Schuberth vs BMW System

[snerkler]

HI,
So I'm having a total rethink on my helmet. I was considering a dual sport, but am really concerned about the noise on the road. As my off road excursions will be few and far between I thought I'd be better off looking at a good quiet road helmet, and maybe just buying a cheap enduro one for the few times I go off road.

Anyway, due to me wanting a quiet helmet I've now been looking at Schuberths and BMW's System range. From what I can gather the Shuberth C3 is nearly Identical to the System 6, although apparantly the C3 feels better quality and the flip fits better. Any opinions on this?

I'm not a great fan of flip fronts, although it would never stop me buying one if the fit was good and noise level good, so have also been looking at the S1 Pro. Is this virtually the same lid as BMW's Sport helmet http://www.bmw-motorrad.co.uk/media/pdf/rider-equipment-2010.pdf
or a totally different lid altogether? How do they stack up against each other as far as noise and peripheral vision goes?

And finally, why are the BMW ones such drab colours?

Cheers

 

[davidgibson999]

Not sure about the price difference but I've had a Schuberth C3 since Oct 09 and I'm a convert. Always had Arai full face helmets and Tour X and the C3 is much quieter (although with the flip front down it might be hot in summer?) and really well made. Highly recommended.

 

[snerkler]

Went to BMW today, and the guy said that Schuberth Helmets are better than the System ones. Nice to have some honesty.

Anyway, I managed to try on a Schuberth S1, and S1 Pro today, but they only had XL in both. The S1 fitted lovely, but the S1 pro was too big. The lady said you need a size smaller for the S1 pro compared to the S1. Even though the S1 Pro was too big so I can't say for sure, it didn't feel as 'plush' as the S1.

So, apart from the pinlock visor on the pro, and the different location of the sunvisor control are there any other major differences? Mainly I'm thinking noise, weight, and vision?

Can you fit a pinlock S1 pro visor to the S1?

 

[bose]

visor

Went to BMW today, and the guy said that Schuberth Helmets are better than the System ones. Nice to have some honesty.

Anyway, I managed to try on a Schuberth S1, and S1 Pro today, but they only had XL in both. The S1 fitted lovely, but the S1 pro was too big. The lady said you need a size smaller for the S1 pro compared to the S1. Even though the S1 Pro was too big so I can't say for sure, it didn't feel as 'plush' as the S1.

So, apart from the pinlock visor on the pro, and the different location of the sunvisor control are there any other major differences? Mainly I'm thinking noise, weight, and vision?

Can you fit a pinlock S1 pro visor to the S1?

yep s1 pro visor fits s1 but although ace helmet they still leak through the top of visor in rainy conditions

 

[snerkler]

yep s1 pro visor fits s1 but although ace helmet they still leak through the top of visor in rainy conditions

Is that the S1 or S1 pro or both?

 

[Andy B]

Snerkler - only just spotted your post but I'd like to make some comments if it's not too late. I've been a flip convert for many years. My first was a Caberg but went to the current Shoei Multitec when it came out.

Due to a recent accident I've had to buy a new one and after much research settled for the BMW System 6. What a disappointment! Visor wouldn't shut properly (although this is a known fault and can be rectified by the dealer - but why was it ever sold without the upgrade?!). However, the biggest issue I've had with it is air leaking thorugh the front vent on the top (which means water must be able to get in too). BMW say its not faulty - just the way it is. I did a 100 mile trip and had a VERY cold patch on the front of my head. Admittedly, ambient temperature was probably 4 - 5 degrees but work out the wind chill factor at 70 mph! It's now the subject of a warranty claim. I geninely believe it's not fit for purpose - although I admit I've not come across anyone else who has had this problem.

Because I was helmetless I borrowed my mate's Schuberth C2 thinking quality, quiet, comfortable. Quality - yes. Comfort - yes. But not that quiet.

The other issue I had with both the Schuberth and the System 6 was the amount of wind turbulence around the bottom of the helmet - just generally annoying.

I also weighed all three helmets - all almost exactly the same within 10g (despite what teh sales blurb says).

Last but not least problem with Schuberth/BMW was that I didn't find the field of view as good as the Multitec. The shape of these also made it harder to turn the head as far as you could to do life savers.

I am very definitely of the opinion that the Shoei is best. It is quieter. Better field of view. Just as comfortable. No heavier. Well made (if maybe not quite as good as the Schuberth but the other factors out-weigh this in my mind). In fairness to the BMW/Schuberth the internal visor was great, but again, not enough to be the decider given the other issues.

Hope this helps.

 

[snerkler]

Snerkler - only just spotted your post but I'd like to make some comments if it's not too late. I've been a flip convert for many years. My first was a Caberg but went to the current Shoei Multitec when it came out.

Due to a recent accident I've had to buy a new one and after much research settled for the BMW System 6. What a disappointment! Visor wouldn't shut properly (although this is a known fault and can be rectified by the dealer - but why was it ever sold without the upgrade?!). However, the biggest issue I've had with it is air leaking thorugh the front vent on the top (which means water must be able to get in too). BMW say its not faulty - just the way it is. I did a 100 mile trip and had a VERY cold patch on the front of my head. Admittedly, ambient temperature was probably 4 - 5 degrees but work out the wind chill factor at 70 mph! It's now the subject of a warranty claim. I geninely believe it's not fit for purpose - although I admit I've not come across anyone else who has had this problem.

Because I was helmetless I borrowed my mate's Schuberth C2 thinking quality, quiet, comfortable. Quality - yes. Comfort - yes. But not that quiet.

The other issue I had with both the Schuberth and the System 6 was the amount of wind turbulence around the bottom of the helmet - just generally annoying.

I also weighed all three helmets - all almost exactly the same within 10g (despite what teh sales blurb says).

Last but not least problem with Schuberth/BMW was that I didn't find the field of view as good as the Multitec. The shape of these also made it harder to turn the head as far as you could to do life savers.

I am very definitely of the opinion that the Shoei is best. It is quieter. Better field of view. Just as comfortable. No heavier. Well made (if maybe not quite as good as the Schuberth but the other factors out-weigh this in my mind). In fairness to the BMW/Schuberth the internal visor was great, but again, not enough to be the decider given the other issues.

Hope this helps.

Unfortunately I read this too late. This is the post I wrote on another thread :-

"Bought a C3 last week and my visor leaks also when fully clicked shut. Did a test today, gently poured some water over the helmet with visor clicked shut and it literally pours in through the visor, very very poor. Did the same test with my other lids, no problem.
I've found the venting very poor on the Schuberth, it fogs up really really bad, much worse than any other helmet I've worn, and it gives me ear pain. Although the higher pitch wind noise is very much reduced, I get much more buffeting and the 'booming' wind noise. Oh and it makes a horrible creaking noise when I turn my head to do lifesavers etc. The only good things I can say about the helmet is that the sunvisor is a great device.

Overall I am very very disappointed in this helmet, especially considering the cost. I am definately going to take this back, hoping to get a refund (not likely in the slightest), but at least getting the leaky visor sorted as it is I don't think it's fit for purpose, it's supposed to be a touring helmet. Who wants a touring helmet that lets water in?

I've since bought a Shoei XR 1100, very very nearly as quiet regarding the higher pitch wind noise, no booming, and a visor that doesn't leak. Feels much better quality overall as well. Only downside in the lack of sunvisor. Hopefully pinlock will bring out a hyper optik visor"

 

[Andy B]

Weird! Why should a manufacturer with such a good reputation give two random customers these problems?

One thing my mate showed me on his C2 (which I didn't take much notice of because I didn't think it was relevant at the time) was that you can play with the visor mechanism on the C2 so as to get more air through the front of the helmet via the visor.

As I say, I didn't take much notice but I was suprised by just how much wind came across my face. Is there any chance your C3 has a similar setup and that the visor has another setting to make it completely air/water tight?

 

[snerkler]

Weird! Why should a manufacturer with such a good reputation give two random customers these problems?

One thing my mate showed me on his C2 (which I didn't take much notice of because I didn't think it was relevant at the time) was that you can play with the visor mechanism on the C2 so as to get more air through the front of the helmet via the visor.

As I say, I didn't take much notice but I was suprised by just how much wind came across my face. Is there any chance your C3 has a similar setup and that the visor has another setting to make it completely air/water tight?

There is such a system, I think they call it "city setting" or something similar. Even with it fully closed it still leaks. Done a bit of searching around and apparently it's a common problem. Spoke to the dealer I bought the helmet from, and he said that Schuberth don't claim that they are water tight And they want to charge us over £400 for a helmet they are not claiming is water tight. Pretty poor that to say the least. I don't know how far I'll get but I am going to argue that it's not fit for purpose. Don't know how I'd stand legally though. I think if Schuberth are using this as an explanation it should clearly state this on their website. I wonder how many people would buy their helmets then?

 

[Andy B]

In Europe all Shoei helmets come with a graduated tinted visor whereas in the UK they are all supplied with a dark one. I managed to get the graduated one from a dealer in France (I think) and I found it a good comprise. It didn't completely negate the need for sun glasses in summertime but I found it well suited to most circumstances.

 

[Greybeard]

I recently bought a System 6 helmet to replace my Shoei Raid. Initial impressions are good, though I haven't ridden in the rain to test leakage or poured water over it.

I did find my glasses were steaming up with the visor down when the bike was static so I have fitted the lighter-weight chin guard extension which is slightly better, but I may remove it. The integrated sun visor works well - I've used it half down a couple of times to combat the sun when its low in the sky and it does help.

The System 6 seems quieter than the Shoei for urban riding... I've yet to try it at speed, and there is enough room round the ears so that is no excess pressure when I'm wearing earplugs.

As I got a discount from my local dealer it worked out about the same as a Shoie Raid 2.

My only gripe is that getting the helmet off is uncomfortable - as this is the first System helmet I've owned not sure if there is a special technique involved. Should the helmet come off forwards(reverse of putting on) or backwards?

 

[CaptainSlow]

Like an earlier poster I started off with a Caberg Trip but found this to be the noisiest helmet ever and it felt cheap and nasty, so I went to a non flip Shoei Raid 2 which proved to be an excellent helmet. It was waterproof (provided you closed the top air vent obviously), the pinlock visor kept it clear once underway and it was comfortable with both a bluetooth set, a radio earpiece and a video-mike fitted. I now need to change it following a head/ground interface last week and was thinking of a "quality" flip front" such as the System 6 or the Shuberth C2/C3. Judging by the above posts neither of these helmets is any real improvement on my Raid 2 despite costing more than £100 more.

I know Shoei do their own flip front but are there any other options in a similar price range. The internal sun-visor doesn't bother me as I wear variable tint glasses (not so I can see where I'm going but to read the speedo!)
Thanks

 

[Andy B]

Everyone to their own, but if you've had a Shoei and like it, and they suit your shape of head, you may find the Multitec is the answer but don't expect any flip to be as quiet as your Raid! Certainly, after my experience, Multitec is exactly where I am going. BMW has now refunded my money and its just a matter of deciding what colour!

There are loads of makes. Go here for a comparison of how they shape up crash-wise.

In the West Mids it does seem that the most popular flip used by paramedics and police is the Shoei. I guess they live in them so they should know.

 

[snerkler]

I recently bought a System 6 helmet to replace my Shoei Raid. Initial impressions are good, though I haven't ridden in the rain to test leakage or poured water over it.

I did find my glasses were steaming up with the visor down when the bike was static so I have fitted the lighter-weight chin guard extension which is slightly better, but I may remove it. The integrated sun visor works well - I've used it half down a couple of times to combat the sun when its low in the sky and it does help.

The System 6 seems quieter than the Shoei for urban riding... I've yet to try it at speed, and there is enough room round the ears so that is no excess pressure when I'm wearing earplugs.

As I got a discount from my local dealer it worked out about the same as a Shoie Raid 2.

My only gripe is that getting the helmet off is uncomfortable - as this is the first System helmet I've owned not sure if there is a special technique involved. Should the helmet come off forwards(reverse of putting on) or backwards?

I'm assuming you flip the front first before trying to take it off?

 

[CaptainSlow]

Everyone to their own, but if you've had a Shoei and like it, and they suit your shape of head, you may find the Multitec is the answer but don't expect any flip to be as quiet as your Raid! Certainly, after my experience, Multitec is exactly where I am going. BMW has now refunded my money and its just a matter of deciding what colour!

There are loads of makes. Go here for a comparison of how they shape up crash-wise.

In the West Mids it does seem that the most popular flip used by paramedics and police is the Shoei. I guess they live in them so they should know.

Thanks I've looked at the Sharp site before and can't work out why the Caberg Trip at £99 gets a five star rating as the BMW System 5 (I know it's been replaced now) which costs three times as much. I intend anyway to take my time as I will have to wait for the insurance to cough up for the new lid and to put right the £1600 damage I did to the GS by slinging it into the undergrowth (not to mention the time for my bruises to stop hurting - have you noticed how hard it is to wipe your bum with a bruised thumb and bruised ribs?).

Oh for the days when a Stadium Project 6 cost £9 from my mum's catalogue

 

[RILLOM]

Everyone to their own, but if you've had a Shoei and like it, and they suit your shape of head, you may find the Multitec is the answer but don't expect any flip to be as quiet as your Raid! Certainly, after my experience, Multitec is exactly where I am going. BMW has now refunded my money and its just a matter of deciding what colour!

There are loads of makes. Go here for a comparison of how they shape up crash-wise.

In the West Mids it does seem that the most popular flip used by paramedics and police is the Shoei. I guess they live in them so they should know.

Suggest you be a little careful regarding the SHARP rating - not sure of the details, but I understand the testing has been questioned as to its 'suitability' etc

 

[nickp]

HI,
From what I can gather the Shuberth C3 is nearly Identical to the System 6, although apparantly the C3 feels better quality and the flip fits better. Any opinions on this?

Used to think the same, but it seems even the shell is a different shape, discovered this last week, having just fitted a BMW bluetooth into a C3, not fussy on the Shuberth system, i.e. using the collar to fit the controls to. Having owned a C2 and system 5, a C3 and giving the System 6 a good look over I would say the Shuberth is slightly better quality. Also own an S1 pro and J1, so you could say I like Shuberth. But ultimately the most important bit is the one that fits your head best..

P.s. very impressed with the bluetooth so far, but it's early days yet, took out an Autocom to fit this..

 

[Greybeard]

I'm assuming you flip the front first before trying to take it off?

er, yes! Maybe I just have big ears...

 

[skinnersscotch]

Has anyone noticed the visor vibrating on a System 6 when it is open or partically open?

 

[casperghst42]

I've had a C3 for more than a year, and eventhough it's very comfy (if not heavy), it leaks. I've had it in for ajustments (got a new visor), it still leaks. It's noisy, and the visor opens almost a full inch at it lowest setting.

But it's still a nice helmet....

I've been looking at the System 6, but now with people saying that it got the same issues as the C3... well I think I'll keep it another year.


Casper