taken off at the weekend (done professionally), could that have affected anything at all, or does this just sound like a low battery issue and the alternator perhaps not getting enough current to the plugs until it had been running for a little while?

Can't leave it on optimate overnight, don't have power in the garage.

Thanks,

Justin.

 

[MattW]

When the immobiliser was removed, did they remove the tank to get to it?...

 

[mr_magicfingers]

When the immobiliser was removed, did they remove the tank to get to it?...

Yes, it was in the space by the battery.

 

[MattW]

Yes, it was in the space by the battery.

It's worth checking the throttle cable seating - easily disturbed when the tank is removed and often the cause of unexplained rough running after some work has been carried out (although given that it ran ok at times I'm not so sure it'll be this - easy to check though).

 

[Timolgra]

:greg

 

[mr_magicfingers]

It's worth checking the throttle cable seating - easily disturbed when the tank is removed and often the cause of unexplained rough running after some work has been carried out (although given that it ran ok at times I'm not so sure it'll be this - easy to check though).

Are those where the cables attach to the throttle bodies. Sorry to ask but I'm not heading out the garage again tonight.

Cheers,

 

[Pekkavee]

Are those where the cables attach to the throttle bodies. Sorry to ask but I'm not heading out the garage again tonight.

Cheers,

Yes

Pekka

 

[MattW]

Yep - as in the pic above.

 

[motobiker]

Seems unlikely that its the throttle cable seating.... the giveaway being:

I gave it a good blatt up the motorway on the way home and it seems to be running fine.

that wouldn't be the case with the throttle cables unseated. Nor would it affect starting much.. the engine would simply run really badly.

Sounds far more likely the battery is on its last legs.

Its a failing in the Optimate.. it can show the battery to be fine (steady green light) even though it's near death... these things aren't as clever as their blurb would have us believe.

Incidentally.. just noticed Motobins are doing OEM Exide Gel batteries cheaper than Motorworks.. £67.85 (inc. VAT) as opposed to £70.50

 

[MattW]

Seems unlikely that its the throttle cable seating.... the giveaway being:

that wouldn't be the case with the throttle cables unseated. Nor would it affect starting much.. the engine would simply run really badly.

True (as I mentioned above), but always worth while checking in the event of rough running after tank removal. Incidentally, mine was a complete sod to start when I had the throttle cable issue - popped and banged and ran on one cylinder, however it cleaned up and ran ok at sustained highish revs (understandably I suppose as the missmatch in throttle openings will have much less effect off idle).

Sounds far more likely the battery is on its last legs.

Its a failing in the Optimate.. it can show the battery to be fine (steady green light) even though it's near death... these things aren't as clever as their blurb would have us believe.

Incidentally.. just noticed Motobins are doing OEM Exide Gel batteries cheaper than Motorworks.. £67.85 as opposed to £70.50

Optimates are far from clever (the same for my Ctek). Once a battery has been flattened its capacity has been irrevocably reduced - an Optimate doesn't know the intended capacity of a battery, it just uses the charge curve to judge when to change charging modes. If the battery has a reduced capacity it will still use the charge curve and charge it nicely to its reduced capacity.

 

[mr_magicfingers]

Thanks for the help, throttle cables were fine this morning but I'll know to check them each time I remove the tank from now on. Bile started on the button today so sounds like battery issue. Going to order another as I think it's a few years old.

 

[MattW]

Thanks for the help, throttle cables were fine this morning but I'll know to check them each time I remove the tank from now on. Bile started on the button today so sounds like battery issue. Going to order another as I think it's a few years old.

Glad it seems to be running ok Shame about the battery, but at least its easy (but unfortunately not that cheap) to fix it.

 

[Timolgra]

Managed to get a jump start but even with that it was tough getting it started and rough running once it was, seemed like it was just running on one cylinder for a while then with much revving it started running properly. I gave it a good blatt up the motorway on the way home and it seems to be running fine.

or does this just sound like a low battery issue and the alternator perhaps not getting enough current to the plugs until it had been running for a little while?


.

I think you're setting some red herrings for yourself

 

[Packer]

Thanks for the help, throttle cables were fine this morning but I'll know to check them each time I remove the tank from now on. Bile started on the button today so sounds like battery issue. Going to order another as I think it's a few years old.

An auto electrician can test the battery but if its several years old he might just say its tired and then you've got his cost as well as the new battery.

Mine is still on the original battery at 58,000 miles and over 6 years.

Check that the battery terminals are corrosion free and tight as I nearly replaced the battery at 2 years due to starting issues only to find that it was just a loose terminal connection.

 

[sproggy]

I think you're setting some red herrings for yourself

Agreed. If there's enough juice in the battery to turn the engine over and start it then there's plenty to keep it running properly. If it wasn't running right I don't believe the battery was at fault.

Get it checked before you shell out on a new one.

 

[motobiker]

Agreed. If there's enough juice in the battery to turn the engine over and start it then there's plenty to keep it running properly. If it wasn't running right I don't believe the battery was at fault.

Get it checked before you shell out on a new one.

Incorrect.

It's not the battery that keeps a bike running - once started.

And so the 'red herring' is (I believe) the OP bringing the Alternator into the list of culprits. If that was at fault too the bike simply wouldn't run at all.

Because it's the alternator.. and NOT the battery that's running the bike.

I'm guessing Mr magic fingers doesn't have ABS on his bike... because if he did. I would bet that he would be having major start-up faults with that too... which, again; is a sure sign the Battery is goosed.

Check that the battery terminals are corrosion free and tight as I nearly replaced the battery at 2 years due to starting issues only to find that it was just a loose terminal connection.

Possible.. though unlikely; as this is at least one fault the Optimate is capable of recognising.. and would show a 'red light' fault.

Check by all means. Its easily prevented by application of some battery terminal grease.

 

[mr_magicfingers]

Battery terminals are both cleAn and tight. I'm going to get a new battery as the bike's 10 years old and the battery looks original. No ABS on my bike but the clock has occasionally been resetting itself during starting which I've read is another sign of a failing battery. Will find out next week when I replace it.

Thanks for all the help.

 

[sproggy]

Incorrect.

It's not the battery that keeps a bike running - once started.

And so the 'red herring' is (I believe) the OP bringing the Alternator into the list of culprits. If that was at fault too the bike simply wouldn't run at all.

Because it's the alternator.. and NOT the battery that's running the bike.

No, you are incorrect. Go out and take your alternator belt off and then start the bike - it will run fine. It's called a total loss system. Sure, you need the alternator to keep the bike running for any length of time (to stop the battery being drained by the fuel pump, ignition etc) but the alternator very definitely does not 'run the bike' to the point where its absence from the system causes an instant engine stop.

 

[Miz]

Incorrect.

It's not the battery that keeps a bike running - once started.

And so the 'red herring' is (I believe) the OP bringing the Alternator into the list of culprits. If that was at fault too the bike simply wouldn't run at all.

Because it's the alternator.. and NOT the battery that's running the bike.

I'm guessing Mr magic fingers doesn't have ABS on his bike... because if he did. I would bet that he would be having major start-up faults with that too... which, again; is a sure sign the Battery is goosed.



Possible.. though unlikely; as this is at least one fault the Optimate is capable of recognising.. and would show a 'red light' fault.

Check by all means. Its easily prevented by application of some battery terminal grease.

So, reading the above, if the alternator belt breaks then the bike stops

 

[cookie]

So, reading the above, if the alternator belt breaks then the bike stops

not straight away.

the battery powers the bike. the alternator tops up the battery. it's a bit like the cold water tank in your loft getting topped up by the mains.